Some Beane quotes regarding FA in TG's new salary cap artilce

[Reed83HOF]

https://theathletic.com/1585290/2020/02/05/salary-cap-surge-how-brandon-beane-got-the-bills-to-the-point-where-they-control-their-own-destiny/

 

I dumped the salary cap stuff in the other Salary cap thread - great info and we can do whatever we want the next few years. Iwant to bring to light in it's own thread additional comments from Beane regarding how he and McD will deal with FA:

 

Beane Comments:

 

“If you’re consistently winning,” Beane said, “you want to keep the band together as much as you can. When players make Pro Bowls and are named All-Pro, and they’re your type of guy, you don’t want to see them walk out the door.

 

“It will get tough, especially when you have a franchise quarterback. That’s when the number starts getting hard. You do have to start letting guys walk. You do your best, but you understand the more talented players you have, the harder it is to do.”

 

“Where you start losing flexibility is if things go well and you have to pay your quarterback,” Beane said. “If he’s a big part of the reason you’re having success, you have to pay him a pretty good penny, which decreases your flexibility every year after that.”

 

“You need to have the ability to walk away and not chase,” Beane said. “Sometimes those hurt because you commit a lot of time and energy into recruiting. For all the guys we sign, there are others that teams outbid us for, or a player simply says, ‘I’m from Louisiana and want to play for New Orleans.’ You run into all sorts of different things you can’t control.”

 

“We will do a deep and honest dive into the roster,” Beane said. “We have to be honest. If a guy played bad in Houston and played well the rest of the year, we can’t kill him, and vice versa.

 

“We have to look at A to Z. If it’s an older guy, was he a much better player in September and October than he was in December and January? You have to know your roster and decide, ‘Are we good at this spot? Do we feel confident? If we go through free agency and the draft and don’t add a guy here, are we ready to roll out with these guys? Do we need an upgrade?’ ”

 

“I’ll meet with Sean on each side of the ball for his wish list,” Beane said. “But we on the personnel side will look at it with our own eyes. Sean and his coaches are in the meeting room and might like (a certain player) more because they’ve become buddies and see the game the same way and communicate well.

 

“I stand back and look at it from a distance. Maybe he doesn’t want to teach a new guy, who has just a little more ability, the ins and outs of his system. It’s my job to press him on that if I think there are players who make us better in the draft or free agency.”

 

Comments from Ginaetti (the Spotrac guy:)

 

“Brandon Beane has structured these contracts that gives him whatever control he wants,” Ginnitti said. “He’s done a phenomenal job of staggering the money in ways many teams have not done. That’s why the Rams now are looking in the mirror, wondering what happened. They have no plan forward aside from their current situation.

 

“If he wants to overpay a little bit to keep Shaq Lawson, he can. He could cut Tyler Kroft, Star Lotulelei and Trent Murphy, and it wouldn’t make a dent in his cap space or his future cap because of the way he has structured the contracts.”

Edited February 7, 2020 by Reed83HOF

[GreggTX]

Thanks for posting. It seems are taking a very different approach to structuring contracts these days and it's paying dividends.

 

I don't see Lotulelei getting cut, though. We'd still have to eat almost $8 million. I think he'll be playing behind Harry this year and gone in 2021. I think they'll let Shaq test the FA market, but will make him a bonafide offer if no one else offers him above average starter money. The real question is will Shaq want to stay?

[Buddo]

2 hours ago, GreggTX said:

Thanks for posting. It seems are taking a very different approach to structuring contracts these days and it's paying dividends.

 

I don't see Lotulelei getting cut, though. We'd still have to eat almost $8 million. I think he'll be playing behind Harry this year and gone in 2021. I think they'll let Shaq test the FA market, but will make him a bonafide offer if no one else offers him above average starter money. The real question is will Shaq want to stay?

 

I think much depends on how much other teams like the look of Shaq. Imho, the Bills coaches/FO like what they have got from him, i.e. continuous improvement, including attitude.

 

I believe they will let him test the market, if he wants to, but with the idea that he comes back to them with what he's been offered, and see if they are prepared to match, or do a little better.

 

Any 'bonafide' offer, will be what they have decided they are prepared to pay up to. I have no idea what that might be, but I wouldn't be surprised if it was more than many might expect.

 

Mainly due to the belief that he can become better still, is at the right age for a deal to be done, and it sends the right message to players, both on the Bills and in the rest of the league. i.e. perform and you will be paid.

 

As regards contract structures, I think we will see increasingly, more guaranteed money through the length of deals, but it only becomes guaranteed if guys are on the roster each year. Make the team, make the money. An example of this might be a 5 year deal for $50 million, with $35 million guaranteed. Each year the guy remains on the roster, he gets $7 million guaranteed, but only if he's on the roster. That might be an excessive example tbh, but I think the principle is there.

 

The above 'style' of deal, makes life a lot easier when it comes to managing the cap, as you aren't having to look down the road all the time at dead money for signing bonuses etc.

 

The biggest hurdle to overcome with it, would be players understandable desire, to get as much as possible 'up front', yet I think that type of deal shouldn't be too hard to 'sell' to genuinely competetive players.

[QCity]

8 hours ago, Reed83HOF said:

“Brandon Beane has structured these contracts that gives him whatever control he wants,” Ginnitti said. “

 

 

Look at each contract we gave all our FA's last year. We can walk away from every single one of them after 2 years with minimal damage if they don't work out.

 

A far cry from the Whaley days.

[atlbillsfan1975]

Thanks for posting.

Newest piece of information from that for me was Beane explaining how he and McDermott work together. I like Brandon’s approach and sounds very positive and non biased when it comes to player evaluation. It also sounds like Brandon values culture, but won’t let Sean get complacent with less talented players who know the system. 

Edited February 7, 2020 by atlbillsfan1975

[mjt328]

2 hours ago, Buddo said:

I think much depends on how much other teams like the look of Shaq. Imho, the Bills coaches/FO like what they have got from him, i.e. continuous improvement, including attitude.

 

I believe they will let him test the market, if he wants to, but with the idea that he comes back to them with what he's been offered, and see if they are prepared to match, or do a little better.

 

Any 'bonafide' offer, will be what they have decided they are prepared to pay up to. I have no idea what that might be, but I wouldn't be surprised if it was more than many might expect.

 

Mainly due to the belief that he can become better still, is at the right age for a deal to be done, and it sends the right message to players, both on the Bills and in the rest of the league. i.e. perform and you will be paid.

 

As regards contract structures, I think we will see increasingly, more guaranteed money through the length of deals, but it only becomes guaranteed if guys are on the roster each year. Make the team, make the money. An example of this might be a 5 year deal for $50 million, with $35 million guaranteed. Each year the guy remains on the roster, he gets $7 million guaranteed, but only if he's on the roster. That might be an excessive example tbh, but I think the principle is there.

 

The above 'style' of deal, makes life a lot easier when it comes to managing the cap, as you aren't having to look down the road all the time at dead money for signing bonuses etc.

 

The biggest hurdle to overcome with it, would be players understandable desire, to get as much as possible 'up front', yet I think that type of deal shouldn't be too hard to 'sell' to genuinely competetive players.

 

It wouldn't surprise me if the Bills are able to bring back both Jordan Phillips and Shaq Lawson at very reasonable deals.

I don't think the market is quite as high on those two guys as most Bills fans believe.

 

I've looked through numerous NFL sites regarding free agents, and neither Phillips or Lawson is on anyone's radar.  I haven't found one writer (and many of these guys are pretty plugged in with league front offices) that has either of these guys in the Top 100 upcoming free agents, or one of the top targets at his position.  Now, it's completely possible that real NFL GMs see those guys differently from the average observer.  But from what I can tell, the top DE's that are being talked about include Jadeveon Clowney, Yannick Ngakou, Arik Armstead, Matthew Judon, Bud Dupree, Dante Fowler, Shaq Barrett.  The top DTs seem to be Chris Jones, Leonard Williams, DJ Reader, Javon Hargrave, Ndamukong Suh, Michael Brockers, etc.

 

Bottom line, I don't think these guys are going to land Top 10-15 contracts or their positions or anywhere close to $10 million plus.  My guess is both Phillips and Lawson will be in the $6-8 million per year range.  If they leave Buffalo, it will be likely due to factors beyond Brandon Beane's control.  My biggest concern with both guys is pride.  I think both guys may be overrating their own value, and may get offended if Buffalo doesn't offer them their perceived value.  We may have already burned the bridge with Lawson by not activating his 5th Year Option.  Phillips meanwhile is always on social media defending his play, and legitimately appears to see himself as one of the league's top players.  Beane will probably give both guys fair offers, but won't overpay or break the bank. 

 

[GG]

5 hours ago, GreggTX said:

Thanks for posting. It seems are taking a very different approach to structuring contracts these days and it's paying dividends.

 

I don't see Lotulelei getting cut, though. We'd still have to eat almost $8 million. I think he'll be playing behind Harry this year and gone in 2021. I think they'll let Shaq test the FA market, but will make him a bonafide offer if no one else offers him above average starter money. The real question is will Shaq want to stay?

 

I still insist that the best move for both sides is to restructure Star's contract.  Star is valuable only in a specific system, and those teams aren't breaking down the door to pay him $8 million/yr.  If they restructure his deal that pays about $6 mil/yr and maybe add another year that would be palatable to both

[Niagara Dude]

11 hours ago, Reed83HOF said:

https://theathletic.com/1585290/2020/02/05/salary-cap-surge-how-brandon-beane-got-the-bills-to-the-point-where-they-control-their-own-destiny/

 

I dumped the salary cap stuff in the other Salary cap thread - great info and we can do whatever we want the next few years. Iwant to bring to light in it's own thread additional comments from Beane regarding how he and McD will deal with FA:

 

Beane Comments:

 

“If you’re consistently winning,” Beane said, “you want to keep the band together as much as you can. When players make Pro Bowls and are named All-Pro, and they’re your type of guy, you don’t want to see them walk out the door.

 

“It will get tough, especially when you have a franchise quarterback. That’s when the number starts getting hard. You do have to start letting guys walk. You do your best, but you understand the more talented players you have, the harder it is to do.”

 

“Where you start losing flexibility is if things go well and you have to pay your quarterback,” Beane said. “If he’s a big part of the reason you’re having success, you have to pay him a pretty good penny, which decreases your flexibility every year after that.”

 

“You need to have the ability to walk away and not chase,” Beane said. “Sometimes those hurt because you commit a lot of time and energy into recruiting. For all the guys we sign, there are others that teams outbid us for, or a player simply says, ‘I’m from Louisiana and want to play for New Orleans.’ You run into all sorts of different things you can’t control.”

 

“We will do a deep and honest dive into the roster,” Beane said. “We have to be honest. If a guy played bad in Houston and played well the rest of the year, we can’t kill him, and vice versa.

 

“We have to look at A to Z. If it’s an older guy, was he a much better player in September and October than he was in December and January? You have to know your roster and decide, ‘Are we good at this spot? Do we feel confident? If we go through free agency and the draft and don’t add a guy here, are we ready to roll out with these guys? Do we need an upgrade?’ ”

 

“I’ll meet with Sean on each side of the ball for his wish list,” Beane said. “But we on the personnel side will look at it with our own eyes. Sean and his coaches are in the meeting room and might like (a certain player) more because they’ve become buddies and see the game the same way and communicate well.

 

“I stand back and look at it from a distance. Maybe he doesn’t want to teach a new guy, who has just a little more ability, the ins and outs of his system. It’s my job to press him on that if I think there are players who make us better in the draft or free agency.”

 

Comments from Ginaetti (the Spotrac guy:)

 

“Brandon Beane has structured these contracts that gives him whatever control he wants,” Ginnitti said. “He’s done a phenomenal job of staggering the money in ways many teams have not done. That’s why the Rams now are looking in the mirror, wondering what happened. They have no plan forward aside from their current situation.

 

“If he wants to overpay a little bit to keep Shaq Lawson, he can. He could cut Tyler Kroft, Star Lotulelei and Trent Murphy, and it wouldn’t make a dent in his cap space or his future cap because of the way he has structured the contracts.”

End of the day the need to cut guys Murphy/Smith/ Kroft and not overpay guys like Poyer who wants a raise.  Poyer signed a contract and needs to honor it,  good player but he is no pro bowler who cannot be replaced. Paying average/good players too much puts your team at a disadvantage getting elite talent that you need to win playoff games.  Does anyone remember any game changing plays Poyer made this past season or in the playoff game?  either do i.  Not against adding a couple of years to his current deal with a small increase. 

 

The end of the day 

[BigBuff423]

11 hours ago, Reed83HOF said:

https://theathletic.com/1585290/2020/02/05/salary-cap-surge-how-brandon-beane-got-the-bills-to-the-point-where-they-control-their-own-destiny/

 

I dumped the salary cap stuff in the other Salary cap thread - great info and we can do whatever we want the next few years. Iwant to bring to light in it's own thread additional comments from Beane regarding how he and McD will deal with FA:

 

Beane Comments:

 

“If you’re consistently winning,” Beane said, “you want to keep the band together as much as you can. When players make Pro Bowls and are named All-Pro, and they’re your type of guy, you don’t want to see them walk out the door.

 

“It will get tough, especially when you have a franchise quarterback. That’s when the number starts getting hard. You do have to start letting guys walk. You do your best, but you understand the more talented players you have, the harder it is to do.”

 

“Where you start losing flexibility is if things go well and you have to pay your quarterback,” Beane said. “If he’s a big part of the reason you’re having success, you have to pay him a pretty good penny, which decreases your flexibility every year after that.”

 

“You need to have the ability to walk away and not chase,” Beane said. “Sometimes those hurt because you commit a lot of time and energy into recruiting. For all the guys we sign, there are others that teams outbid us for, or a player simply says, ‘I’m from Louisiana and want to play for New Orleans.’ You run into all sorts of different things you can’t control.”

 

“We will do a deep and honest dive into the roster,” Beane said. “We have to be honest. If a guy played bad in Houston and played well the rest of the year, we can’t kill him, and vice versa.

 

“We have to look at A to Z. If it’s an older guy, was he a much better player in September and October than he was in December and January? You have to know your roster and decide, ‘Are we good at this spot? Do we feel confident? If we go through free agency and the draft and don’t add a guy here, are we ready to roll out with these guys? Do we need an upgrade?’ ”

 

“I’ll meet with Sean on each side of the ball for his wish list,” Beane said. “But we on the personnel side will look at it with our own eyes. Sean and his coaches are in the meeting room and might like (a certain player) more because they’ve become buddies and see the game the same way and communicate well.

 

“I stand back and look at it from a distance. Maybe he doesn’t want to teach a new guy, who has just a little more ability, the ins and outs of his system. It’s my job to press him on that if I think there are players who make us better in the draft or free agency.”

 

Comments from Ginaetti (the Spotrac guy:)

 

“Brandon Beane has structured these contracts that gives him whatever control he wants,” Ginnitti said. “He’s done a phenomenal job of staggering the money in ways many teams have not done. That’s why the Rams now are looking in the mirror, wondering what happened. They have no plan forward aside from their current situation.

 

“If he wants to overpay a little bit to keep Shaq Lawson, he can. He could cut Tyler Kroft, Star Lotulelei and Trent Murphy, and it wouldn’t make a dent in his cap space or his future cap because of the way he has structured the contracts.”

 

All of those comments above are one of the reasons why I fricken love Beane. I don't know how he'll do over the long-term, but I love what I've seen from him the first couple of years. He takes an honest assessment of the players, keeps those who play to the level AND fit the culture and let walk the others who may have talent or good guys but don't contribute on the field. It also shows that while it seems truly genuine that Beane and McD are friendly and get along well, Beane doesn't let that hinder him "challenging" him on how to take the players and make them better, regardless of personal relationships. 

 

The bolded and underlined text was enlightening to me. I think in my mind, when Beane said "...and vice versa", he was referring to Murphy. Trent Murphy showed flashes at times in the season but also disappeared for games at a time but he had a good to great game in Houston. IMHO, that statement says, that Murphy had a good game in Houston, but that doesn't mean he'll be back. If that's the case, again to me it shows Beane's ability to take a 10,000 foot view and not just narrowly focus on one, singular point. 

[Niagara Dude]

2 minutes ago, GG said:

 

I still insist that the best move for both sides is to restructure Star's contract.  Star is valuable only in a specific system, and those teams aren't breaking down the door to pay him $8 million/yr.  If they restructure his deal that pays about $6 mil/yr and maybe add another year that would be palatable to both

Yes cutting Star would only save us a net of 2.3 mill with 7.8 mill dead

[BuffaloRebound]

13 minutes ago, BigBuff423 said:

 

All of those comments above are one of the reasons why I fricken love Beane. I don't know how he'll do over the long-term, but I love what I've seen from him the first couple of years. He takes an honest assessment of the players, keeps those who play to the level AND fit the culture and let walk the others who may have talent or good guys but don't contribute on the field. It also shows that while it seems truly genuine that Beane and McD are friendly and get along well, Beane doesn't let that hinder him "challenging" him on how to take the players and make them better, regardless of personal relationships. 

 

The bolded and underlined text was enlightening to me. I think in my mind, when Beane said "...and vice versa", he was referring to Murphy. Trent Murphy showed flashes at times in the season but also disappeared for games at a time but he had a good to great game in Houston. IMHO, that statement says, that Murphy had a good game in Houston, but that doesn't mean he'll be back. If that's the case, again to me it shows Beane's ability to take a 10,000 foot view and not just narrowly focus on one, singular point. 

You gotta love his candidness.  Basically telling Poyer that we want you back but that Houston tape don’t lie.  

[Magox]

Its difficult to say who the Bills should cut and retain until after we see what they do after FA and the draft.  You just don't cut guys specially if you aren't in a salary cap crunch unless you have a better option to replace them.

 

With that said, I don't see the Bills cutting Star.  My view is that the Bills coaching staff and management see him in a more positive light than the fans do.  I think him and Harry are the ones they want to roll with at that particular spot.

 

Murphy and Lawson I think is a very fluid situation.  Both could be back, maybe just one or maybe even none.    I think Darryl Johnson is a player that they are believing can be part of the 4 man DE rotation.  Hughes is also I believe to be a lock.   That leaves the other two spots and a lot can happen.  My hunch is that they will look to pick up a premium pass rusher through FA or use a 1st rounder to get one, possibly even do both.  

 

Poyer, I think they want to retain.  But I don't think they will look to pay him premium safety dollars, the Bills I believe are very high on Jaquan Johnson.  I think they want to keep Poyer not just because he's a solid player but they probably want to send a message to the team that they want to retain core members.  But Jaquan could potentially soon become a better player than Poyer and if they believe that to be the case then they may end up having a very difficult decision.  They will probably punt on that decision till the very last moment.  It's a good problem to have.

 

I know everyone is talking about Kroft being cut, and he very well may be.  But I don't see that happening unless two things happen, either they pick up one in FA that they see supplanting him or what I think would be the more likely scenario wait until the time of final cuts before the season begins to dump him if he fails to impress.   I think Lee is more likely to be cut due to Sweeney replacing him than Kroft being cut.  I could be wrong.

 

Gore most likely retires and if he doesn't I don't see the Bills retaining him.

 

Aside from that, those are the highest profile cuts or non retained players I see on the potential bubble.

[ThurmasThoman]

13 hours ago, Reed83HOF said:

“I’ll meet with Sean on each side of the ball for his wish list,” Beane said. “But we on the personnel side will look at it with our own eyes. Sean and his coaches are in the meeting room and might like (a certain player) more because they’ve become buddies and see the game the same way and communicate well.

 

“I stand back and look at it from a distance. Maybe he doesn’t want to teach a new guy, who has just a little more ability, the ins and outs of his system. It’s my job to press him on that if I think there are players who make us better in the draft or free agency.”

 

To me, and I can't state enough that this is just my opinion and based on nothing other than some decades of life experience and an exercise in reading between the lines, this means that if (read: when, because it's inevitable for every NFL team that doesn't get caught cheating every 4 years) it starts going south, Beane stays on and gets to pick the next coach. 

[msw2112]

I really like Beane's pragmatic and honest approach.  If he presents to the players the same way that he presents to the media and the fans, I believe that most guys would really appreciate it.  It's a nice departure from a lot of the "corporate speak" and "coach speak" that we see in professional sports.  The only guys who may not like it are those that are unwilling to accept the truth, such as an aging player who is on the decline and still believes they are what they used to be, or a guy who had one good year but is closer to an average replacement level player.

[RyanC883]

“If he wants to overpay a little bit to keep Shaq Lawson, he can. He could cut Tyler Kroft, Star Lotulelei and Trent Murphy, and it wouldn’t make a dent in his cap space or his future cap because of the way he has structured the contracts.”

 

the answer is yes, cut kroft, star and trent! 

 

 

[Mr. K]

Would players sign the Beane style contract with the 2 year out under Doug Whaley? It seems like McBeane actually did bring some culture. They've brought in their guys and done it their way for a while now. I think they're getting just about everybody on the process train and hopefully starting convincing others to join. I just hope that whatever happens with FA's its done respectfully as not to hurt the franchise. Playoffs 2 out of 3 years is a great start to their tenure now lets see the upward trend continue.

 

Dare I say lets win the offseason

[Lurker]

14 hours ago, Reed83HOF said:

“I’ll meet with Sean on each side of the ball for his wish list,” Beane said. “But we on the personnel side will look at it with our own eyes. Sean and his coaches are in the meeting room and might like (a certain player) more because they’ve become buddies and see the game the same way and communicate well.

 

“I stand back and look at it from a distance. Maybe he doesn’t want to teach a new guy, who has just a little more ability, the ins and outs of his system. It’s my job to press him on that if I think there are players who make us better in the draft or free agency.”

 

Most of Beane's comments were things he's said before, but I found his remarks about McD's 'buddies' to be something new and kind of eye-opening.     

 

It's the first time I can recall him deviating from the "joined at the hip" partnership they've promoted when it comes to team building.     I like that Beane's clearly the sheriff in town and sort of keeping McD from getting too comfortable or over-loaded with his 'type' of guys (i.e., humble, God-fearing over-achieving underdogs)...      

[YoloinOhio]

“We will do a deep and honest dive into the roster,” Beane said. “We have to be honest. If a guy played bad in Houston and played well the rest of the year, we can’t kill him, and vice versa.

Sounds like he could be referring specifically to Poyer here?

[Lurker]

1 minute ago, YoloinOhio said:

“We will do a deep and honest dive into the roster,” Beane said. “We have to be honest. If a guy played bad in Houston and played well the rest of the year, we can’t kill him, and vice versa.

Sounds like he could be referring specifically to Poyer here?

 

Or Tre' in the second half...

[thebandit27]

Just now, Lurker said:

 

Or Tre' in the second half...

Yeah, that fumble he forced on Hopkins was brutal ?