njbuff Posted March 3, 2020 Posted March 3, 2020 The Bills talked about adding another QB. The Bills have had extensive talks with Lamb and Jeudy. Makes me wonder if the Bills and Jags have something worked out about acquiring Foles and a swap of first rounders (for starters). If I am the Bills, I’d hold out for more, as the Bills have ALL the leverage here. Where there is smoke, there is fire. ?
BillsFan17 Posted March 3, 2020 Posted March 3, 2020 35 minutes ago, njbuff said: The Bills talked about adding another QB. The Bills have had extensive talks with Lamb and Jeudy. Makes me wonder if the Bills and Jags have something worked out about acquiring Foles and a swap of first rounders (for starters). If I am the Bills, I’d hold out for more, as the Bills have ALL the leverage here. Where there is smoke, there is fire. ? Now, that would be some very interesting maneuvering!! Do you think they would be inclined to give up the higher of their two first rounders tho? Especially considering the saving to their cap isnt all that much, if I'm not mistaken.
DCOrange Posted March 3, 2020 Posted March 3, 2020 46 minutes ago, njbuff said: The Bills talked about adding another QB. The Bills have had extensive talks with Lamb and Jeudy. Makes me wonder if the Bills and Jags have something worked out about acquiring Foles and a swap of first rounders (for starters). If I am the Bills, I’d hold out for more, as the Bills have ALL the leverage here. Where there is smoke, there is fire. ? I just can't imagine the Jaguars would move down from #9 to #22 just for a couple million dollars in cap space. I think people have gone way off the deep end regarding all these ideas of teams attaching high value draft picks to players to move them.
BillsFan17 Posted March 3, 2020 Posted March 3, 2020 Just now, DCOrange said: I just can't imagine the Jaguars would move down from #9 to #22 just for a couple million dollars in cap space. I think people have gone way off the deep end regarding all these ideas of teams attaching high value draft picks to players to move them. Maybe not the ninth overall, but possibly the 20th overall which they hold as well. Which, could make Beane feel like he has more maneuverability to get around. The way he did after swapping firsts with the Bengals (the Cordy Glenn trade). And truth be told, I'd much prefer Foles to Barkley in a pinch.
DCOrange Posted March 3, 2020 Posted March 3, 2020 3 minutes ago, BillsFan17 said: Maybe not the ninth overall, but possibly the 20th overall which they hold as well. Which, could make Beane feel like he has more maneuverability to get around. The way he did after swapping firsts with the Bengals (the Cordy Glenn trade). And truth be told, I'd much prefer Foles to Barkley in a pinch. Foles + 20 for 22 is possible. The 9th pick is not. To move from 22 to 9 would cost roughly #22, plus a 2nd round pick, plus a 3rd round pick, maybe more. There's no way they view gaining like $3 million in cap space as being worth all of that. 1
Reed83HOF Posted March 4, 2020 Posted March 4, 2020 3 hours ago, DCOrange said: Foles + 20 for 22 is possible. The 9th pick is not. To move from 22 to 9 would cost roughly #22, plus a 2nd round pick, plus a 3rd round pick, maybe more. There's no way they view gaining like $3 million in cap space as being worth all of that. It's only 3 million this year and the rest of the contract is gone next year. It also eliminates any divide in the locker room if minshew under performs
2ForMacAdoo Posted March 4, 2020 Posted March 4, 2020 On 3/2/2020 at 9:06 PM, BillsFan2313 said: Jeudy is the only one worth trading up for IMO Agreed. The 2 questions are: 1) at what cost? Under no circumstance am I giving up a 1st rounder in 2021. Most is a 1st, 2nd and perhaps 5th THIS year. 2) How far does that get us? From 22 to 10? From 22 to 15?
Locomark Posted March 4, 2020 Posted March 4, 2020 On 3/2/2020 at 10:57 AM, Putin said: I believe both will be gone before our pick at 22 Genius
Locomark Posted March 4, 2020 Posted March 4, 2020 (edited) On 3/2/2020 at 7:46 PM, elltrain22 said: What I've been predicting. They moved up for Allen and Edmunds. We have to maximize our roster while Allen is on his rookie deal. If we solidify our pass rush via FA, you can bet Beane will try to move up to get Jeudy, Lamb, or even Ruggs They can easily move up to 11-14 to get one of them with the Bevy of QB and OL that will be going early. It will just take the 2nd rounder. It all requires us to sign a quality edge or OL in FA to want to give up that other premium pick. Something I would do for a top WR1 at a cheap cost control for 5 years. One of those 3 should be there before Denver picks. Edited March 4, 2020 by Locomark
Locomark Posted March 4, 2020 Posted March 4, 2020 31 minutes ago, 2ForMacAdoo said: Agreed. The 2 questions are: 1) at what cost? Under no circumstance am I giving up a 1st rounder in 2021. Most is a 1st, 2nd and perhaps 5th THIS year. 2) How far does that get us? From 22 to 10? From 22 to 15? Totally 100% disagree that Jeudy is the only trade up worth it. The value chart says you can get to 13 with giving up 22+2nd rounder only. If we snag our OT and DE in FA, why not? PFF compares...... JERRY JEUDY: ODELL BECKHAM JR. Jeudy’s testing numbers at the Combine didn’t really do justice to the way he moves on the football field — and neither did Beckham’s. They are both such sudden route runners with a level of body control few are capable of achieving. Don’t overthink the Alabama wideout. CEEDEE LAMB: DEANDRE HOPKINS Both Lamb and Hopkins have ball skills that are as good as it gets for the position. It’s not only the highlight-reel catches, but also the way they attack the ball in contested situations. Then, with the ball in their hands, both are likely to make multiple defenders miss on any given play. Hopkins had a little more strength coming out, while Lamb probably has a little more speed. HENRY RUGGS: SANTANA MOSS Moss was a blur coming out of Miami back in the day. Even surrounded by speed, Moss always looked like he was playing in fast forward. He went on to have multiple 1,000-yard seasons for the Jets and Redskins, but his skill set was one that’s only grown in value as passing offenses have evolved. The speed at 4.3 — or in Ruggs’ case, sub-4.3 — plays at any level when it comes paired with legit hands like both possess. Do you really think we will get one of these 3 comparables in the 2nd or 3rd round ??? Only we we get lucky! 1
BillsFan2313 Posted March 4, 2020 Posted March 4, 2020 7 hours ago, 2ForMacAdoo said: Agreed. The 2 questions are: 1) at what cost? Under no circumstance am I giving up a 1st rounder in 2021. Most is a 1st, 2nd and perhaps 5th THIS year. 2) How far does that get us? From 22 to 10? From 22 to 15? We definitely would have to get to 10, as I believe Oakland will take Jeudy at 12. If you go buy a trade last year. Steelers moved up from 20 to 10. Swapped firsts, gave a 2nd round pick and 3rd this year. I would do swap of firsts, 2nd and a 2nd next year. With the two 5th round picks. Beane has some ammo to get back in the 2nd or even the 3rd, if he chooses.
BillsFan17 Posted March 4, 2020 Posted March 4, 2020 7 hours ago, Locomark said: Totally 100% disagree that Jeudy is the only trade up worth it. The value chart says you can get to 13 with giving up 22+2nd rounder only. If we snag our OT and DE in FA, why not? PFF compares...... JERRY JEUDY: ODELL BECKHAM JR. Jeudy’s testing numbers at the Combine didn’t really do justice to the way he moves on the football field — and neither did Beckham’s. They are both such sudden route runners with a level of body control few are capable of achieving. Don’t overthink the Alabama wideout. CEEDEE LAMB: DEANDRE HOPKINS Both Lamb and Hopkins have ball skills that are as good as it gets for the position. It’s not only the highlight-reel catches, but also the way they attack the ball in contested situations. Then, with the ball in their hands, both are likely to make multiple defenders miss on any given play. Hopkins had a little more strength coming out, while Lamb probably has a little more speed. HENRY RUGGS: SANTANA MOSS Moss was a blur coming out of Miami back in the day. Even surrounded by speed, Moss always looked like he was playing in fast forward. He went on to have multiple 1,000-yard seasons for the Jets and Redskins, but his skill set was one that’s only grown in value as passing offenses have evolved. The speed at 4.3 — or in Ruggs’ case, sub-4.3 — plays at any level when it comes paired with legit hands like both possess. Do you really think we will get one of these 3 comparables in the 2nd or 3rd round ??? Only we we get lucky! Some of the best WRs in the league were drafted outside of the first round, so yes. Especially in a very deep class.
DCOrange Posted March 4, 2020 Posted March 4, 2020 (edited) 8 hours ago, 2ForMacAdoo said: Agreed. The 2 questions are: 1) at what cost? Under no circumstance am I giving up a 1st rounder in 2021. Most is a 1st, 2nd and perhaps 5th THIS year. 2) How far does that get us? From 22 to 10? From 22 to 15? Unless Jeudy slides a lot, a 1, 2, and 5 probably won't get us high enough. It would probably cost a 1, 2, and 3 to get up to 10. Turn the 2 into a future 2 instead and now you're probably talking around 14ish. 1, 2, and 5 might get you up around 15 if you get lucky but I doubt it and I doubt Jeudy is available there anyways. Edit: I think the trade charts would say 1, 2, and 5 is enough, but in reality, I don't think that would be the case. Pittsburgh moved from 20 to 10 last year with their 1, 2, and 3 for example. Edited March 4, 2020 by DCOrange
GunnerBill Posted March 4, 2020 Posted March 4, 2020 4 minutes ago, DCOrange said: Unless Jeudy slides a lot, a 1, 2, and 5 probably won't get us high enough. It would probably cost a 1, 2, and 3 to get up to 10. Turn the 2 into a future 2 instead and now you're probably talking around 14ish. 1, 2, and 5 might get you up around 15 if you get lucky but I doubt it and I doubt Jeudy is available there anyways. I think my strategy is hope one of the three slides to #16 and then try and do the deal with Atlanta who you might even get to move back for a cheaper price because they desperately need cheap labour (ie. extra picks) given their cap situation. 2
Lurker Posted March 4, 2020 Posted March 4, 2020 13 minutes ago, DCOrange said: Unless Jeudy slides a lot, a 1, 2, and 5 probably won't get us high enough. It would probably cost a 1, 2, and 3 to get up to 10. Turn the 2 into a future 2 instead and now you're probably talking around 14ish. 1, 2, and 5 might get you up around 15 if you get lucky but I doubt it and I doubt Jeudy is available there anyways. Edit: I think the trade charts would say 1, 2, and 5 is enough, but in reality, I don't think that would be the case. Pittsburgh moved from 20 to 10 last year with their 1, 2, and 3 for example. If they have to go all the way up to #10, then they should pass and possibly even look at trading down a bit, to pick up additional top 100 picks. OTOH, moving up to the #14 to #16 range seems like a reasonable trade off of draft capital for top end talent. The Edmonds deal two years ago is the template for this kind of move...
BillsFan2313 Posted March 4, 2020 Posted March 4, 2020 1 hour ago, GunnerBill said: I think my strategy is hope one of the three slides to #16 and then try and do the deal with Atlanta who you might even get to move back for a cheaper price because they desperately need cheap labour (ie. extra picks) given their cap situation. Why do you put Ruggs in the same class as Jeudy and Lamb? Just wondering. He was the 3rd best receiver on his team. Has 86 catches and 1500 yards total the last two years combined, with Tua. His "tape" doesn't overly impress either. Just wondering what people are seeing in Ruggs, that I'm not.
BillsFan17 Posted March 4, 2020 Posted March 4, 2020 2 minutes ago, BillsFan2313 said: Why do you put Ruggs in the same class as Jeudy and Lamb? Just wondering. He was the 3rd best receiver on his team. Has 86 catches and 1500 yards total the last two years combined, with Tua. His "tape" doesn't overly impress either. Just wondering what people are seeing in Ruggs, that I'm not. If you arent impressed with his "tape" then there isnt much anyone is going to be able to help ya with. Because if Ruggs doesnt impress you, you probably aren't watching his tape or have any idea what it is you are looking at. 1
Hapless Bills Fan Posted March 4, 2020 Posted March 4, 2020 20 hours ago, Putin said: I don’t believe McBean will give up so much ammunition to move anywhere near the top 10 , ( for a WR ) maybe if one of them drops to let’s say 15 then I ca see a similar move like he did with Edmunds , I just can’t see McBean trading the farm for a rookie WR ( just my opinion) I kind of feel it's not just your opinion, it's stuff Beane has either explicitly said or implied pretty strongly. He said stuff about "not going to trade all our draft picks for a WR or anything crazy like that" and (at the Sr Bowl) "there are definitely some guys here who can help us" (may be significant because Lamb and Jeudy are both juniors?) I agree with you that Beane has shown he is not opposed to using draft picks to move around the board a handful of slots - 5-7 - if there's a player dropping who they consider exceptional value. But if he's going to do a splash trade up IMO it's more likely to happen for Edge than for WR
BillsFan2313 Posted March 4, 2020 Posted March 4, 2020 4 minutes ago, BillsFan17 said: If you arent impressed with his "tape" then there isnt much anyone is going to be able to help ya with. Because if Ruggs doesnt impress you, you probably aren't watching his tape or have any idea what it is you are looking at. Very mature answer. You seem like a gem to be around. 2
BillsVet Posted March 4, 2020 Posted March 4, 2020 2 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: I kind of feel it's not just your opinion, it's stuff Beane has either explicitly said or implied pretty strongly. He said stuff about "not going to trade all our draft picks for a WR or anything crazy like that" and (at the Sr Bowl) "there are definitely some guys here who can help us" (may be significant because Lamb and Jeudy are both juniors?) They need elite play-makers on offense and I would also note Beane's end of season presser about how one loses the final game of the season. The difference against Houston was they had a guy like DeAndre Hopkins and Buffalo didn't. Buffalo's passing game needs an elite receiver. This is the draft to get one, although it will cost them. Combine that with added urgency in year 4 of the rebuild and I can see them moving up, provided McD doesn't insist on a DE or CB, for someone to help Allen out. Besides, they're not going to find one in UFA/via trade nor would they spend the money. I really think this off-season comes down to how Buffalo gives Allen more weapons in the passing game. After all, they did get down the road with Pittsburgh on Antonio Brown last year. If they decide to (again) go defense in the first and try to fill the WR position with more depth types who'll take time to develop it's going to be no better than an average offense. 1
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