njbuff Posted April 6, 2020 Posted April 6, 2020 2 minutes ago, meazza said: I also recently read a story from a doctor who prescribed this to 79 patients and I believe 2 died though in fairness, they were all from a nursing home. Seriously the ring wing and left wing spin machines need to shut the ***** up. Is this the same drug that could cause issues with people with heart conditions ? Probably the same people who would have complications with covid. Diabetic patients like myself could be extremely vulnerable to this drug. At least that is what I was told. I will believe it if it came down to it. Luckily I am so far away from everyone that I don't get this disease, so this might all be mute. ?
billsfan1959 Posted April 6, 2020 Posted April 6, 2020 14 minutes ago, Doc said: Again, no one did anything about the disease. Trump was the first in the world to restrict travel from China. Meanwhile the Dems have stated (until recently) that they would have kept borders open. And this seems logical given they don't want to appear racist. How many hundreds to thousands more infected people would have entered to silently spread this in the beginning? Right. Wishing more was done sooner is much different than reasonably expecting Trump or anyone else to know what serious steps would need to be taken before the end of Feb. When you point out he did more sooner than any one else, like restrict travel from China, they counter with things like, “Well over 300,00 people who had been in China traveled here before he enacted the ban.” They fail to mention that most of them traveled here when there were few cases outside of China, the WHO was still telling the world there were no instances of human to human transfer of the virus, and that most Democrats were opposed to the ban. I have yet to have one of them provide what evidence they feel was compelling enough to them to say It is reasonable to believe Trump should have known how serious it was going to be and should have done more sooner. 1
Buffalo Bills Fan Posted April 6, 2020 Posted April 6, 2020 1 minute ago, njbuff said: Diabetic patients like myself could be extremely vulnerable to this drug. At least that is what I was told. I will believe it if it came down to it. Luckily I am so far away from everyone that I don't get this disease, so this might all be mute. ? Have more room? lol
meazza Posted April 6, 2020 Posted April 6, 2020 1 minute ago, njbuff said: Diabetic patients like myself could be extremely vulnerable to this drug. At least that is what I was told. I will believe it if it came down to it. Luckily I am so far away from everyone that I don't get this disease, so this might all be mute. ? Stay safe my friend. You don’t want to miss the season the bills finally take it!
njbuff Posted April 6, 2020 Posted April 6, 2020 Just now, Buffalo Bills Fan said: Have more room? lol Stay away, unless you know how to cook. ? Just now, meazza said: Stay safe my friend. You don’t want to miss the season the bills finally take it! You too. All we can do is take this day by boring azz day until this thing goes away. This political discourse does nobody no favors. 1 1
Chef Jim Posted April 6, 2020 Posted April 6, 2020 5 minutes ago, meazza said: I also recently read a story from a doctor who prescribed this to 79 patients and I believe 2 died though in fairness, they were all from a nursing home. Doctor: I’m sorry but you have contracted Covid-19. It’s an advanced stage and things look grim Me: This is terrible! Is there anything you can do? Doctor: Well yes. We have this drug that may save you but it has bad side effects. Me: Give me two! 1
Buffalo Bills Fan Posted April 6, 2020 Posted April 6, 2020 2 minutes ago, njbuff said: Stay away, unless you know how to cook. ? You too. All we can do is take this day by boring azz day until this thing goes away. This political discourse does nobody no favors. lol joking around but stay safe man.
njbuff Posted April 6, 2020 Posted April 6, 2020 Just now, Buffalo Bills Fan said: lol joking around but stay safe man. I know. Stay safe and don't get this shyt. 1
Buffalo Bills Fan Posted April 6, 2020 Posted April 6, 2020 (edited) 37 minutes ago, Doc said: Again, no one did anything about the disease. Trump was the first in the world to restrict travel from China. Meanwhile the Dems have stated (until recently) that they would have kept borders open. And this seems logical given they don't want to appear racist. How many hundreds to thousands more infected people would have entered to silently spread this in the beginning? Just hate the dems act and talk like all saviors but would do lots of nothing...... Edited April 6, 2020 by Buffalo Bills Fan 1
Boatdrinks Posted April 6, 2020 Posted April 6, 2020 4 hours ago, GG said: As expected, a long-winded deflection of the real cause of the spread of the outbreak, where there was still confusion of how the virus is spread and the nonchalant attitude by all health officials that the American public shouldn't be concerned as late as March. Not having enough tests in January or February for a completely new virus is far down the line in identifying what actually went wrong, and sure enough WaPo is giving China a pass. Even if these tests were available by some miracle, they would have done nothing to slow the spread, because there was no protocols to administer the test, the tests would have been sent to CA & WA, the logical places for the initial outbreak and no ability for proper tracing of upstream and downstream contacts of infected individuals. Enough with the ventilator talk, too, because they don't cure the infirm. Instead, the health officials needed to focus their attention on prevention, but didn't know how to react, because they were duped by China and WHO. But, other than Yep, a lot of unrealistic scenarios assumed in that long winded blame -game piece. The type of massive testing needed to have any hope of containing the virus doesn’t exist and couldn’t be performed in the time frame needed. In a perfect world there may have been a way. This virus simply spreads to easily and the country is too vast and open to have had any chance to keep it out or even contain it. 1
transplantbillsfan Posted April 6, 2020 Posted April 6, 2020 (edited) 57 minutes ago, billsfan1959 said: The article claimed that Trump failed to do anything from the time anyone knew about this virus on Dec 31st, until the beginning of March, yet, literally offered no evidence, whatsoever, that provides anything close to a compelling argument that Trump, should have taken any other steps than he did before the end of February. No. The article didn't claim this. Proves you didn't read it. Quote If the article is going to claim he failed to act during that time frame, then provide some evidence as to why he should have. They provided nothing. Not one bit of evidence. They discussed other things that I might even agree with; however, as to the point of delay: Nothing. Again... more proof you didn't read. Oy. This is just sad. Quote Now, please provide us with the evidence that shows Trump should have known, before the end of February, how serious this virus was going to be outside of China. Don't quote us another article with no actual facts. Tell us in your own words and cite the evidence that leads you to that conclusion. If you want to have a real discussion, now is your chance. You first. This is pathetic. Again. Stop distracting everyone with your arrogance and defend your initial claim that the article is bull####. You're the one who made that statement first. The onus is on you to prove it. Too bad you clearly can't. You sure do like chasing your own tail and wasting time, though. Edited April 6, 2020 by transplantbillsfan
Gene Frenkle Posted April 6, 2020 Posted April 6, 2020 2 hours ago, TheProcess said: I’m sorry, but for Christ sake, the guy laid it all out in a ridiculously long post with legit information from a reputably sourced article. But I guess that’s just fake news. Nothing but constant deflection around here. Reminds me of why I’ve never spent any time in the dark underbelly of TBD that is the PPP section. It’s clear this is just an extension of the Trump apologist zone. Don’t like the guy? Get out! Fine I’ll go, but first... The China problem is known. I agree, they F’d up by not being forthcoming and suppressing information from the rest of the world. A huge amount of blame is at their feet. Can’t trust them, and that’s always been the case. But based on their track record, don’t you think the situation warranted a little skepticism or intrigue until proven otherwise? Instead of blowing it off, didn’t the administration at least owe us that? At what point do we hold our #1 elected official accountable for his actions? Never? Ok great. Maybe you, but not me. Believe me, I’m not willing to exonerate states either. It’s mind boggling how some state leaders have reacted to this too, and they own some blame in how they’ve handled this. It’s certainly not 100% on Trump. But it’s incredible how devoted the Trump base is. The guy is seriously like Teflon. People just let the guy skate because he’s got our best interest at heart. Right. The guy doesn’t give a damn about you, me, or anyone in between. His inability to take accountability and accept blame is astounding. Just wait until Easter when this hoax is all over. Life will be back to normal and the guy will roll in a whole new cabinet of yes men and ego strokers. Wash. Rinse. Repeat. ? People are still so hung up on and upset at Obama nearly four years after the guy walked out of the White House, that they’ll literally look past every questionable or poor decision Trump makes and tout it as great as long as Obama didn’t do it, it undoes something he previously did, or it’s the opposite of what he would’ve done. Trump supporters tell everyone else to move on and move forward, but why can’t they? Completely stuck on Obama. And this is coming from someone who didn’t vote for Obama either time. It’s just irrational and misguided hatred. Let it go. I don’t even know why I bother because there’s no convincing anyone on here or otherwise to change their opinion. And that’s ok. I’m not asking you to. But can anyone at least acknowledge the President of this great nation shares some of the blame on how poorly this has gone so far? Is that really too much to ask? Feel like I’m living in the GD twilight zone. Btw - I know I’m just giving you all what you want with this post. Another log for the fire. I don’t care if anyone responds to this post, ignores it, or emoji rolls their eyes at it. I’m out of here after this post and won’t be back to comment further in this forum. It’s pointless to be here and clear my type of thinking isn’t welcome in these parts. I only bother coming to TBD to talk Bills. If you need me, you can find me on the main forum and roll your eyes at any misguided Bills take I have up there. Peace and love. I’ll show myself out. 5 hours ago, Chef Jim said: You new here? ? ☝️
Deranged Rhino Posted April 6, 2020 Posted April 6, 2020 5 hours ago, Buffalo Bills Fan said: Right . In the end Gates sound like back tracked. Won't be bad but thing's won't go normal until vaccine. He's not making any sense lol. It makes sense when you remember he’s selling vaccines. Not doing them for free. (and it helps when you remember he believes in depopulation to save the environment, yet he spends his philanthropic time creating vaccines and fighting malaria — both of which run counter to that idea. Which is just to say, he’s a complicated guy.) 4 hours ago, transplantbillsfan said: You called the article bull#### without any proof whatsoever. I asked you to prove that bold claim. Clearly you can't and you're just trying to distract everyone right now so you don't look so foolish. Coward Still haven’t answered the question... But that’s not shocking. You’re allergic to the whole intellectual honesty thing. 1 1
daz28 Posted April 6, 2020 Posted April 6, 2020 2 hours ago, Chef Jim said: Doctor: I’m sorry but you have contracted Covid-19. It’s an advanced stage and things look grim Me: This is terrible! Is there anything you can do? Doctor: Well yes. We have this drug that may save you but it has bad side effects. Me: Give me two! I agree with this to a point. If I think I'm on my last gasp(and many people will), I'd say fire away. That's your right, imo. I was going to go all out an try to explain, but truth is the doctors don't understand it yet. If they don't understand it, they cannot make a treatment plan. There is no precedence in medical history where a rumor started a treatment plan, besides rub some dirt on it.
transplantbillsfan Posted April 6, 2020 Posted April 6, 2020 (edited) 2 hours ago, Deranged Rhino said: Still haven’t answered the question... But that’s not shocking. You’re allergic to the whole intellectual honesty thing. Funny that you excuse the guy who was asked a question initially and avoided actually answering it while accusing the guy still waiting on the answer to his initial question as avoiding something. Learn what intellectual honesty is before you baselessly accuse someone of it. Par for the course for you, though. You are a massive hypocrite. A garrulous hypocrite, but a hypocrite nonetheless. Speaking of... @billsfan1959 Edited April 6, 2020 by transplantbillsfan
\GoBillsInDallas/ Posted April 6, 2020 Posted April 6, 2020 Watch out for the black helicopters while you're at it
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted April 6, 2020 Posted April 6, 2020 1 hour ago, \GoBillsInDallas/ said: Watch out for the black helicopters while you're at it 5G has real problems, like being an integral piece of China's surveillance state. Buts it's got nothing to do with this. I'd have an easier time believing that this is a Chinese biological weapon.
fansince88 Posted April 6, 2020 Posted April 6, 2020 8 hours ago, B-Man said: Incompetence or Sabotage ? . Well, with our leaders in NY there is evidence of the former but could be sabotage.
shoshin Posted April 6, 2020 Posted April 6, 2020 (edited) 7 hours ago, B-Man said: He’s done his job for decades, but he’s never faced a crisis like this, and at 79 he’s not super mentally flexible. Double-blind experiments are the norm, but this isn’t a normal time. Taking shots at Fauci for his reluctance to jump all in on HCQ is not called for. Fauci is not against trying it or prescribing it. He is against saying that it works. Covid-19 is a disease that most healthy people walk away from. HCQ, which has a lot of complications (that I've personally experienced), is often not given to people who have those complications...HCQ is usually given to healthy people. So doctors who have given HCQ to healthy patients are seeing good results. Or are they? Or are they giving HCQ to just younger people who tolerate it. OR older people. Or people who are on other medications...etc. The above is why we need studies to determine its actual effects. As a general anti-viral, it's been tried before and hoped many times to help against viruses. It's also failed many times. Fauci is a veteran of seeing those failures. Here's an excerpt from a paper on HCQ from 2015 that hints at what Fauci knows and most people do not: Quote Hydroxychloroquine (HCQ) is an antimalarial drug also used in treating autoimmune diseases. Its antiviral activity was demonstrated in restricting HIV infection in vitro; however, the clinical implications remain controversial. Infection with dengue virus (DENV) is a global public health problem, and we lack an antiviral drug for DENV. Here, we evaluated the anti-DENV potential of treatment with HCQ. Immunofluorescence assays demonstrated that HCQ could inhibit DENV serotype 1–4 infection in vitro. RT-qPCR analysis of HCQ-treated cells showed induced expression of interferon (IFN)-related antiviral proteins and certain inflammatory cytokines. Mechanistic study suggested that HCQ activated the innate immune signaling pathways of IFN-β, AP-1, and NFκB. Knocking down mitochondrial antiviral signaling protein (MAVS), inhibiting TANK binding kinase 1 (TBK1)/inhibitor-κB kinase ɛ (IKKɛ), and blocking type I IFN receptor reduced the efficiency of HCQ against DENV-2 infection. Furthermore, HCQ significantly induced cellular production of reactive oxygen species (ROS), which was involved in the host defense system. Suppression of ROS production attenuated the innate immune activation and anti-DENV-2 effect of HCQ. In summary, HCQ triggers the host defense machinery by inducing ROS- and MAVS-mediated innate immune activation against DENV infection and may be a candidate drug for DENV infection. The above is for a dengue fever study...but note how cautious the authors are just because their assays looked good. They have seen this before. Quote Happily, he’s not managing to roadblock this, thanks largely I believe to Peter Navarro’s task force. Show me where Fauci tried to roadblock anything except the claims that it is working. Navarro doesn't know science. He knows tweets and anecdotes, which is all we have on this. Quote That poll, by the way, was of 6,227 physicians surveyed in 30 countries. In Spain, 72 percent of physicians said they had prescribed it. It makes sense that doctors will try it. Anecdotal evidence is all they have and HCQ is pretty widely available and well-studied. This is why they are prescribing anti-bacterials too. They are happy to throw anything at it they can. That doesn't mean it's working. And it also doesn't mean they should stop. Trump is pedaling hope, as he should. Fauci is pedaling science, as he should. Neither one is the bad guy. Discerning people should be hopeful but cautiously so on claims that HCQ can help. Edited April 6, 2020 by shoshin 2
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