The Next Pandemic: SARS-CoV-2/COVID-19

[Boatdrinks]

20 minutes ago, Doc Brown said:

That was an Illinois protester as their governor is Jewish.  I don't believe Whitmer is.  Disgusting none the less but you can't take one idiot and apply that to every protester.

 

If states start demanding people go back to work while the deaths are still this high you're going to see even more protests.

States will simply be allowing businesses to reopen. A State will not demand that any individual return to work unless they actually work in State government. Any employee has the freedom to either continue working at a particular business ( provided the business still exists) or to find work they consider more suitable. 

[Doc Brown]

Just now, Boatdrinks said:

States will simply be allowing businesses to reopen. A State will not demand that any individual return to work unless they actually work in State government. Any employee has the freedom to either continue working at a particular business ( provided the business still exists) or to find work they consider more suitable. 

True but the state can take their unemployment benefits away if they refuse to return to work because it would be considered a voluntary quit.

[keepthefaith]

19 minutes ago, Doc Brown said:

True but the state can take their unemployment benefits away if they refuse to return to work because it would be considered a voluntary quit.

 

In Illinois all power to the employee. Employers are treated like dirt by the ILDES.  Actually dirt is treated better. 

[Boatdrinks]

25 minutes ago, Doc Brown said:

True but the state can take their unemployment benefits away if they refuse to return to work because it would be considered a voluntary quit.

Correct. Why should someone continue to receive unemployment if they voluntarily quit their job ? Most of the new unemployment claims of the last month or two were only filed because businesses were told they could not operate. So an employee deciding not to go back to a job that is waiting for them is absolutely a voluntary quit. 

[dubs]

When this is all said and done, what’s the death rate going to be, 0.2% - 0.6%?  Is a complete collapse of our way of life and surrendering basic rights worth avoiding that risk? 
 

I get that at first we needed to pause and see what we were dealing with, but that time has long passed. It’s well past the time people need to start making decisions for themselves based on their own circumstances and risk factors. Not let bozos in the state houses, mayor mansions, and county executives tell everyone what they can and cannot do.

[meazza]

28 minutes ago, dubs said:

When this is all said and done, what’s the death rate going to be, 0.2% - 0.6%?  Is a complete collapse of our way of life and surrendering basic rights worth avoiding that risk? 
 

I get that at first we needed to pause and see what we were dealing with, but that time has long passed. It’s well past the time people need to start making decisions for themselves based on their own circumstances and risk factors. Not let bozos in the state houses, mayor mansions, and county executives tell everyone what they can and cannot do.

0.4. Our health minister says we have roughly 250,000 cases (based on the serology tests from other areas) and there are approximately 1300 deaths so that must be the death rate.

Edited May 3, 2020 by meazza

[Justice]

49 minutes ago, dubs said:

When this is all said and done, what’s the death rate going to be, 0.2% - 0.6%?  Is a complete collapse of our way of life and surrendering basic rights worth avoiding that risk? 
 

I get that at first we needed to pause and see what we were dealing with, but that time has long passed. It’s well past the time people need to start making decisions for themselves based on their own circumstances and risk factors. Not let bozos in the state houses, mayor mansions, and county executives tell everyone what they can and cannot do.

I hate the idea of opening back up, but I realize it’s necessary. We have no choice. My only issue is the numbers. Our numbers are based on a lockdown and there’s no real way of knowing what those numbers will be once we reopen.

I’m hesitant to believe the projections, because everyone has been wrong about this virus from the start and all throughout. In the end herd immunity is the only way to survive, though. It’ll be tough, but humans have survived far worse and we’re still here. 

[Doc Brown]

1 hour ago, Boatdrinks said:

Correct. Why should someone continue to receive unemployment if they voluntarily quit their job ? Most of the new unemployment claims of the last month or two were only filed because businesses were told they could not operate. So an employee deciding not to go back to a job that is waiting for them is absolutely a voluntary quit. 

I'm just wondering the legality of it if the employee feels the job is unsafe to return because of the coronavirus.  What kind of protections do employers have?  Can employees sue the employer if they contract the virus after returning to work?  Can family members of a dead employee sue the employer who returned to work?

[B-Man]

Gov. Brown Extends Oregon COVID-19 State of Emergency to July 6

by Alex Zielinski • May 2, 2020 at 11:00 am

 

Oregon Gov. Kate Brown quietly extended Oregon's coronavirus state of emergency by two months Friday.

Brown's original emergency declaration, signed March 8, was set to expire on May 7. On Friday, she signed an executive order renewing that declaration and setting a new end date of July 6.

The extension allows Brown's many executive orders linked to COVID-19, such as rules around large gatherings, business closures, and eviction prohibitions, to remain in place for another 60 days. Brown is able to extend or terminate this emergency declaration at any point.

Brown penned the extension a day before a planned rally outside the Oregon Capitol in Salem, where protesters are currently decrying Brown's decisions to temporarily shutter parts of the state's economy to slow the spread of COVID-19.

 

https://www.portlandmercury.com/blogtown/2020/05/02/28372972/gov-brown-extends-oregon-covid-19-state-of-emergency-to-july-6

 

 

 

 

Gov. Kate Brown extends Oregon coronavirus state of emergency to July 6

Today 11:36 AM

 

By Kale Williams | The Oregonian/OregonLive

Gov. Kate Brown signed an executive order Friday extending Oregon’s state of emergency to July 6 in response to the coronavirus outbreak.

The move comes roughly two months after the original declaration was signed March 8. It was set to expire May 7.

The new executive order gives the governor the legal authority to maintain the orders she’s issued thus far — including the stay-home order, a moratorium on residential and commercial evictions and other financial stimulus measures — and issue new ones as she sees fit, said Charles Boyle, a spokesman for the governor’s office.

“Extending the state of emergency declaration allows those orders to stay in effect, however the Governor can still lift her orders as the COVID-19 situation warrants, as she did with her order delaying non-urgent medical procedures,” Boyle wrote in an email. “Our efforts to move forward with safely reopening Oregon will be gradual, incremental, and based on science and data.”

The new order extends the state of emergency for 60 days, but also allows Brown to terminate it earlier than that if deemed appropriate.

 

https://www.oregonlive.com/coronavirus/2020/05/gov-kate-brown-extends-oregon-coronavirus-state-of-emergency-to-july-6.html

 

 

I see nothing of "but they are loosening in the middle of May"

 

 

 

 

Edited May 3, 2020 by B-Man

[Boatdrinks]

1 hour ago, Doc Brown said:

I'm just wondering the legality of it if the employee feels the job is unsafe to return because of the coronavirus.  What kind of protections do employers have?  Can employees sue the employer if they contract the virus after returning to work?  Can family members of a dead employee sue the employer who returned to work?

From a legal standpoint, I heard a prominent Buffalo attorney state that proving where someone contracted a virus would be extremely difficult. ( I believe he was asked a similar question to yours)  Now, if an employee feels a job is not safe enough for them is a personal decision. No different than say, deciding not to take a job that involves working with high voltage power lines, or working in a hospital , or becoming a Cop. It’s not a valid reason for unemployment. Viruses are part of the world at large. If someone just can’t deal with the existence of a virus , they might be able to get disability for mental reasons. Not unemployment, though. 

[Kemp]

2 hours ago, Doc Brown said:

I'm just wondering the legality of it if the employee feels the job is unsafe to return because of the coronavirus.  What kind of protections do employers have?  Can employees sue the employer if they contract the virus after returning to work?  Can family members of a dead employee sue the employer who returned to work?

 

Anyone can sue anyone. No one knows for sure the outcomes of these types of lawsuits.

[transplantbillsfan]

 

I know most of you won't take this seriously because of your flawed weatherman logic. "Look at the source! They got _________ wrong!"

 

82 Administration officials, outside advisers and other experts with direct knowledge of the White House's handling of the pandemic seems pretty hard to completely dismiss.

 

 

So many issues, but too many of you will just dismiss the reporting as baseless...

 

But...

 

I will ask this of the folks over here based on your wild mistrust of MSM, which I recently learned from you is "mainstream media:"

 

Why the ***** do you so adamantly back a President who has Fox News hosts like Laura Ingraham to the White House late at night with her own handpicked guests in tow to push controversial drugs like hydroxychloroquine, which has, at the VERY least, been found to be significantly more dangerous than the President's initial "what do you have to lose?" attitude in terms of trying it.

 

There's just way too much cognitive dissonance over here in the extreme mistrust of mainstream media while Donald Trump uses some of its most controversial, narcissistic and frankly idiotic members (Hannity) as some of his closest advisers to ultimately guide his own policy, which has VERY clearly been happening for years now, just as it continued immediately after his late night White House visit from Ingraham.

Edited May 3, 2020 by transplantbillsfan

[shoshin]

7 hours ago, dubs said:

When this is all said and done, what’s the death rate going to be, 0.2% - 0.6%?  Is a complete collapse of our way of life and surrendering basic rights worth avoiding that risk? 
 

I get that at first we needed to pause and see what we were dealing with, but that time has long passed. It’s well past the time people need to start making decisions for themselves based on their own circumstances and risk factors. Not let bozos in the state houses, mayor mansions, and county executives tell everyone what they can and cannot do.

 

The overall death rate is maybe the wrong stat to focus on. Hospitalization usage affects us all and death rate among older and at risk people are the concerning numbers to manage. 

Edited May 3, 2020 by shoshin

[shoshin]

 

Good Covid model summary here on death projections through May 23 showing mid 90K dead with number still climbing. The reopening will drive up June numbers faster than we climbed before ( we started with many fewer cases on March 1). 

 

Peak average deaths haven't declined noticeably yet. I expect there will be a slow decline than an increase through the summer rising into the fall. 

Edited May 3, 2020 by shoshin

[Reality Check]

20 minutes ago, shoshin said:

 

The overall death rate is maybe the wrong stat to focus on. Hospitalization usage affects us all and death rate among older and at risk people are the concerning numbers to manage. 

What concerns me the most are the increased sounds of ambulance sirens in my rural town. I talked with an EMT friend and we lost a number of seniors due to lack of "elective" surgeries that they were waiting on, and one that could not receive their cancer treatments. These are retirees with bought and paid for medical coverage who died unnecessarily. We must make a distinction between being swabbed for evidence of RNA in the sinus and those that are actually ill from it. When the dust settles, I feel like we will learn a great deal more about how to strengthen our immune systems through lifestyle and dietary changes.

[shoshin]

Just now, Reality Check said:

What concerns me the most are the increased sounds of ambulance sirens in my rural town. I talked with an EMT friend and we lost a number of seniors due to lack of "elective" surgeries that they were waiting on, and one that could not receive their cancer treatments. These are retirees with bought and paid for medical coverage who died unnecessarily. We must make a distinction between being swabbed for evidence of RNA in the sinus and those that are actually ill from it. When the dust settles, I feel like we will learn a great deal more about how to strengthen our immune systems through lifestyle and dietary changes.

 

Given how this disproportionately affects people who are obese, diabetic, or have hypertension, we have a good line already on how lifestyle matters. Not all of those conditions are brought on by lifestyle but many are. 

[plenzmd1]

1 hour ago, shoshin said:

 

The overall death rate is maybe the wrong stat to focus on. Hospitalization usage affects us all and death rate among older and at risk people are the concerning numbers to manage. 

Why?

[Kemp]

1 hour ago, Reality Check said:

What concerns me the most are the increased sounds of ambulance sirens in my rural town. I talked with an EMT friend and we lost a number of seniors due to lack of "elective" surgeries that they were waiting on, and one that could not receive their cancer treatments. These are retirees with bought and paid for medical coverage who died unnecessarily. We must make a distinction between being swabbed for evidence of RNA in the sinus and those that are actually ill from it. When the dust settles, I feel like we will learn a great deal more about how to strengthen our immune systems through lifestyle and dietary changes.

 

Which kinds of elective surgeries, if not performed, lead to death?

 

I know 3 people currently undergoing cancer treatments at Sloan-Kettering in NYC. None of them has had an appointment postponed, so it's tough for me to believe patients are missing treatments unless patients are too scared to go.

[shoshin]

13 minutes ago, plenzmd1 said:

Why?

 

Do you think we should not try to minimize deaths of the group of people most affected by this?

 

We have two groups of people in the US right now: (1) Those that will not be affected by this almost at all or will just get an illness they can manage with OTC meds, and (2) Those that will end up in the hospital and/or die. Group 1 >> Group 2.

 

We need to let the people in (1) get back to work in a reasonable way that minimizes spread to the people in group (2), and for those in group (2), we need to take better care of them. 

 

 

 

 

Edited May 3, 2020 by shoshin

[Kemp]

Just now, shoshin said:

 

Do you think we should not try to minimize deaths of the group of people most affected by this?

 

We have two groups of people in the US right now: (1) Those that will not be affected by this almost at all or will just get an illness they can manage with OTC meds, and (2) Those that will end up in the hospital and die. We need to let the people in (1) get back to work in a reasonable way to minimize spread to the people in group (2), and for those in group (2), we need to take better care of them. 

 

 

 

 

 

There's at least a 3rd group. Some young people are having strokes and blood clots even if they didn't have a serious case. It appears that the circulatory system is a target of the virus.

 

http://www.usatoday.com/