The Next Pandemic: SARS-CoV-2/COVID-19

[BullBuchanan]

58 minutes ago, Boatdrinks said:

They’re both morons. DeBlasio wants prison cells to have kitchenettes and individual A/C ( not making it up) and Cuomo released 1200 “ non violent “ inmates last Friday night including some sex offenders. Two horrendous individuals. 

That's disingenuous. "Cuomo" didn't release them, DOCCS did. Second of all, they weren't released from sex offender crimes, they were released from being in jail due to technical parole violations. Do I think they should be free? No, but painting it the way you are is the typical sensationalism that we've come to expect from the right wing and their media.

[Deranged Rhino]

7 minutes ago, BullBuchanan said:

That's disingenuous. "Cuomo" didn't release them, DOCCS did. Second of all, they weren't released from sex offender crimes, they were released from being in jail due to technical parole violations. Do I think they should be free? No, but painting it the way you are is the typical sensationalism that we've come to expect from the right wing and their media.

Curious what you consider the right wing media... 

[Rob's House]

 

[BullBuchanan]

47 minutes ago, Doc Brown said:

I was actually pleasantly surprised at the extra unemployment benefits in that bill.  What more do you think should've been in the bill?

The bill certainly helps out a lot of people especially those likely to struggle the most, but certain people fall through the cracks. A person making $100k who gets laid off in South Carolina now has to survive on $326 a week in a market where jobs essentially dont exist, because they dont qualify for the increased unemployment stipend or the $1200 stimulus Not applying income to regional cost of living or individual circumstances is incredibly short-sighted.

There's also the issue that we're still pretending like our healthcare system works, amid it's failure. Hundreds of thousands of people, if not more, will go bankrupt as a result of this. I would have liked to see a plan to prevent that. I guess some insurance companies are waiving cost sharing, but the motives behind that must be dubious at best.

The biggest issue I have with the bill is how much of it is being used to bail out corporations. Small businesses? I'm on board.

6 minutes ago, Deranged Rhino said:

Curious what you consider the right wing media... 

Fox News, The Federalist, The Blaze, National Review, Rush Limbaugh, Breitbart, WSJ, Forbes, Drudge Report, Ben Shapiro, Jordan Peterson, and any version of a youtube video of a guy filming a video in his truck.

 

Edited April 1, 2020 by BullBuchanan

[Deranged Rhino]

14 minutes ago, BullBuchanan said:

Fox News, The Federalist, The Blaze, National Review, Rush Limbaugh, Breitbart, WSJ, Forbes, Drudge Report, Ben Shapiro, Jordan Peterson, and any version of a youtube video of a guy filming a video in his truck.

 

Figured. 
 

You’re still stuck in an old paradigm and haven’t learned that the right left split is not real — especially in the establishment news sources.  

(Or how to spot a cut out from a “journalist”) 

[Doc Brown]

34 minutes ago, BullBuchanan said:

The bill certainly helps out a lot of people especially those likely to struggle the most, but certain people fall through the cracks. A person making $100k who gets laid off in South Carolina now has to survive on $326 a week in a market where jobs essentially dont exist, because they dont qualify for the increased unemployment stipend or the $1200 stimulus Not applying income to regional cost of living or individual circumstances is incredibly short-sighted

I don't believe there's a maximum income limit for the increased unemployment federal benefits.  Anybody who qualifies for unemployment gets $600 a week from the federal government on top of what you qualify for at the state level.  I get the frustration with regional cost of living but it's difficult to differentiate at the federal level.

[BullBuchanan]

41 minutes ago, Doc Brown said:

I don't believe there's a maximum income limit for the increased unemployment federal benefits.  Anybody who qualifies for unemployment gets $600 a week from the federal government on top of what you qualify for at the state level.  I get the frustration with regional cost of living but it's difficult to differentiate at the federal level.

 

You're correct. I was mistaken with regards to the unemployment side of it.

[Hedge]

 

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Tucker's clip is well worth watching all the way through IMO.

 

 

[BullBuchanan]

1 hour ago, Deranged Rhino said:

Figured. 
 

You’re still stuck in an old paradigm and haven’t learned that the right left split is not real — especially in the establishment news sources.  

(Or how to spot a cut out from a “journalist”) 

Believe me, I understand that the media doesn't give a ***** about right vs left. They sell controversy and hype, but certain outlets pander to one side over the other while their sister stations owned by the same parent company feed the other side. I do take issue however, that the less factual among right wing outlets have a strong reputation for being extremely venomous at a personal level. Less factual left wing articles may play identity politics just as strongly, but they don't make actual enemies of fellow Americans and sow cultural divides the same way.

[BullBuchanan]

6 minutes ago, Hedge said:

 

----------------

Tucker's clip is well worth watching all the way through IMO.

 

 

They've had this traced back to Pangolins for months and unlike the horseshoe bat, there's a high probability that pangolins were in the market. Fox is always trying to find a conspiracy when there's a perfectly reasonable and obvious explanation. Occam's Razor and all that:
 

"Ever since the nexus for the outbreak of COVID-19 was traced back to a wet market in Hubei province, the search has been on to determine the virus's heritage. Initial studies of SARS-CoV-2's genome suggest it's highly possible that the virus emerged in a colony of horseshoe bats in Yunnan, a province that borders the south-east Asian country of Myanmar.

But if that is the case, it's hard to imagine how a bat became a source of infection in a densely populated city more than 1,000 kilometres to the north of its colony.

 

Granted, stalls in these Chinese wet markets sell a wide variety of live animals for food and traditional medicine, many of them sourced from Asia's tropics. Whether bats of any kind might have been present isn't clear, since the market was cleared long before the first indications of an outbreak were known.

 

Unlike horseshoe bats, though, the pangolin is almost guaranteed to have been on sale there.

The illicit sale of the endangered mammal - prized as a delicacy and a health tonic - is an 'open secret' throughout much of the nation, and a good place to start hunting for an intermediate host of the zoonotic virus currently wreaking havoc across the globe.

Frozen tissues from 18 Malayan pangolins (Manis javanica) were obtained from anti-smuggling operations carried out by Guangxi Customs during 2017 and early 2018.

Coronavirus RNA was found in six of the 43 organ samples, linking the virus with five individual animals. Techniques for reading and filling in missing sequences soon provided the team with half a dozen detailed genomes of the pangolin's strains of the virus."

 

https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2020/03/200326144342.htm

https://www.sciencealert.com/coronavirus-discovery-in-pangolins-shows-why-wildlife-markets-need-better-regulations

Edited April 1, 2020 by BullBuchanan

[Hedge]

17 minutes ago, BullBuchanan said:

They've had this traced back to Pangolins for months and unlike the horseshoe bat, there's a high probability that pangolins were int he market.

 

That's nothing more than one of a number of working theories. I actually posted a link way back on page 9 of this thread about pangolins being a possible source. 

 

24 minutes ago, BullBuchanan said:

Less factual left wing articles may play identity politics just as strongly, but they don't make actual enemies of fellow Americans and sow cultural divides the same way.

 

Could you please share some of these left leaning news sources that you trust?

 

Oh, and, your rock called. It's missing you living under it.

 

Edit: Here's a special shoutout to @4merper4mer, as I was able to search for him using the word "hump" to locate the original posting of the pangolin.

 

 

 

Edited April 1, 2020 by Hedge

[Hedge]

On 3/27/2020 at 9:34 AM, Hedge said:

 

 

 

 

I can't imagine there is much opportunity to practice social distancing aboard an air craft carrier.

I also wonder if perhaps this sort of ship specific information should be classified, so as to not embolden any bad actors to take advantage of US force readiness that may be impacted, if the problem grows.

 

 

 

The answer to when they stop releasing these numbers: Now.

 

 

 

[Golden Goat]

2 hours ago, BullBuchanan said:

Believe me, I understand that the media doesn't give a ***** about right vs left. They sell controversy and hype, but certain outlets pander to one side over the other while their sister stations owned by the same parent company feed the other side. I do take issue however, that the less factual among right wing outlets have a strong reputation for being extremely venomous at a personal level. Less factual left wing articles may play identity politics just as strongly, but they don't make actual enemies of fellow Americans and sow cultural divides the same way.

?
 

 

[Prickly Pete]

3 hours ago, BullBuchanan said:

Believe me, I understand that the media doesn't give a ***** about right vs left. They sell controversy and hype, but certain outlets pander to one side over the other while their sister stations owned by the same parent company feed the other side. I do take issue however, that the less factual among right wing outlets have a strong reputation for being extremely venomous at a personal level. Less factual left wing articles may play identity politics just as strongly, but they don't make actual enemies of fellow Americans and sow cultural divides the same way.

 

 

Dude, you're ****ing dreaming.

 

 

Edited April 1, 2020 by 32ABBA

[3rdnlng]

5 hours ago, TPS said:

Yes, let's not look at the past and cast blame; however, I would suggest going back a month to see who was taking the trump line from the start, like comparing it to the flu, or posting how few deaths there were, then also look and see who took it seriously...

 

Maybe instead of just casting wild dispersions with empty statements you could actually do the work to prove those statements? 

[billsfan1959]

5 hours ago, Rob's House said:

 

 

Yeah, a lot of armchair quarterbacking going on in this thread. As I said in another post, if you are someone who is intent on blaming Trump for waiting too long to take this seriously, then, to be intellectually honest, you have to blame every politician in a position of authority at every level in this country and, virtually, every country in the world.

 

Personally, I don't see the point. Especially when not one person in this thread has offered any type of empirical data that we wouldn't be in substantially the same position we are in now.

 

If you look at the countries in Europe that, collectively, make up approx the same population as the US and, geographically, are grouped together, you see where we stand at the moment. I would argue that the travel bans bought us about 9-17 days (based on the rate each country took to reach .002% of cases based on total population), and that delay has allowed this country to mobilize government agencies for assistance (i.e., creating temporary hospitals) and the private sector in manufacturing needed medical equipment to, hopefully, prevent our hospitals from being overwhelmed to the levels we have seen in other countries.

 

Country Population Cases Deaths Cases per capita Death Rate of confirmed cases Date Reached .002 (of total population) Cases Death rate at .002 cases Italy 60000000 105792 12428 0.1763% 11.75% 3/1/2020 (.002 of Population is 1304 cases) 2.41% Spain 46000000 95923 8464 0.2085% 8.82% 3/9/2020 (.002 of Population is 1000 cases) 2.44% France 65000000 52128 3523 0.0802% 6.76% 3/9/2020 (.002 of Population is 1413 cases) 2.12% Belgium 11000000 12775 705 0.1161% 5.52% 3/9/2020 (.002 of Population is 239 cases) 0.00% Germany 83000000 71808 775 0.0865% 1.08% 3/11/2020 (.002 of Population is 1804 cases) 0.15% UK 67000000 19522 1228 0.0291% 6.29% 3/15/2020 (.002 of Population is 1456 cases) 2.52%                 Total 332000000 357948 27123 0.1078% 7.58%                     United States 331000000 189633 4081 0.0573% 2.15% 3/18/2020 (.002 of Population is 7195 cases) 1.60%

 

People are going to die. How many is unknown; however, I believe this administration and the individual states and cities are doing all they can to minimize that number. Nobody understood what was coming and to hear things like "Trump's lack of action is killing people," "Trump has blood on his hands," etc., is disingenuous at best and despicably political at worst. 

 

Edited April 1, 2020 by billsfan1959

[3rdnlng]

On 1/23/2020 at 2:03 AM, Hedge said:

What is thought to be known about this coronavirus/Wuhan Pneumonia, so far:

• The outbreak began in Wuhan, China. Population ~11 million. The city is now under lock down.
• According to the CDC the risk to the general American public is considered low at this time.
• In it's early stages, a minimum of 500+ people have been infected according to the Chinese government, although many believe this be grossly under reported, and that the true number is in the thousands.
• 17 dead, so far, most of the deceased are 60+ years old, who, more than likely, had already weakened immune systems.
• While almost all of the cases involve people in China, it has gone international. 1 case in Seattle, perhaps 1 in Mexico, as well as Thailand, Japan, South Korea.
• It can take many days for it to present itself and then appear as a flu, fever, pneumonia, respiratory illness such as bronchitis, or common cold symptoms.
• More than likely it was originally transmitted from a wild animal to humans, but is now contagious and apparently mutating. The exact source remains unknown, but bats, snakes, or civets seem to be the most commonly cited culprits in this outbreak. Highly likely it began in an open air animal and seafood market.
• Some major international airports are already screening passengers who originated from Wuhan.
• Saturday is Lunar New Year, a busy travel season in China, which could accelerate distribution of the disease

 

 

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Thread.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

This is the OP from January 23, 2020, one week before Trump closed off travel to and from China.

[Doc Brown]

35 minutes ago, billsfan1959 said:

People are going to die. How many is unknown; however, I believe this administration and the individual states and cities are doing all they can to minimize that number. Nobody understood what was coming and to hear things like "Trump's lack of action is killing people," "Trump has blood on his hands," etc., is disingenuous at best and despicably political at worst. 

Trump made the right call in restricting flights from China in late January.  He then screwed up by downplaying the threat for the next month or so comparing it to the common flu.  His opponent will have many ads in this time period to attack him with.  The federal agencies that are supposed to prepare for this also initially screwed up.  I think the magnitude of this thing caught us off guard when it shouldn't have.  I think he's done a fine job since then however both on messaging and passing legislation to help us get through this.

[3rdnlng]

34 minutes ago, Doc Brown said:

Trump made the right call in restricting flights from China in late January.  He then screwed up by downplaying the threat for the next month or so comparing it to the common flu.  His opponent will have many ads in this time period to attack him with.  The federal agencies that are supposed to prepare for this also initially screwed up.  I think the magnitude of this thing caught us off guard when it shouldn't have.  I think he's done a fine job since then however both on messaging and passing legislation to help us get through this.

The NSC commissioned a pandemic study back in September of 2019 so obviously the administration was covering all bases. The link below shows a NYT article that tries to twist facts and intentions but at least represents that a study was requested. 

 

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/white-house-economists-warned-in-2019-a-pandemic-could-devastate-america/ar-BB11YWHC

[Warren Zevon]

47 minutes ago, Doc Brown said:

Trump made the right call in restricting flights from China in late January.  He then screwed up by downplaying the threat for the next month or so comparing it to the common flu.  His opponent will have many ads in this time period to attack him with.  The federal agencies that are supposed to prepare for this also initially screwed up.  I think the magnitude of this thing caught us off guard when it shouldn't have.  I think he's done a fine job since then however both on messaging and passing legislation to help us get through this.

 

Agree with the bolded - good post