Do we really need a power back?

[Kirby Jackson]

4 minutes ago, BarleyNY said:

I agree.  I’m far more concerned with getting a RB who can catch than I am with getting a bruiser.  If they could also be effective splitting out it’d be even better. 

This is where I’m at. I want more explosiveness. I’d much rather have a “3rd down type” with the ability to go the distance than a hammer. With Josh’s size he can be your “big back” in short yardage. 

[BarleyNY]

6 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said:

This is where I’m at. I want more explosiveness. I’d much rather have a “3rd down type” with the ability to go the distance than a hammer. With Josh’s size he can be your “big back” in short yardage. 

I agree.  I think too much gets made of big short yardage backs.  It’s not like smaller backs can’t find creases that big ones can’t.  Also I love the thought of using 21 and 22 packages with a back like that.  Defense goes big, we split out 3 or 4 wide with Singletary alone in the backfield.  If the D goes light and fast we go with a two back set and keep one or two TEs tight.  A RB like that can help put pressure on a defense. 

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

On 2/20/2020 at 2:06 PM, Victory Formation said:

I can’t count how many times I’ve seen Singletary drag 4-5 defenders on his back for an extra 4 or 5 yards. I think Singletary is a tougher runner than we think. I have no reservations whatsoever about plugging him in on the goal line. I’m not against drafting a power back but I don’t view Singletary as strictly a scat back or finesse back, he’s pretty strong. I think Singletary can get you the tough yards.

power backs are also helpful in pounding the opposition. Singletary gets tough yards, but I’m not sure he wears down a defense. 

[DCOrange]

My general opinion (can't remember if I already posted this in this thread or not): I don't really care what mold a rookie RB is; we simply need to add another talented RB to the group, with the emphasis being on them being a talented runner.

 

Allen is our short yardage back IMO and Singletary is strong enough and elusive in tight spaces to run between the tackles effectively.

 

A receiving/3rd down back can be found amongst the veteran ranks if the rookie isn't a natural fit for that role. Guys like Chris Thompson and Buck Allen are free agents now. Dion Lewis might join them soon. And guys of that mold are often found on the scrap heap in free agency. Would love for our rookie to be versatile enough to handle it but it's not a must to me.

[BuffaloBills1998]

42 minutes ago, DCOrange said:

My general opinion (can't remember if I already posted this in this thread or not): I don't really care what mold a rookie RB is; we simply need to add another talented RB to the group, with the emphasis being on them being a talented runner.

 

Allen is our short yardage back IMO and Singletary is strong enough and elusive in tight spaces to run between the tackles effectively.

 

A receiving/3rd down back can be found amongst the veteran ranks if the rookie isn't a natural fit for that role. Guys like Chris Thompson and Buck Allen are free agents now. Dion Lewis might join them soon. And guys of that mold are often found on the scrap heap in free agency. Would love for our rookie to be versatile enough to handle it but it's not a must to me.

It’s a fantasy but I wish there was a time machine so we can go back to 1973 and get OJ in his prime to play with our team. I don’t care for OJ but he was the best RB we’ve ever had besides Thurman

[Buffalo Junction]

1 hour ago, BarleyNY said:

I agree.  I’m far more concerned with getting a RB who can catch than I am with getting a bruiser.  If they could also be effective splitting out it’d be even better. 

I like Perine (gators) as far as a do everything back as he’s played in the slot too. He’s sort of a jack of all trades master of none though. Thing is... He tended to play better in big games. 

[RocCityRoller]

Is Austin Ekeler an unrestricted FA? I'm seeing mixed info. I like him a lot. If Rivers is moving on (speculated) and Henry moves on then maybe the Chargers go rebuild mode?

 

On 2/24/2020 at 12:40 PM, Buffalo Junction said:

Where are you getting “solid hands” from? He caught 20 passes in three years. I like the kid as a big back, but his catching ability is basically an unknown. There are plenty of other backs with a proven track record of being weapons in the passing game. 

 

There were a few nice snags in that video. How much passing to RBs did Boston College have? I was unaware they were an air it out type of team. Solid hands isn't great hands or even very good hands. He made some clean catches as a bigger back.

 

I'd rather have Kenyan Drake or Austin Ekeler in a do it all role at this point, but I have admittedly been a Drake fan on here for a while.

 

For me ideally I would have a mix like:

Singletary - tough runner, slippery

Drake/ Ekeler (?) - very good hands, 3rd down/ change of pace back, still a good runner

AJ Dillon type - bigger back, wear down a defense

[Buffalo Junction]

11 hours ago, RocCityRoller said:

There were a few nice snags in that video. How much passing to RBs did Boston College have? I was unaware they were an air it out type of team. Solid hands isn't great hands or even very good hands. He made some clean catches as a bigger back.

 

I'd rather have Kenyan Drake or Austin Ekeler in a do it all role at this point, but I have admittedly been a Drake fan on here for a while.

 

For me ideally I would have a mix like:

Singletary - tough runner, slippery

Drake/ Ekeler (?) - very good hands, 3rd down/ change of pace back, still a good runner

AJ Dillon type - bigger back, wear down a defense

BC ran with two power backs (Dillon & Bailey). They had 13 and 10 receptions respectively. My point was that Dillons hands are an unknown. He wasn’t asked to do it enough to make any definitive statement about his catching ability. If Beane is looking for a versatile RB there are other players that caught a lot of passes. Perine, for example, had 40 receptions last year, can line up outside and in the slot, and has experience running WR routes. I believe Cam Akers pulled in around 30 receptions this year. I have no issue with Dillon, but he’s a power back first and foremost. His hands will need to be tested because there isn’t much tape. 
 

To be fair, Singletary didn’t really have many receptions either, but the Bills basically ran him through WR workouts during their visit. If Beane is curious about Dillons hands he’ll do the same. That’s why this time of year is fun. 

[DJB]

On 2/24/2020 at 12:28 PM, thebandit27 said:

I think I might have football feelings for Darrynton Evans.

 

 

 

Yup . Underrated  for sure .  He's going to run quick in he 40. 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

On 2/20/2020 at 1:47 PM, thebandit27 said:

I think the issue is that a power back doesn’t really bring a new dimension to the offense, whereas speed does. JMO of course...

 

It seems to me that having an RB we can hand off to and count on 3-4 yds would, in fact, bring a dimension to the offense we haven't had in several years.

That's not, of course, wholly on the RB.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

On 2/24/2020 at 12:10 PM, Kirby Jackson said:

This is where I’m at. I want more explosiveness. I’d much rather have a “3rd down type” with the ability to go the distance than a hammer. With Josh’s size he can be your “big back” in short yardage. 

 

It depends, to me, upon what you mean by "short yardage".  Goal line sneak?  4th and 1?  Sure.

 

Designed runs between the tackles to gain 3-4 yds?  Those were the plays that when called for Josh, had me growling.  They often failed, and the reason seemed to me often that Josh lacked the burst and agility to follow his blockers correctly.  He is fast, but he needs time to accelerate.

 

Taking @Buffalo716 point about RB vision being something that needs development time, Josh may not have the vision for the hole in those plays, either.  I would rather he put his time into developing passing skills than RB vision.

[thebandit27]

13 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

It seems to me that having an RB we can hand off to and count on 3-4 yds would, in fact, bring a dimension to the offense we haven't had in several years.

That's not, of course, wholly on the RB.

I think that Singletary is that guy. Of course, who knows how he’ll fare when he’s facing 8+ in the box since he rarely had to do so.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

2 minutes ago, thebandit27 said:

I think that Singletary is that guy. Of course, who knows how he’ll fare when he’s facing 8+ in the box since he rarely had to do so.

 

I don't know.  The Bills refusal to use him when he was running effectively, and Gore was not, is one of the great mysteries of Bills life IMHO, along with "where are the missing screens?" and "why can't Josh see Singletary wide open on the L sideline with no one within 10 yds?" or "Hello Josh, Beasley is looking at you in a ball-catching crouch THROW IT!"

 

[Kirby Jackson]

19 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

It depends, to me, upon what you mean by "short yardage".  Goal line sneak?  4th and 1?  Sure.

 

Designed runs between the tackles to gain 3-4 yds?  Those were the plays that when called for Josh, had me growling.  They often failed, and the reason seemed to me often that Josh lacked the burst and agility to follow his blockers correctly.  He is fast, but he needs time to accelerate.

 

Taking @Buffalo716 point about RB vision being something that needs development time, Josh may not have the vision for the hole in those plays, either.  I would rather he put his time into developing passing skills than RB vision.

To me Singletary is that guy. He can consistently get those yards. He averaged 5.1 yards a carry. About half of those yards were after contact. To me he is the guy that you’ll be riding. You are going to need a guy as a backup to spell him but I don’t think it needs to be a 50/50 split.

 

I’m more interested in someone that’s different. I want a guy that can take a swing pass and go the distance. I don’t need Frank Gore to fall forward for 3. I know that I sound like a broken record but the Bills need more guys that make plays on their own. They are not consistently going to sustain 15 play drives. That’s not a winning recipe. They need more chunk plays to win. They need guys capable of making those and they don’t currently have them.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

13 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said:

To me Singletary is that guy. He can consistently get those yards. He averaged 5.1 yards a carry. About half of those yards were after contact. To me he is the guy that you’ll be riding. You are going to need a guy as a backup to spell him but I don’t think it needs to be a 50/50 split.

 

I'm not arguing that Singletary can't be that guy.  My point is seems like when 3-4 yds would have helped, we consistently turned to Gore.

A mystery, if he can do it.

 

 

[Kirby Jackson]

1 hour ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

I'm not arguing that Singletary can't be that guy.  My point is seems like when 3-4 yds would have helped, we consistently turned to Gore.

A mystery, if he can do it.

 

 

Oh the insistence of Gore was maddening at times. I think that was more stubbornness than Motor’s inability to get the job done.
 

I think Singeltary becomes about an 18-20

touch a game guy. That would put him near the top 10 in the league if he plays all 16 games. I’d say his backup is probably looking at about 5. The guy I envision adding to really help is probably 8-10 touches. That’s more of the speed/receiving type of back (think Tarik Cohen type). That’s like 30-35 plays a game to the RBs. If the Bills run their same 65ish plays a game that leaves the ball in Josh’s hands to distribute to other receivers or run himself 30-35 times a game.

[ny33]

We just need another good RB, period. 

[Buffalo716]

3 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

It depends, to me, upon what you mean by "short yardage".  Goal line sneak?  4th and 1?  Sure.

 

Designed runs between the tackles to gain 3-4 yds?  Those were the plays that when called for Josh, had me growling.  They often failed, and the reason seemed to me often that Josh lacked the burst and agility to follow his blockers correctly.  He is fast, but he needs time to accelerate.

 

Taking @Buffalo716 point about RB vision being something that needs development time, Josh may not have the vision for the hole in those plays, either.  I would rather he put his time into developing passing skills than RB vision.

Of course with time and carries the game slows down and they see things better.. some guys never get it, people flying 20 mph really mucks stuff up and some people just play too fast (which isn't good for a RB)

 

Then you got guys like McCaffrey and Chubb and Cook who are naturals and have a great innate vision. Seemingly always finds the crease and always can find that extra yard

 

It basically comes down to , yes it improves with lots of reps... But their are guys that come out of college with amazing vision, those are guys you want to Target

 

 

[BillsBlue]

On 2/20/2020 at 2:06 PM, Victory Formation said:

I can’t count how many times I’ve seen Singletary drag 4-5 defenders on his back for an extra 4 or 5 yards. I think Singletary is a tougher runner than we think. I have no reservations whatsoever about plugging him in on the goal line. I’m not against drafting a power back but I don’t view Singletary as strictly a scat back or finesse back, he’s pretty strong. I think Singletary can get you the tough yards.

We need someone who can be what we thought Gore would be for the goaline and short yardage situations 

A good hammer if you will and for late in games once singletaries shake and bake style and ankle breaking tires defenses out