My opinion about Josh Allen

[Lurker]

The truth will set you free...

[Hapless Bills Fan]

1 hour ago, The Jokeman said:

I hate to say it but teaching a quick release is almost impossible as that has to deal with changing how quickly a QB can read a defense or gain confidence in throwing to a spot vs a player. Sadly I think Josh never learned the skill of throwing a receiver open in part because with his great arm he can get it there so quick he doesn't have to. So he might never learn this skill but hopefully he can play more like he did against Dallas than say against Houston to play to his best. 

 

One big difference between Dallas and Houston was the amount of time Allen had to throw.

 

A component of that was Houston in the 2nd half (from what I saw, I haven't gone back and assessed each pass play) adopting the NE blitz approach where when a guy is blocked, he drops back into coverage - but they're showing enough rushers to wind up with a TE or RB being assigned to block a really good pass rushing TE or LB.

 

You're right that Allen never learned to throw with anticipation, but that's not really what the quick release is about.  Part of it is on Josh - he will have checkdowns to Motor available he doesn't take - part of it is on the receivers who don't always recognize the need to modify their routes and look early.

 

[JinxedBill]

[BuffaLoko]

1 hour ago, ALF said:

Needs a quick release like Brady with short patterns if facing too much pressure. That's why a extra OT or G at the TE position or at FB to give Allen more protection.

Agree 100%, we can´t say JA´s best game is when he launches and run, until we have a solid and stable OL to protect him, if I recall correct more than half his runs are because the pocket collapses the first second and he needs to run away, my two cents....

[Bangarang]

I like ketchup on my steak. Fight me

[Mr. WEO]

for when "hear me out" just won't suffice...

[MJS]

I think I have a different definition for "truth".

[loveorhatembillsfan4life]

It’s ok he’s a runner because he is quite good at it! He needs to just learn to slide and hang onto the ball.

 

But regardless teams have to account for it! 

[T master]

2 hours ago, zow2 said:

Great team leader, great guy...BUT, he has to be a runner to be an effective QB.  Kind of Cam Newton-ish.  
 

The Bills are not using him properly if they think he’s going to stand back there, scan the field like Brady or Matt Ryan, and shred opposing defenses.  I think Daboll started to get it right after those first few games last season where he was planted in the pocket.  Josh better figure out how he can best stay healthy while still running around and making plays. That’s his game.

 

There have been a lot of QB's that come into the league like Josh that have been decent have strong arms but lack in some areas as said about Josh's accuracy & never lived up to their draft status as franchise QB's such as Jake Locker, EJ, Mariotta, & many more which leads me to this question .

 

Given what Beane has done to this point & seeing his over all seemingly great player evaluation from him & his team of scouts, if a really good QB is there at a later round Bills pick & he is Beane's BPA at that pick do you think he would take a QB with that pick ?

 

If there is 1 thing we have observed over the past 15 + years is the Pats most generally always have a fairly good QB prospect waiting in the wings & Beane being as sharp as he is do you think he may take a bit of past wisdom from what Bellichek has laid out from being the team to beat for so long ? 

 

Even with Josh being his pick to lead the team into the future &  being the face of the franchise given all that he brings to the field could Beane grab a security blanket if they are there for the taking at the time the Bills have a pick ? 

 

I love Josh & the excitement that he has brought to the Bills but he (From what the "Experts" have said) coming out had some issues & i believe that the way he is built will work to correct his short comings but i would think it could be beneficial to have a good back up plan just incase ... Or will they live & die by their choice ?

[Seasons1992]

1 hour ago, Lurker said:

The truth will set you free...

 

 

[mjt328]

3 hours ago, zow2 said:

Great team leader, great guy...BUT, he has to be a runner to be an effective QB.  Kind of Cam Newton-ish.  
 

The Bills are not using him properly if they think he’s going to stand back there, scan the field like Brady or Matt Ryan, and shred opposing defenses.  I think Daboll started to get it right after those first few games last season where he was planted in the pocket.  Josh better figure out how he can best stay healthy while still running around and making plays. That’s his game.

 

I don't believe the Bills want Josh Allen to become Cam Newton, because that playing style has literally destroyed his body. 

While other QBs are still going strong after 15 years in the NFL, Newton looks done after about 7-8.  That's the longevity of a running back.

 

I believe their ultimate vision is to mirror players like Russell Wilson and Ben Roethlisberger. 

Guys who can use their mobility to extend plays, but not as a primary weapon.

 

Consider how the Bills coaches have approached Allen's development... compared to how the Ravens have worked with Lamar Jackson.

As a rookie, Allen relied mostly on his athletic ability and running ability to make plays.  But in Year 2, the coaches pulled back on the scrambling.  They surrounded Allen with more receivers and pushed for him to stay in the pocket more.  Meanwhile, Baltimore structured their entire offense around Jackson's running skills.

 

In my opinion, Baltimore's approach is yielding more immediate success.  But long-term, Buffalo's plan will result in Allen being a better QB and for a much longer time.

 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

1 hour ago, mjt328 said:

 

I don't believe the Bills want Josh Allen to become Cam Newton, because that playing style has literally destroyed his body. 

While other QBs are still going strong after 15 years in the NFL, Newton looks done after about 7-8.  That's the longevity of a running back.

 

I believe their ultimate vision is to mirror players like Russell Wilson and Ben Roethlisberger. 

Guys who can use their mobility to extend plays, but not as a primary weapon.

 

Consider how the Bills coaches have approached Allen's development... compared to how the Ravens have worked with Lamar Jackson.

As a rookie, Allen relied mostly on his athletic ability and running ability to make plays.  But in Year 2, the coaches pulled back on the scrambling.  They surrounded Allen with more receivers and pushed for him to stay in the pocket more.  Meanwhile, Baltimore structured their entire offense around Jackson's running skills.

 

In my opinion, Baltimore's approach is yielding more immediate success.  But long-term, Buffalo's plan will result in Allen being a better QB and for a much longer time.

 

 

Good post.  I think that's exactly correct.  Before the draft, McDermott and Beane consistently said they were looking for a QB who could operate from the pocket, and Allen will either learn to operate from the pocket effectively or they will move on.  And Allen did operate well from the pocket at times this year.

 

I don't think Daboll's play design and calling have exactly mirrored what McDermott and Beane want to see long-term with some of the designed QB runs he put in, and I think Daboll probably had some cogent push-back to them about additions at offensive personnel he needs in order to put those playcalls in the back of his playbook and achieve still greater success. 

 

I do think the Bills will continue to use designed roll-outs and secondary route concepts from Run-and-Shoot.  We have to remember that when we see Allen roll out of the pocket, he is not always scrambling.  It is sometimes part of the play design.

 

[NoHuddleKelly12]

I’m just here to ask whether or not the “search” function was used prior to commencing this OP? 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

6 minutes ago, NoHuddleKelly12 said:

I’m just here to ask whether or not the “search” function was used prior to commencing this OP? 

 

No you aren't.  You already know the answer.  And it wouldn't fly this fall, but this IS the off-season.

[Kwai San]

3 hours ago, Bangarang said:

I like ketchup on my steak. Fight me

 

I too enjoy a bit of ketchup on me steak from time to time...

[NoHuddleKelly12]

9 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

No you aren't.  You already know the answer.  And it wouldn't fly this fall, but this IS the off-season.

Touché Hap. I’ll keep that in mind when the next shoulda drafted Mahomes thread drops 

2 minutes ago, Kwai San said:

 

I too enjoy a bit of ketchup on me steak from time to time...

I don’t know about all that, but every now and then mixed in with scrambled eggs actually isn’t too bad! 

[John from Riverside]

5 hours ago, H2o said:

So, what you are really saying is

Im going to steal and use this.  Please dont take offense

[Chandler#81]

5 hours ago, zow2 said:

Great team leader, great guy...BUT, he has to be a runner to be an effective QB.  Kind of Cam Newton-ish.  
 

The Bills are not using him properly if they think he’s going to stand back there, scan the field like Brady or Matt Ryan, and shred opposing defenses.  I think Daboll started to get it right after those first few games last season where he was planted in the pocket.  Josh better figure out how he can best stay healthy while still running around and making plays. That’s his game.

May I suggest for your Winter reading, this coffee table staple?

 

[Mickey]

5 hours ago, BillsVet said:

I think the truth about Josh Allen is that he's 6'5 and was a first round draft pick in 2018, 7th overall.

 

The truth is also that he'll be the starting QB to begin 2020.  And...he has a strong throwing arm. 

 

 

 

I would add that he led us to securing a playoff spot with two games to spare in only his second season in the league. I'd probably add that he was within a handful of plays of securing us a division title and first round bye but since "close" doesn't really count, I won't dwell on it.  

[Mickey]

1 hour ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Good post.  I think that's exactly correct.  Before the draft, McDermott and Beane consistently said they were looking for a QB who could operate from the pocket, and Allen will either learn to operate from the pocket effectively or they will move on.  And Allen did operate well from the pocket at times this year.

 

I don't think Daboll's play design and calling have exactly mirrored what McDermott and Beane want to see long-term with some of the designed QB runs he put in, and I think Daboll probably had some cogent push-back to them about additions at offensive personnel he needs in order to put those playcalls in the back of his playbook and achieve still greater success. 

 

I do think the Bills will continue to use designed roll-outs and secondary route concepts from Run-and-Shoot.  We have to remember that when we see Allen roll out of the pocket, he is not always scrambling.  It is sometimes part of the play design.

 

 

 I think your are right about what the Bills want out of Josh but at the same time, if he plays pretty much like he did last year with a few more long ball completions and a few less fumbles, and they are winning games and going to the playoffs, I don't think we are moving on to another QB. Reminds me of senior prom when halfway through the night I found myself holding my date's hair out of the way while she threw up in the parking lot. I would have liked to move on but it was too late to get another date so I helped her clean up and made the best of it. Its not like I was her first pick for the dance, she had been hoping some guy named John Rosen would ask her out but that never happened so I made my move. 

 

Ok, I made that last part up but the rest of it is all true.