BarleyNY Posted January 23, 2020 Posted January 23, 2020 (edited) 4 hours ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said: i think it’s a great idea. NFLPA won’t like it though Bills did this work around with Dareus in my Opinion The NFL wants parity. It’s more about the NFL than the NFLPA who likely would be for trading cap space. Let the teams that want to spend, spend. It’d drive up prices for the top players. That’s what the league doesn’t want. Plus allowing teams to trade cap space would really damage pairity. The Mike Browns of the league would use that mechanism to get richer at the expense of even attempting to be competitive. The Dareus trade was a similar situation in that the Bills traded away a highly talented player for peanuts because they wanted to be rid of him and his future guaranteed money. The big difference with the Osweiler trade was that Houston gave up the player and more in picks than they got back. Osweiler plus a 6th and a future 2nd for only a 4th from Cleveland IIRC. That’s where it gets sketchy with the league office. They tried to run the trade through all in the same year and it was rejected. No bueno from the league. Edited January 23, 2020 by BarleyNY 1
1ManRaid Posted January 23, 2020 Posted January 23, 2020 I'd be fine with it. It would give rebuilding teams the option to buy draft picks, and the other teams the flexibility to retain higher priced stars. League parity improves, everyone wins.
Chaos Posted January 23, 2020 Posted January 23, 2020 6 hours ago, Don Otreply said: Nah, teams should suffer for their bad decision making, FOs that are smart benefit, others not so much, and deservedly so, jmo. Go Bills!!! Losing a third round pick for 5 million of cap space as the OP suggests is actually getting dinged pretty hard for a mistake.
Chaos Posted January 23, 2020 Posted January 23, 2020 7 hours ago, The Red King said: Just a random thought I had...what if cap space could be used as trade currency? We already see trades that involve eating cap, but what if cap space itself could be traded? Teams up against the cap, but who like their roster might trade draft picks for increased cap. Likewise, teams with a ton of cap room could use it not only on free agency, but trades as well. Like a team trading $5 mil of 2020 cap room for a 3rd round pick or such. Honestly, I don't know how I feel about it. Could likely be abused. Just, seemed at least a curious idea and I wondered what all of you thought. I think you would end up with a barbell effect of teams going all in and teams selling off all their cap for future picks. For example, maybe the Packers would be have the incentive to trade off several years of their future, to acquire a whole bunch of players for a last hurrah, figuring they will be horrible when Rodgers retires anyway. And a team without a good QB decides to trade all of their cap space for draft capital in hopes of finding a franchise QB and tooling up from there. Allow cap to be traded, sort of defeats the parity purpose it was, in part, created for. 2
Don Otreply Posted January 23, 2020 Posted January 23, 2020 36 minutes ago, Chaos said: Losing a third round pick for 5 million of cap space as the OP suggests is actually getting dinged pretty hard for a mistake. Still nah, it reeks of fantasy football.
Chaos Posted January 23, 2020 Posted January 23, 2020 Just now, Don Otreply said: Still nah, it reeks of fantasy football. Lose a point, move the goal post.
Don Otreply Posted January 23, 2020 Posted January 23, 2020 Just now, Chaos said: Lose a point, move the goal post. No, still prefer my initial statement, and I can’t help that it’s s phantasy football thing to do, so nah, not feeling it,
Over 29 years of fanhood Posted January 23, 2020 Posted January 23, 2020 2 hours ago, BarleyNY said: The NFL wants parity. It’s more about the NFL than the NFLPA who likely would be for trading cap space. Let the teams that want to spend, spend. It’d drive up prices for the top players. That’s what the league doesn’t want. Plus allowing teams to trade cap space would really damage pairity. The Mike Browns of the league would use that mechanism to get richer at the expense of even attempting to be competitive. The Dareus trade was a similar situation in that the Bills traded away a highly talented player for peanuts because they wanted to be rid of him and his future guaranteed money. The big difference with the Osweiler trade was that Houston gave up the player and more in picks than they got back. Osweiler plus a 6th and a future 2nd for only a 4th from Cleveland IIRC. That’s where it gets sketchy with the league office. They tried to run the trade through all in the same year and it was rejected. No bueno from the league. nice post! This was also sort of my point on why the NFLPA would not allow it as part of CBA. The NFLPAs goal is 100% of the cap is spent by each team on player salaries. I think the cap money for pick trade scenario might drive up superstar pay, but not the “middle class” of the nfl. either way, interesting topic. 1
billsfan89 Posted January 23, 2020 Posted January 23, 2020 Pass, you would see 2-4 teams like the Bengals become intentional bottom feeders renting cap space for cheap draft picks and selling it off for money. I think that there could be some trades like the Oswiler trade where the Browns absorbed a bad contract and got a 2nd round pick in exchange for a 4th rounder.
Utah John Posted January 23, 2020 Posted January 23, 2020 The Bills (Whaley) made a huge mistake giving Dareus that contract. The only choices the Bills had were to allow him to stick around, continue eating cap space every year (and from the looks of it, all the pizza and wings in WNY) -- or to release him and absorb a huge hit in that year -- or to trade him and no one wanted a lazy, fat, complacent, opinionated wise guy at an incredibly high salary. Option 1 was out since he clearly didn't get a seat on McDermott's bus. Option 2 was very unattractive since the Bills were trying to rebuild. Option 3 was a tough sell but apparently a good one, since the Bills found a sucker willing to take a flier on Dareus.
Ethan in Cleveland Posted January 24, 2020 Posted January 24, 2020 13 hours ago, The Red King said: Just a random thought I had...what if cap space could be used as trade currency? We already see trades that involve eating cap, but what if cap space itself could be traded? Teams up against the cap, but who like their roster might trade draft picks for increased cap. Likewise, teams with a ton of cap room could use it not only on free agency, but trades as well. Like a team trading $5 mil of 2020 cap room for a 3rd round pick or such. Honestly, I don't know how I feel about it. Could likely be abused. Just, seemed at least a curious idea and I wondered what all of you thought. Love it. Instead of giving up trade assets like players or picks, teams could give up cap space and still draft young players.
Rock'em Sock'em Posted January 24, 2020 Posted January 24, 2020 In 2018, Cleveland ate Osweiler's guarantees for a 2nd round pick from Houston - and trading cap space for draft picks is not a far jump from that scenario. Trading cap for straight up cash may be against the CBA. The CBA and salary cap have minimum spend provisions. And those provisions are meant to make the league competitive. Trading cap space for dollars would work against that goal. So long as the minimum spend provisions are met (without regard to sold cap space), I guess it could work. I would not see this as an oft-used tool. Among other things, it's a bad look for a team.
Franchiseneedsme Posted January 26, 2020 Posted January 26, 2020 (edited) I would take Foles as our backup along with his 22M cap hit for the Jags #9 pick. Jerry Judy would be a #1 Edited January 26, 2020 by Franchiseneedsme
Billy Claude Posted January 26, 2020 Posted January 26, 2020 This would defeat one of the primary purposes of the salary cap - competitive parity. Right now if a team picks up a bad contract there is an immediate financial penalty - the team has to pay the player. If a team can trade away cap space for draft choices there is very little financial penalty for that team. Some owners will decide to its is better to have larger profit than fielding a winning team. Other owners in larger markets with larger local income will go way over the cap. You will essentially get the same situation as baseball.
NoSaint Posted January 27, 2020 Posted January 27, 2020 On 1/23/2020 at 9:42 AM, 3rdnlng said: In order to answer the OP's question one must come to grips with what the salary cap's purpose is. I see it as two-fold. Parity and controlled expenses. Would this work around fit within those parameters? by giving a team an asset (pick) of value- sure. On 1/23/2020 at 3:24 PM, Don Otreply said: Still nah, it reeks of fantasy football. Ok boomer 56 minutes ago, Billy Claude said: This would defeat one of the primary purposes of the salary cap - competitive parity. Right now if a team picks up a bad contract there is an immediate financial penalty - the team has to pay the player. If a team can trade away cap space for draft choices there is very little financial penalty for that team. Some owners will decide to its is better to have larger profit than fielding a winning team. Other owners in larger markets with larger local income will go way over the cap. You will essentially get the same situation as baseball. right but if the team with limited cash flow was loading up on day two draft picks and the cowboys are getting an extra couple vets... is that bad? On 1/23/2020 at 12:50 PM, Watkins90 said: Everyone gets so much a year. Let's say $200 million for a nice round number. You have $89 million in cap space and trade $5 million of that to another team for a third round pick. You lose that cap space for that year. It's gone. That team can then use it for that season. After that season, that $5 million is gone and you can't roll it over if you don't use it. For the team that traded the cap space, you just go back to whatever you would be at based on the cap space for the next season. It would get hard with having to make sure you are spending so much of your cap over the three year average. all you do is move it on the balance sheet and treat it as any other cap. 1 team has 195 the other 205 and any rollover or 3 year averages are based off the adjusted numbers.
Don Otreply Posted January 27, 2020 Posted January 27, 2020 2 minutes ago, NoSaint said: by giving a team an asset (pick) of value- sure. Ok boomer right but if the team with limited cash flow was loading up on day two draft picks and the cowboys are getting an extra couple vets... is that bad? Boomer! and proud of it, oh and is boomer all you got? if so no wonder your generation sucks... ??? Go Bills!!!
njbuff Posted January 27, 2020 Posted January 27, 2020 2 hours ago, Franchiseneedsme said: I would take Foles as our backup along with his 22M cap hit for the Jags #9 pick. Jerry Judy would be a #1 it will never be done, but it’s interesting.
djp14150 Posted January 27, 2020 Posted January 27, 2020 On 1/23/2020 at 8:57 AM, MAJBobby said: i could maybe get on board to something like NHL you can retain salary of a traded player twice. But not flat trading space like discussed. If you trade a pkayer you paid bonus aid bonus money to its in you recapture that in a trade. You buy outa player in juneyou can spread out recapture over two years. unlike nhl contracts, nfl contracts nfl contracts are heavy bonus money because their contracts are not guaranteed like in the nhl.
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