Tipster19 Posted February 13, 2020 Author Posted February 13, 2020 In other news about WRs, it looks like KC’s WR Demarcus Robinson just might become a FA. I’m not impressed, the guy dropped too many balls in the sample size that I saw him in. If the Bills don’t draft a big time WR then I hope that they trade for an elite talent. I’d like to see them go after players that aren’t advertised, they have the capital and resources to entice just about any team to give it a 2nd thought. Beane is aggressive and if a player makes sense then I believe that he would pony up for the right player. Golliday imo is the right player.
Big Blitz Posted February 13, 2020 Posted February 13, 2020 Um yes. And no, he's not leaving Detroit. I think the game he had vs White last year was the worst game of White's career. Dude is a beast.
Rc2catch Posted February 13, 2020 Posted February 13, 2020 4 hours ago, Tipster19 said: In other news about WRs, it looks like KC’s WR Demarcus Robinson just might become a FA. I’m not impressed, the guy dropped too many balls in the sample size that I saw him in. If the Bills don’t draft a big time WR then I hope that they trade for an elite talent. I’d like to see them go after players that aren’t advertised, they have the capital and resources to entice just about any team to give it a 2nd thought. Beane is aggressive and if a player makes sense then I believe that he would pony up for the right player. Golliday imo is the right player. That’s been my stance all offseason. Diggs, Evans in Tampa, Keenan Allen in LA, I didn’t consider Golloday cause they can easily sign him long term.. But Beane should absolutely be floating that first rounder out there if he can snag a game changer receiver or pass rusher for it. 1
Thurman#1 Posted February 13, 2020 Posted February 13, 2020 (edited) 13 hours ago, ScottLaw said: Love Golliday. He looked very good against White in 2018. Doubt the Bills would do it though. Maybe a 2nd and a future early pick would get it done. Why are you concerned about money? Why is he concerned about money? Because everyone should be ... always. 12 hours ago, ScottLaw said: Why are you worried about things 3-4 years down the road? Whats more important a Super Bowl victory or cap space? That question utterly and totally misses the point. It's like asking, which do you want, to be rich or to save money? The answer should be both. Saving money is one of the main things that leads to being rich. Same as handling your cap space smartly and frugally is one of the main things that leads to consistently being competitive for Super Bowls. 12 hours ago, KD in CA said: "Trading draft picks for guys that are due to be paid is an excellent way to build a consistent winner." -Dan Snyder Oh, man, is that ever dead on target. Edited February 13, 2020 by Thurman#1
Thurman#1 Posted February 13, 2020 Posted February 13, 2020 5 hours ago, SoTier said: There is no such thing as "sustainability" in the NFL. Roster turn over is a fact of life whether teams are consistently competing in the playoffs or consistently missing them. Plain and simple, the modern NFL is dominated by teams that figure out how to manage the salary cap, and those are the teams that win consistently, make conference championships, and win Super Bowls. Only the Buccaneers among Super Bowl winners in the last 20 years have failed to be a consistent winner. They have not made the playoffs since 2008. Only the Falcons have been a consistent winner that has only made the Super Bowl once in the last year, and only the Vikings have been a consistent winner that has failed to make the Super Bowl in the last 20 years. In the 20 years since 2000, these are the Super Bowl winners: New England Patriots - 20 winnings seasons - 18 playoff seasons - 13 conference championship appearances - 9 SB appearances - 6 SBs Indianapolis Colts - 15 winning seasons - 15 playoff seasons - 4 conference championship appearances - 2 SB appearances - 1 SB Green Bay Packers - 15 winning seasons - 14 playoff seasons - 5 conference championship appearances - 1 SB appearance - 1 SB Seattle Seahawks - 15 winning seasons - 13 playoff seasons - 3 conference championship appearances - 3 SB appearances - 1 SB Philadelphia Eagles - 14 winning seasons - 13 playoff seasons - 6 conference championship appearances - 2 SB appearances - 1 SB Pittsburgh Steelers - 15 winning seasons - 12 playoff seasons - 5 conference championship appearances - 3 SB appearances - 2 SBs Baltimore Ravens - 14 winning seasons - 12 playoff seasons - 4 conference championship appearances - 2 SB appearances - 2 SBs Denver Broncos - 12 winning seasons - 9 playoff seasons - 3 conference championship appearances - 2 SB appearances - 1 SB Kansas City Chiefs - 11 winning seasons - 9 playoff seasons - 2 conference championship appearances -1 SB appearance - 1 SB New Orleans Saints - 10 winning seasons - 9 playoff seasons - 3 conference championship appearances - 1 SB appearance -1 SB New York Giants - 10 winning seasons - 8 playoff seasons - 3 conference championship appearances - 3 SB appearances -2 SBs Tampa Bay Buccaneers - 6 winning seasons -5 playoff seasons - 1 conference championship appearances - 1 SB appearance -1 SB If the Bills don't strive to win the Super Bowl, they certainly aren't likely to become "consistent winners". You're mixing cause and effect, IMO. If the Bills don't strive to become consistent winners, they aren't likely to win the Super Bowl. If you win consistently, you will have chances in several years rather than just one. That drastically raises your odds. Thoughtful and interesting post, though. But I do wonder about your first few sentences. You say there's no such thing as sustainability in the NFL and then you point out how one group of teams have sustained excellence for quite a long time.
Buffalo Barbarian Posted February 13, 2020 Posted February 13, 2020 Nope, draft our own in a DEEP WR draft.
Mr. WEO Posted February 13, 2020 Posted February 13, 2020 (edited) 6 hours ago, Thurman#1 said: Why is he concerned about money? Because everyone should be ... always. That question utterly and totally misses the point. It's like asking, which do you want, to be rich or to save money? The answer should be both. Saving money is one of the main things that leads to being rich. Same as handling your cap space smartly and frugally is one of the main things that leads to consistently being competitive for Super Bowls. Oh, man, is that ever dead on target. If this was always true, Pegula wouldn't have bought the Bills. Also, amassing a huge cap space has come at the expense of putting out an offense that still struggles to score points. Is that considered being rich? Edited February 13, 2020 by Mr. WEO 1
soflabillsfan1 Posted February 13, 2020 Posted February 13, 2020 6 hours ago, Thurman#1 said: Why is he concerned about money? Because everyone should be ... always. That question utterly and totally misses the point. It's like asking, which do you want, to be rich or to save money? The answer should be both. Saving money is one of the main things that leads to being rich. Same as handling your cap space smartly and frugally is one of the main things that leads to consistently being competitive for Super Bowls. ScottLaw was totally right. The guy he quoted was implying we couldn't hypothetically sign Golladay to a big contract because we had to pay the guys like Edmunds and Allen. Those guys just finished their 2nd year. The Bills have the rights to those guys for another 3 years. Milano and Dawkins aren't going to break the bank. This "cap hell" some people worry about is a total exaggeration. The Bills for 2020 currently have 1 player with a cap hit of 10 million or more. The Chiefs have 8 and still have to pay Mahomes. I guess they should have cancelled the Super Bowl parade. I remember 5 years ago when everyone said the Saints were in "salary cap hell". What happened? There's no prize in the NFL for doing the most while spending the least. The Bills have plenty of money to spend. 1 1
ALF Posted February 13, 2020 Posted February 13, 2020 (edited) Lions have $45M cap space should sign their tall WR, interesting thought though. He was pick #96 in 3rd rd good drafting for them. Edited February 13, 2020 by ALF
Hardhatharry Posted February 13, 2020 Posted February 13, 2020 20 hours ago, elijah said: No. Draft offers more youth, some players seemingly with more talent, and a lot less money. The first round pick for X questions just don’t make much sense, especially with the WR depth this year. Lol everything said here is the opposite of what matters. Fact- Bills are very bad at drafting WRs Fact- this money issue isn't an issue But I wouldn't give up a first for him.
aristocrat Posted February 13, 2020 Posted February 13, 2020 can it be next year's first? i didn't realize how big golladay is. i thought he was like a 6 foot guy not 6-4 for some reason.
BarleyNY Posted February 13, 2020 Posted February 13, 2020 1 hour ago, soflabillsfan1 said: ScottLaw was totally right. The guy he quoted was implying we couldn't hypothetically sign Golladay to a big contract because we had to pay the guys like Edmunds and Allen. Those guys just finished their 2nd year. The Bills have the rights to those guys for another 3 years. Milano and Dawkins aren't going to break the bank. This "cap hell" some people worry about is a total exaggeration. The Bills for 2020 currently have 1 player with a cap hit of 10 million or more. The Chiefs have 8 and still have to pay Mahomes. I guess they should have cancelled the Super Bowl parade. I remember 5 years ago when everyone said the Saints were in "salary cap hell". What happened? There's no prize in the NFL for doing the most while spending the least. The Bills have plenty of money to spend. The Bills are a long, long way from any cap problems, but that’s not to say that they should waste space or give out bad contracts. OTOH paying market value to elite players at important positions should be on their “To Do” list, not something they shy away from. If they do that and draft well they’re going to be fine. 1
thebandit27 Posted February 13, 2020 Posted February 13, 2020 57 minutes ago, Hardhatharry said: Lol everything said here is the opposite of what matters. Fact- Bills are very bad at drafting WRs Fact- this money issue isn't an issue But I wouldn't give up a first for him. Why is it a fact that the Bills are “very bad” at drafting WRs? 1
The Jokeman Posted February 13, 2020 Posted February 13, 2020 12 hours ago, wppete said: No. Not trading our #1. Why? People over value #1 picks, I mean to me Golliday gives this team what it needs/wants at the WR position and unlike a rookie is at least NFL proven. I make a trade like this all day every day. 1
soflabillsfan1 Posted February 13, 2020 Posted February 13, 2020 38 minutes ago, BarleyNY said: The Bills are a long, long way from any cap problems, but that’s not to say that they should waste space or give out bad contracts. OTOH paying market value to elite players at important positions should be on their “To Do” list, not something they shy away from. If they do that and draft well they’re going to be fine. I'm definitely not for being one of those teams that give out a ton of bad contract to FA's but the Bills can no doubt sign their own guys and sign a Premier FA or 2. 2
Mojo44 Posted February 13, 2020 Posted February 13, 2020 1 hour ago, Hardhatharry said: Lol everything said here is the opposite of what matters. Fact- Bills are very bad at drafting WRs Fact- this money issue isn't an issue But I wouldn't give up a first for him. What bad receiver did Beane draft? 1
Thurman#1 Posted February 13, 2020 Posted February 13, 2020 Have the Saints won any Super Bowls since they stopped handling their cap fairly frugally? In fact, wasn't that the moment when they had three 7-9 years in a row? In any case, it's not surprising that you looked at that list of about 12 consistent winners and were only able to pluck out one that was much of an exception. Exactly. When you want something and have about 12 models for the kind of success you want and almost all of them operate with much the same overall financial approach, that's the approach that you should take. Your point was that with $90 mill you don't have to worry about the cap, right? Yeah, I got your point, and my objection still stands 100%. Guys who say, "We've got enough money, we can do what we want are generally the ones who very quickly are saying to themselves, "Jeez, just a coupla days ago it seemed I had a ton of money and now I can't afford to go to Mac's for a burger and fries. What happened?" Smart people always husband their money, treating it carefully. Always. You look at guys like Bezos, Gates, Buffett and while they make purchases, they aren't saying, "Ah, now I don't have to worry about money anymore, cuz I've got lots. They still worry about it, and that habit is a lot of the reason they ended up having so much of it. They might easily want to save $20 or $30 mill and roll it over to next year to put them in great shape again. You act as if the $90M is only for Josh Allen. It's not. And I agree with you that he's still got a lot to prove before they give him a massive QB deal, but Josh is very far from all they're thinking about. They've made it as clear as it can possibly be made that they value continuity and that they will be re-signing and extending their own guys as an extremely high priority. That $90M won't all still be there after they bring back the several of the many guys they are surely looking at extending, from Spain, Levi Wallace, Jordan Phillips, Shaq Lawson and a bunch of lesser priorities who might still be helpful enough that they'd want to bring 'em back, guys like Stanford, Coleman, Marlowe, guys like that. Not that they'll bring all of those guys back. Clearly they won't, but there'll be a bunch. And that's not to mention Tre' White, Milano, and Dion Dawkins. And Poyer. Me? I give Poyer a very nice contract extension sometime soon. He's the guy who holds that backfield together, and that backfield has been the backbone of the Bills backstops, the defense. He wouldn't be easy to replace either, as the reason he's so good is more about smarts, experience, leadership and now continuity than physical freakhood. You can replace him, maybe even with a guy with more physical talent, but you still won't get the same level of performance out of the new safety or the backfield as a unit. As always, I'd be conservative, as the smart teams overwhelmingly do. I wouldn't give him anything he wanted but absolutely I'd give him a raise. He's been worth it, and in fact he's wildly overperformed his contract. This defense is extremely cheap in 2020, around $57M right now. Absolutely bring back a major leader of a group that outperforms their own talent at a position that won't likely require a huge outlay to make him happy in a year when they can afford to spend judiciously.
Hapless Bills Fan Posted February 13, 2020 Posted February 13, 2020 15 hours ago, Alphadawg7 said: Is he rumored to be available? If not, then what’s point of thread? Might as well I start threads about trading for any unavailable player if he’s not. If he is, then it’s a resounding yes. You trade the 22nd pick for a young beast of a WR. He is NOT rumored to be available. The point of the thread is to engage in off-season speculation, based on the OP's perception of how Belicheck works and his assumption that Patricia would follow his lead. I'm with you (both on pointlessness of speculation and course of action if available) but this IS the off-season. I see it as preferable to another thread about Antonio Brown or Tom Brady.
Thurman#1 Posted February 13, 2020 Posted February 13, 2020 (edited) 2 hours ago, soflabillsfan1 said: ScottLaw was totally right. The guy he quoted was implying we couldn't hypothetically sign Golladay to a big contract because we had to pay the guys like Edmunds and Allen. Those guys just finished their 2nd year. The Bills have the rights to those guys for another 3 years. Milano and Dawkins aren't going to break the bank. This "cap hell" some people worry about is a total exaggeration. The Bills for 2020 currently have 1 player with a cap hit of 10 million or more. The Chiefs have 8 and still have to pay Mahomes. I guess they should have cancelled the Super Bowl parade. I remember 5 years ago when everyone said the Saints were in "salary cap hell". What happened? There's no prize in the NFL for doing the most while spending the least. The Bills have plenty of money to spend. Please, nobody's mentioning cap hell right now, though we really were in horrible cap shape when McDermott arrived from the Whaley administration. You don't have to be worrying about an immediate cap hell to advocate spending judiciously. And that's nonsense that the guy he was referring to was specifically pointing towards having to protect guys like Edmunds and Allen. Yeah they enter the equation but they are very very far from being the only guys that we are going to be concerned with re-signing. Where did Elijah, the guy Scott was replying to, saying anything about Edmunds and Allen, specifically. He's talking about the whole situation, and yes a big contract that will last for years will affect our ability to sign guys now and for years. We're not going to have $90M every year, or at least not unless we spend very judiciously indeed. Here's his post: 22 hours ago, elijah said: No. Draft offers more youth, some players seemingly with more talent, and a lot less money. The first round pick for X questions just don’t make much sense, especially with the WR depth this year. And I greatly disagree with your effort to minimize guys we might be looking to re-sign or extend this year. It ain't just Milano and Dawkins (and no, those two wouldn't break the bank, but they also won't be cheap, particularly Dawkins). It's also guys like Tre' White, like Poyer, like Spain, Levi Wallace, Shaq Lawson, Jordan Phillips. Edited February 13, 2020 by Thurman#1 1
nucci Posted February 13, 2020 Posted February 13, 2020 2 hours ago, soflabillsfan1 said: ScottLaw was totally right. The guy he quoted was implying we couldn't hypothetically sign Golladay to a big contract because we had to pay the guys like Edmunds and Allen. Those guys just finished their 2nd year. The Bills have the rights to those guys for another 3 years. Milano and Dawkins aren't going to break the bank. This "cap hell" some people worry about is a total exaggeration. The Bills for 2020 currently have 1 player with a cap hit of 10 million or more. The Chiefs have 8 and still have to pay Mahomes. I guess they should have cancelled the Super Bowl parade. I remember 5 years ago when everyone said the Saints were in "salary cap hell". What happened? There's no prize in the NFL for doing the most while spending the least. The Bills have plenty of money to spend. plus they just won a Superbowl 1
Recommended Posts