Hapless Bills Fan Posted April 21, 2020 Author Posted April 21, 2020 4 hours ago, BillsFan4 said: I don’t get what this reopening plan is even based on. I don’t see how Georgia meets the federal govt’s gating criteria to move to phase one (though I’m guessing the federal govt. must agree because they haven’t protested georgia’s plan and they said they would if they thought a state was trying to open before it was ready). https://assets.documentcloud.org/documents/6840714/Guidelines.pdf (gating criteria) Their covid cases aren’t trending down (I believe they’re actually still trending up), they aren’t able to do the widespread testing the plan talked about. They don’t have widespread antibody testing. They don’t have any tracing or screening in place that I’m aware of. Do they have those sentinel sites screening asymptomatic people and contact tracing the plan talks about? Do they have the PPE stockpiles it calls for? (I’d be somewhat surprised if they do with the shortages being faced by most of the country, but who knows). How are they going to protect the workers being asked to go back? Do they have some way for these businesses to purchase/acquire n95 masks for their workers (assuming healthcare workers in the state already have an ample supply)? So many questions... Also, some of the stuff that’s opening was surprising. How do you social distance while giving a tattoo or cutting hair, or even serving food? A waitress has to bring the food to the table. They have to go into the kitchen w/the cook(s). Plus, customers can’t eat their food with masks on. While you can maybe social distance in a movie theatre, it’s still shared indoor air space. One sick person coughs during that movie and those airborne virus particles could spread throughout the whole theatre. You could see this coming though. I knew states would start opening back up as soon as that federal plan was released and they said 29 states were about ready to open within the next few days. You know some governors were just itching to reopen. It sounds like a number of mayors are fighting the plans to reopen. I’ve read comments from quite a few that are not at all happy. Your mayor in Atlanta blasted this plan. The mayor in savannah is asking businesses to ignore this plan and remain closed. https://www.politico.com/news/2020/04/21/atlanta-mayor-blindsided-georgia-governor-reopening-state-197937 https://www.wsav.com/news/local-news/in-my-mind-this-is-reckless-mayor-van-johnson-reacts-to-governors-decision-to-allow-some-businesses-to-reopen/ https://www.wjcl.com/article/watch-live-savannah-mayor-addresses-response-to-coronavirus/32222105 whatever ends up happening with this reopening, try to stay safe friend! A friend living outside Atlanta is a (currently non-practicing) physician with ties to ER and critical-care physicians in Atlanta hospitals and she says they report they are still slammed, slammed, slammed and it's all covid-19. They have some capacity but it's getting slimmer and slimmer. And yes, as far as I know, they don't meet the criteria. What I don't understand is why the governor wouldn't discuss the reopening with the mayors of his major cities before announcing it, and ideally adjust for their input. Even if they disagree and he decides to go ahead for {reasons}, DISCUSS! 9 hours ago, plenzmd1 said: @Hapless Bills Fan, care to weigh on on this odious issue? https://nypost.com/2020/04/20/can-the-coronavirus-be-spread-through-farts/ My viewpoint is it's not a good time to visit a nudist club with a pan full of baked-bean casserole 1 1 1
BillsFan4 Posted April 21, 2020 Posted April 21, 2020 Quote A malaria drug.... showed no benefit in a large analysis of its use in U.S. veterans hospitals. There were more deaths among those given hydroxychloroquine versus standard care, researchers reported. The nationwide study was not a rigorous experiment. But with 368 patients, it’s the largest look so far of hydroxychloroquine with or without the antibiotic azithromycin for COVID-19, which has killed more than 171,000 people as of Tuesday. The study was posted on an online site for researchers and has been submitted to the New England Journal of Medicine, but has not been reviewed by other scientists. Grants from the National Institutes of Health and the University of Virginia paid for the work. Quote Researchers analyzed medical records of 368 male veterans hospitalized with confirmed coronavirus infection at Veterans Health Administration medical centers who died or were discharged by April 11. About 28% who were given hydroxychloroquine plus usual care died, versus 11% of those getting routine care alone. About 22% of those getting the drug plus azithromycin died too, but the difference between that group and usual care was not considered large enough to rule out other factors that could have affected survival. Hydroxychloroquine made no difference in the need for a breathing machine, either. Researchers did not track side effects, but noted hints that hydroxychloroquine might have damaged other organs. The drug has long been known to have potentially serious side effects, including altering the heartbeat in a way that could lead to sudden death.
Cripple Creek Posted April 21, 2020 Posted April 21, 2020 Why? Because HOA, that's why! https://www.foxnews.com/us/nj-homeowners-association-denies-request-to-allow-physicians-assistant-to-isolate-in-rv-near-family
Augie Posted April 21, 2020 Posted April 21, 2020 18 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: Kind of hard to obtain a socially distant haircut and style, as well Don’t forget massage parlors! Krafty considers them essential! Why not open in and out retail places with natural distancing? Bed Bath & Beyond, Office Depot, Barnes & Noble and Petco, etc. Are these not included? I live in Atlanta and I still don’t know if/when they will open. They are a move back towards “normal”. It seems they are making a point of opening the worst possible places that have the least affect on the economy. Bowling alleys? Really? Bars where people all hang out and take turns touching the same stuff? I don’t get it......
Saxum Posted April 21, 2020 Posted April 21, 2020 5 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: My viewpoint is it's not a good time to visit a nudist club with a pan full of baked-bean casserole That is not something I wanted to envision. 2 hours ago, Cripple Creek said: Why? Because HOA, that's why! https://www.foxnews.com/us/nj-homeowners-association-denies-request-to-allow-physicians-assistant-to-isolate-in-rv-near-family The Governor should pass emergency degree making rejection of such people illegal.
K-9 Posted April 21, 2020 Posted April 21, 2020 5 hours ago, BillsFan4 said: I don’t get what this reopening plan is even based on. I don’t see how Georgia meets the federal govt’s gating criteria to move to phase one (though I’m guessing the federal govt. must agree because they haven’t protested georgia’s plan and they said they would if they thought a state was trying to open before it was ready). https://assets.documentcloud.org/documents/6840714/Guidelines.pdf (gating criteria) Their covid cases aren’t trending down (I believe they’re actually still trending up), they aren’t able to do the widespread testing the plan talked about. They don’t have widespread antibody testing. They don’t have any tracing or screening in place that I’m aware of. Do they have those sentinel sites screening asymptomatic people and contact tracing the plan talks about? Do they have the PPE stockpiles it calls for? (I’d be somewhat surprised if they do with the shortages being faced by most of the country, but who knows). How are they going to protect the workers being asked to go back? Do they have some way for these businesses to purchase/acquire n95 masks for their workers (assuming healthcare workers in the state already have an ample supply)? So many questions... Also, some of the stuff that’s opening was surprising. How do you social distance while giving a tattoo or cutting hair, or even serving food? A waitress has to bring the food to the table. They have to go into the kitchen w/the cook(s). Plus, customers can’t eat their food with masks on. While you can maybe social distance in a movie theatre, it’s still shared indoor air space. One sick person coughs during that movie and those airborne virus particles could spread throughout the whole theatre. You could see this coming though. I knew states would start opening back up as soon as that federal plan was released and they said 29 states were about ready to open within the next few days. You know some governors were just itching to reopen. It sounds like a number of mayors are fighting the plans to reopen. I’ve read comments from quite a few that are not at all happy. Your mayor in Atlanta blasted this plan. The mayor in savannah is asking businesses to ignore this plan and remain closed. https://www.politico.com/news/2020/04/21/atlanta-mayor-blindsided-georgia-governor-reopening-state-197937 https://www.wsav.com/news/local-news/in-my-mind-this-is-reckless-mayor-van-johnson-reacts-to-governors-decision-to-allow-some-businesses-to-reopen/ https://www.wjcl.com/article/watch-live-savannah-mayor-addresses-response-to-coronavirus/32222105 whatever ends up happening with this reopening, try to stay safe friend! Georgia DOESN'T meet phase one of the re-opening guidelines. That just underscores how feckless these “guidelines” are.
SlimShady'sSpaceForce Posted April 22, 2020 Posted April 22, 2020 What’s more important Infrastructure and technology or hair salons and tattoo parlors?
SlimShady'sSpaceForce Posted April 22, 2020 Posted April 22, 2020 (edited) Western New York police mark 4/20 by telling stoners to stay home and watch 'Super Troopers'. https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment/police-department-recommends-weed-smokers-watch-super-troopers-on-420-211604642.html Edited April 22, 2020 by SlimShady'sSpaceForce 1
Jrb1979 Posted April 22, 2020 Posted April 22, 2020 What's the point of setting up guidelines if every state is going to do what they want?
SlimShady'sSpaceForce Posted April 22, 2020 Posted April 22, 2020 1 hour ago, Jrb1979 said: What's the point of setting up guidelines if every state is going to do what they want? because IIRC the President said it was up to the states to decide on how to reopen.
SlimShady'sSpaceForce Posted April 22, 2020 Posted April 22, 2020 (edited) https://www.yahoo.com/news/more-deaths-no-benefit-malaria-160619592.html The nationwide study was not a rigorous experiment. But with 368 patients, it’s the largest look so far of hydroxychloroquine with or without the antibiotic azithromycin for COVID-19, which has killed more than 171,000 people as of Tuesday. Researchers analyzed medical records of 368 male veterans hospitalized with confirmed coronavirus infection at Veterans Health Administration medical centers who died or were discharged by April 11. About 28% who were given hydroxychloroquine plus usual care died, versus 11% of those getting routine care alone. Edited April 22, 2020 by SlimShady'sSpaceForce 1
Hapless Bills Fan Posted April 22, 2020 Author Posted April 22, 2020 13 hours ago, Royale with Cheese said: I live in Atlanta and this is dumb. Im seeing people talk about it on Facebook and surprisingly, most people are against this and will continue to stay home. It hasn’t even peaked yet in Georgia and we aren’t going to practice social distancing anymore. Birx weighs in on this: https://news.yahoo.com/birx-says-georgia-residents-can-be-very-creative-about-getting-tattoos-and-haircuts-while-social-distancing-001903192.html Among the businesses that Kemp, a Republican and a strong supporter of President Trump, plans to allow to reopen on Friday are hair and nail salons and tattoo parlors. “I believe people in Atlanta would understand that if their cases are not going down that they need to continue to do everything that we said — social distancing, washing your hands, wearing a mask in public — so if there’s a way that people can social distance and do those things, then they can do those things. I don’t know how, but people are very creative,” Birx said. Birx sounds like a public servant who is floundering to explain the implicit impossibilities and contradictions that indicate Atlanta's governor just may have thrown common sense out the window here. I don't care how creative you are, you can't social distance while getting a haircut, a manicure, a massage, or a tattoo. Can not be done. You can wear masks and gloves; the business owner can sanitize surfaces and make handwashing available. But fundamentally, none of these things are 1) essential 2) possible to do while social distancing. Birx has to know this. She's been placed in a ridiculous position having to rationalize this. 2
Augie Posted April 22, 2020 Posted April 22, 2020 4 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: Birx weighs in on this: https://news.yahoo.com/birx-says-georgia-residents-can-be-very-creative-about-getting-tattoos-and-haircuts-while-social-distancing-001903192.html Among the businesses that Kemp, a Republican and a strong supporter of President Trump, plans to allow to reopen on Friday are hair and nail salons and tattoo parlors. “I believe people in Atlanta would understand that if their cases are not going down that they need to continue to do everything that we said — social distancing, washing your hands, wearing a mask in public — so if there’s a way that people can social distance and do those things, then they can do those things. I don’t know how, but people are very creative,” Birx said. Birx sounds like a public servant who is floundering to explain the implicit impossibilities and contradictions that indicate Atlanta's governor just may have thrown common sense out the window here. I don't care how creative you are, you can't social distance while getting a haircut, a manicure, a massage, or a tattoo. Can not be done. You can wear masks and gloves; the business owner can sanitize surfaces and make handwashing available. But fundamentally, none of these things are 1) essential 2) possible to do while social distancing. Birx has to know this. She's been placed in a ridiculous position having to rationalize this. It seems she is willing to live in that existence, which may be why we see less and less of Dr Fauci.
Warcodered Posted April 22, 2020 Posted April 22, 2020 7 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: Birx weighs in on this: https://news.yahoo.com/birx-says-georgia-residents-can-be-very-creative-about-getting-tattoos-and-haircuts-while-social-distancing-001903192.html Among the businesses that Kemp, a Republican and a strong supporter of President Trump, plans to allow to reopen on Friday are hair and nail salons and tattoo parlors. “I believe people in Atlanta would understand that if their cases are not going down that they need to continue to do everything that we said — social distancing, washing your hands, wearing a mask in public — so if there’s a way that people can social distance and do those things, then they can do those things. I don’t know how, but people are very creative,” Birx said. Birx sounds like a public servant who is floundering to explain the implicit impossibilities and contradictions that indicate Atlanta's governor just may have thrown common sense out the window here. I don't care how creative you are, you can't social distance while getting a haircut, a manicure, a massage, or a tattoo. Can not be done. You can wear masks and gloves; the business owner can sanitize surfaces and make handwashing available. But fundamentally, none of these things are 1) essential 2) possible to do while social distancing. Birx has to know this. She's been placed in a ridiculous position having to rationalize this. I think I'd prefer to shave my head.
Hapless Bills Fan Posted April 22, 2020 Author Posted April 22, 2020 1 hour ago, SlimShady'sSpaceForce said: https://www.yahoo.com/news/more-deaths-no-benefit-malaria-160619592.html The nationwide study was not a rigorous experiment. But with 368 patients, it’s the largest look so far of hydroxychloroquine with or without the antibiotic azithromycin for COVID-19, which has killed more than 171,000 people as of Tuesday. Researchers analyzed medical records of 368 male veterans hospitalized with confirmed coronavirus infection at Veterans Health Administration medical centers who died or were discharged by April 11. About 28% who were given hydroxychloroquine plus usual care died, versus 11% of those getting routine care alone. Just a note that the preprint of the actual article, as well as the original AP reports this one quotes, are posted in the "Facts Only" thread. For those who prefer the primary source and the original report on it.
Hapless Bills Fan Posted April 22, 2020 Author Posted April 22, 2020 Washington Governor apparently agrees with Cuomo and Hogan that knowing the name, address, and phone number of labs with test equipment is not the problem here: Inslee said the biggest hurdle is testing kit supplies. "This is a huge frustration for all of us." The state is running ~4,500 tests per day, even though it has analysis capacity for ~13K. Inslee said the state will need more testing after the "transition" than before. — GeekWire (@geekwire) April 15, 2020 Just me, or did he kind of put the "Home Base" of the CDC on "Blast" a bit? “We’ve been making decisions based on science and data in our state and it has served us very well. We are a very technologically-oriented state,” Inslee said during a news conference. “I think that’s one of the reasons we’ve had considerable success bending the curve down now.” Anyway, he's got a plan: https://www.geekwire.com/2020/washington-plans-1500-person-contact-tracing-team-governor-outlines-re-opening-strategy/ #testtraceisolate
Augie Posted April 22, 2020 Posted April 22, 2020 Haircuts, massage parlors, bowling alleys and tattoo parlors? Is he that stupid, or might he be trying to thin the herd a bit in Georgia? Hardly the backbone of our economy. 1
Hapless Bills Fan Posted April 22, 2020 Author Posted April 22, 2020 14 hours ago, SlimShady'sSpaceForce said: because IIRC the President said it was up to the states to decide on how to reopen. But I thought he said they would supervise and push back on states that reopened without meeting the guidelines? 1 1
K-9 Posted April 22, 2020 Posted April 22, 2020 34 minutes ago, Augie said: Haircuts, massage parlors, bowling alleys and tattoo parlors? Is he that stupid, or might he be trying to thin the herd a bit in Georgia? Hardly the backbone of our economy. There has been more than a bit of applied shock doctrine going on for a weeks now so, per the bold text, that kind of measured calculus wouldn’t surprise me one bit given all the data about the hardest hit demographics. My hope is that people will listen more to the scientists than the politicians. Polling suggests we will.
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