The Next Pandemic: SARS-CoV-2/COVID-19

[SectionC3]

4 minutes ago, 3rdnlng said:

Seriously, you're going to repeat that crap? Who do you think gets the HCQ treatment, people who have very little symptoms or those that are seriously ill? 

 

My favorite member of the snowflake list is back!  

 

Also, what do you mean by "little symptoms?"  Is is a few significant symptoms?  Or many insignificant symptoms?  It might help some to understand the point that you try to make. 

Edited April 24, 2020 by SectionC3

[Foxx]

11 minutes ago, Scraps said:

It is unproven that the drug is effective on Covid-19 and both of those drugs can lead to heart arrhythmia.

 

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/donald-trump/mayo-clinic-cardiologist-inexcusable-ignore-hydroxychloroquine-side-effects-n1178776

https://www.nbcnews.com/health/health-news/family-new-york-woman-blames-hydroxychloroquine-combo-fatal-heart-attack-n1185451

 

as i said, clinicals were done long ago. we know the dangers as well as acceptable dosages. are you saying that we shouldn't give it to lupus patients either?

Edited April 24, 2020 by Foxx

[oldmanfan]

Just now, Foxx said:

are you going to argue that vitamin D in the body is not required for optimal health?

No.  But I will argue that Vitamin D levels have anything to do with corona virus infectivity without some actual data. 

 

And by the way, hydroxychlroquine acts in known diseases by altering endosomal synthesis from the Golgi.  in my conversations with a virologist colleague the conoavirus has its own proteins for this function thus the drug would not have much effect.

1 minute ago, Foxx said:

as i said, clinicals were done long ago. we know the dangers as well as acceptable dosages. are you saying that we shouldn't give it to lupus patients either?

It has been studied in lupus patients, yes?  Effective dosages, side effects?  Yes?  

8 minutes ago, 3rdnlng said:

Seriously, you're going to repeat that crap? Who do you think gets the HCQ treatment, people who have very little symptoms or those that are seriously ill? 

That’s one of the problems with the current studies.  We don’t know if the treatment and non-treatment arms are comparable.

[Scraps]

Just now, Foxx said:

as i said, clinicals were done long ago. we know the dangers as well as acceptable dosages. are you saying that we shouldn't give it to lupus patients either?

No not at all.  It has been proven effective on lupus and arthritis sufferers and they should get their medication.  I have a problem when those people can't get their medication because there is a shortage of the drug because of something on which it has not been proven effective.  Much of this shortage is because of hype on the part of Trump and Fox News.  This hype crowds out space for other treatments to perform clinical trials.

[Foxx]

9 minutes ago, oldmanfan said:

The idea as I understand it is to alter endosomal function but it is not clear whether that affects corona virus infectivity.  Also from my understanding it is not clear whether dosages used for know diseases where it has positive effects such as malaria and arthritis are similar.  The cell biology of infectivity differs between parasites, bacteria and viruses.

 

The side effects as you indicate are known, but can be significant.  For example the cardiovascular ones.  Some early observations now suggest clotting disorders in younger infected individuals which will need to be watched.

 

i’d live For studies to show a true positive effect of the drug against Covid-19.  But let’s get real data.

this is why the Z-pak is necessary, to facilitate the cell receptors ability to let the hydroxychloroquine do it's work. 

 

i look at it this way... if you are going to die for this CV-19, what have you got to lose by taking the hydroxych. the studies you are requesting are going to take exactly how long to complete? are they going to use vitamin C as the blind?

[Greybeard]

28 minutes ago, oldmanfan said:

The drug causes significant cardiovascular side effects.  According to the limited studies several patients died from these.  Why are you confused?

 

    Guess they shouldn't be handing it out to treat Malaria.

[shoshin]

1 hour ago, Deranged Rhino said:

You're better than this, shoshin.

 

Do you think something gives you the right to condescend to people? 

[Foxx]

:sigh:

[Deranged Rhino]

3 minutes ago, shoshin said:

 

Do you think something gives you the right to condescend to people? 

 

It's not condensation. It's truth. You're better than that post. 

[3rdnlng]

17 minutes ago, IDBillzFan said:

 

You're not going to get me to defend Trump's extemporaneous nature. I genuinely wish he would open with a few comments and let others talk. 

 

But that's not what we have.

 

What I do not understand is this odd sensation from the media that says they will no longer cover Trump's press conferences, and then when none of their followers see the press conferences, the same media parse out statements and the entire leftist world jumps on them completely out of context.

 

Trump is an embarrassing speaker. But you simply need to understand and accept that pretty much everyone in this schittstorm is embarrassing. The left/media's desire to destroy Trump is exhausting, and if he'd pace himself a little more, the rest of the world would see it.

 

 

Certain media outlets decided not to cover the briefings live and to just report on what they think is important. In other words they want to censure everything that won't make Trump look bad. Coincidentally this decision was made when Trump's popularity started to go up. Those media outlets thought that the briefings were taking the place of Trump's rallies. 

[TH3]

2 minutes ago, shoshin said:

 

Do you think something gives you the right to condescend to people? 

Well....he has posted several thousand times about the deep state, the Clinton Dynasty, the global warming hoax, and Benghazi! ...among other things....he knows pretty much every thing....just ask him!

[Deranged Rhino]

Just now, TH3 said:

Well....he has posted several thousand times about the deep state, the Clinton Dynasty, the global warming hoax, and Benghazi! ...among other things....he knows pretty much every thing....just ask him!

 

My track record exceeds yours by miles. Go back to pushing fake news stories about fish tank cleaners. Or triple down on your Trump/Russia debacle.  

[Buffalo_Gal]

3 minutes ago, Foxx said:

:sigh:

Since this morning.

At least we've moved on from light treatment not being a thing. I am sure we will circle back to it as we are on hydroxychloroquine again... for the 43rd time. Around and around we go, where it stops? 2024.



 

[SoCal Deek]

1 minute ago, Buffalo_Gal said:

Since this morning.

At least we've moved on from light treatment not being a thing. I am sure we will circle back to it as we are on hydroxychloroquine again... for the 43rd time. Around and around we go, where it stops? 2024.



 

It shows how BORING this entire debacle has become to everyone. Remember the good ol days when we had Adam Schiff to kick around? 

[oldmanfan]

13 minutes ago, Greybeard said:

 

    Guess they shouldn't be handing it out to treat Malaria.

Again it has been studied in that disease and dosages are understood.  It has not been formally studied for this virus.  

 

Science people.

[Deranged Rhino]

1 minute ago, SoCal Deek said:

It shows how BORING this entire debacle has become to everyone. Remember the good ol days when we had Adam Schiff to kick around? 

 

That's why the Friday news on Flynn and Durham are more interesting. And more important (which is also why this story blew up today, to drown those stories out). 

 

It's SOP. 

[3rdnlng]

14 minutes ago, Scraps said:

No not at all.  It has been proven effective on lupus and arthritis sufferers and they should get their medication.  I have a problem when those people can't get their medication because there is a shortage of the drug because of something on which it has not been proven effective.  Much of this shortage is because of hype on the part of Trump and Fox News.  This hype crowds out space for other treatments to perform clinical trials.

HAHAHAHA. Wasn't it you who complained about 30 million dosages being ordered when we don't know with certainty how well it will work? Now you're telling us that you're afraid of a shortage for other uses? No bias on your part, eh? 

[Scraps]

1 minute ago, 3rdnlng said:

HAHAHAHA. Wasn't it you who complained about 30 million dosages being ordered when we don't know with certainty how well it will work? Now you're telling us that you're afraid of a shortage for other uses? No bias on your part, eh? 

No it wasn't me who said that.

 

Yes I said I am afraid of shortages for people who use the drug for other conditions.  How is that biased?  

 

And someone complaining about 30 million dosages being ordered when we don't know with certainty how well it will work on Covid-19 probably has similar thoughts to mine.

Edited April 24, 2020 by Scraps

[3rdnlng]

23 minutes ago, oldmanfan said:

No.  But I will argue that Vitamin D levels have anything to do with corona virus infectivity without some actual data. 

 

And by the way, hydroxychlroquine acts in known diseases by altering endosomal synthesis from the Golgi.  in my conversations with a virologist colleague the conoavirus has its own proteins for this function thus the drug would not have much effect.

It has been studied in lupus patients, yes?  Effective dosages, side effects?  Yes?  

That’s one of the problems with the current studies.  We don’t know if the treatment and non-treatment arms are comparable.

No, that would take a little common sense, wouldn't it?

[oldmanfan]

15 minutes ago, Foxx said:

this is why the Z-pak is necessary, to facilitate the cell receptors ability to let the hydroxychloroquine do it's work. 

 

i look at it this way... if you are going to die for this CV-19, what have you got to lose by taking the hydroxych. the studies you are requesting are going to take exactly how long to complete? are they going to use vitamin C as the blind?

At this point if the drug is effective we don't Know at what stage of the disease it is so.  Taking your example, I suspect but of course don’t know that if you at the point where it is expected you would die (poor O2 data, etc.) it seems unlikely to reverse disease that is so far along.  Looking at diseases where it is used it seems that the drug is used fairly early in in the disease progression or as a prophylactic treatment.  

 

So let’s say you have a patient early on in the disease, you give them the drug, they develop a significant side effect and die.  Now you have lost a patient that may have been one of the majority that can fight off the infection with supportive care.

 

Docs can give this drug based on compassionate reasons.  But it doesn’t mean it’s effective.  I hope the studies ultimately show it does.