shoshin Posted July 22, 2020 Posted July 22, 2020 (edited) 49 minutes ago, fansince88 said: Awesome. Eyes wide open I see. I believe I qualified my point before the video. But there you go. Judging based on personal opinion rather then on what a person posted. As I said, one could google it and see both sides.... or perhaps you cannot. I believe I may possibly have misjudged you. BTW, I work at a drug chain warehouse. EVERY mask we sell. Everyone. Warning on the back says they will not protect against viruses like Covid. Even the makers are protecting their butts Uh no. I judged it based on the studies he showed conclusions of in the video actually. He screenshot some of them so you cloud see bits. It seems like all he showed were the publicly available portions (nice research—a real deep dive!!) but they were clear enough. The cloth mask You wear is not for your protection. How many times do you think people have to say that before people like you get it? The credible studies you can “google” (I can also google proof that Trump is a lizard person) conclude that cloth masks don’t protect HCWs from unmasked sick people. Shocker. That’s not what cloth masks are being advocated for. Cloth masks protect others from you. That’s why you wear them. And if you’re a HCW like my wife, you wear The N95. And guess what, HCWs—even those treating Cv19–are staying largely free of Covid-19 these days. Maybe because...wait for it...masks work pretty well? Edited July 22, 2020 by shoshin
Magox Posted July 22, 2020 Posted July 22, 2020 (edited) Mask studies are largely useless. Too many variables that affect outcomes involve humans and the efficacy of how they wear them couple that with realistic compliance and quality of masks, forget about it. Studies when it comes to masks can only show you what IS THEORETICALLY possible. But not what IS realistic. Kinda like studies that show what your brain is capable of if we applied all of our brain, even though reality is that no one will ever apply all of their brain and only a fraction of it. Not apples to apples but I think you get the idea. To properly have this discussion we have to understand how the virus is transmitted. The virus is transmitted largely in settings where you will be in close contact with infected people for sustained periods of time (10 minutes +). It thrives in enclosed settings and even more so places with poor ventilation. Contact tracers and hospital administrators report consistently that over 75% of people that contract the virus actually contract it inside their own homes. The rest of them contract it wherever you will be in close contact with an infected person for a sustained period of time. Transportation, churches, close office settings, meat plants, prisons, protests, packed bars/restaurants etc. All these places are places you can be with someone the same someone who is infected over a sustained time period. Think of your typical trip outside of your home to the grocery store or wherever. How often are you next to the same person for 10 straight minutes or more? Not that often unless you are in one of the settings I described above. Which means that casual contact whether you wear a mask or not is not going to have a statistically significant impact. A rule of thumb that I have pretty much always lived by which is an old Mark Twain quote “Figures don’t lie but liars do figure”. Which is when it comes to analysis, verifiable data is your best baseline to work off. What does the data show? The data shows that places that have been hit the worst already had relatively high mask compliance. Los Angeles has had mask mandates for well over a month and they are one of the highest hit cities. New York had high mask compliance back in mid March. How do I know? I was there from the 16th-20th of March and NY was already a ghost town and everyone I saw was wearing masks yet they continued to spiral out of control. Miami has been at high mask compliance relatively speaking for 4 straight months. Same with Northern Italy, Paris, Brussels, Newark and the list goes on. Take a look at this heat map from The NY Times who has the highest compliance of mask usage. https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/07/17/upshot/coronavirus-face-mask-map.html Time and time again, places with the highest mask compliance we’re not able to contain the virus. That’s a verifiable statement. I am not advocating for people not to wear masks, I think people’s fear and anxiety is a real thing even though I often times don’t believe it’s rooted in reality but it’s real and out of respect for them and the possibility that maybe I could infect them, I wear the mask when I go out and know will be in contact with others. For me it’s not a matter of “do masks work?” It’s a convoluted question and it’s not the right question to ask. The question should be: considering the makeup of our society and realistic compliance expectations, how effective can masks be? The answer really just depends on a variety of variables, variables that studies can’t possibly factor in. If a city already has an outbreak, forget about it, it will only help on the margins until the virus burns out. That reality has borne out time and time again. My hunch and common sense says that the setting that it helps with more so than anywhere else are in the settings I described above and in cities that have low prevalency. Sort of helps tilt the R-naught “effect” in the right direction. In other words just makes it more difficult to find a host to infect. Another question is why is it that the Nords who are viewed by many to be one of the most intelligent people on the planet, do not wear masks? Sweden, Norway and Finland all have a below 10% compliance rate which is the lowest in the planet. I have googled up what their public epidemiologists say and basically it’s stuff like this: ”Based on the current epidemiological situation, the Norwegian Institute of Public Health considers that there is no scientific basis for recommending general use or non-medical face masks in the general population." “We are aware that this type of protection, which won't be medical face masks, would be of very variable quality," she said. "And so they might lead people to not give the same attention to the other advice that we have, such as keeping distance and staying home if you are sick." This is basically the answer that each one of those countries say. Norway has said if they were to experience a more drastic outbreak they would reconsider but they have abstained from advocating for it. Keep in mind these people are thought to be home of some of the best microbiologists in the world. Again, I think masks help more than not but the data says a lot and any analysis that does not take the actual outcomes into heavy consideration is working off a faulty baseline. Edited July 22, 2020 by Magox 2 1
Tiberius Posted July 22, 2020 Posted July 22, 2020 Omg she didn’t!!! How could she?? Who are the enemies of the American people? Those trying to save lives or those who recklessly attack those trying to save lives? WASHINGTON — Rep. Liz Cheney, R-Wyo., on Tuesday faced down a group of GOP Freedom Caucus critics who complained about her public support for Dr. Anthony Fauci and her support for Kentucky Republican Rep. Thomas Massie’s primary opponent. Cheney, chair of the House GOP Conference, defended Fauci, the nation’s top infectious disease expert, during a closed-door conference meeting, according to a source familiar with her remarks. On May 12, Cheney tweeted: "Dr. Fauci is one of the finest public servants we have ever had. He is not a partisan. His only interest is saving lives. We need his expertise and his judgment to defeat this virus. All Americans should be thanking him. Every day."
B-Man Posted July 22, 2020 Posted July 22, 2020 The Big Surge In Coronavirus Deaths Is A Media-Fed Myth Issues & Insights, by The Editorial Board Original Article Almost daily now we’ve been reading about how daily deaths from COVID-19 have reached record highs. It’s a scary prospect. But the truth is the mainstream press is grossly misleading the public by misreporting the death counts. Here’s a typical report, from USA Today a few days ago: “As the outbreak continues to surge across the southern states, Florida, Texas and South Carolina set records for new daily deaths, reporting 156, 129 and 69, respectively.” ABC News reported that “Nineteen states set single-day records for the most cases this week … Three states set a record today.” According to PBS
bilzfancy Posted July 22, 2020 Posted July 22, 2020 Death rate is currently at 3.4% and 84% are over the age of 75
Dante Posted July 22, 2020 Posted July 22, 2020 Pretty much if you breath in the state of Texas you got Covaides! Lol what a absolute farce. This chick must have a iq below 75 to actually believe the script she is reading.
123719bwiqrb Posted July 22, 2020 Posted July 22, 2020 Imagine dying in 2020 and not getting counted as a covid death! Is that even possible? 2 1
WEATHER DOT COM Posted July 22, 2020 Posted July 22, 2020 17 minutes ago, 123719bwiqrb said: Imagine dying in 2020 and not getting counted as a covid death! Is that even possible? Imagine being this ignorant
3rdnlng Posted July 22, 2020 Posted July 22, 2020 46 minutes ago, wAcKy ZeBrA said: Imagine being this ignorant Fortunately you don't have to imagine it. 1 2
shoshin Posted July 22, 2020 Posted July 22, 2020 (edited) 5 hours ago, Magox said: ”Based on the current epidemiological situation, the Norwegian Institute of Public Health considers that there is no scientific basis for recommending general use or non-medical face masks in the general population." “We are aware that this type of protection, which won't be medical face masks, would be of very variable quality," she said. "And so they might lead people to not give the same attention to the other advice that we have, such as keeping distance and staying home if you are sick." This is basically the answer that each one of those countries say. Norway has said if they were to experience a more drastic outbreak they would reconsider but they have abstained from advocating for it. Keep in mind these people are thought to be home of some of the best microbiologists in the world. Again, I think masks help more than not but the data says a lot and any analysis that does not take the actual outcomes into heavy consideration is working off a faulty baseline. Norway, with 6 positive cases today? And no deaths? I'd say that "current epidemiological situation" is a bit different than ours, don't you think? When we get down to 6, or the per capita equivalent around 180 cases per day here, the CDC won't be recommending masks either. Until then, let's do what almost every other country that has lowered their counts has done and mask up. Or not. That's a different path: I understand that you mask up, and think there is "some" value in doing so(!), so most of my snark is directed at others, although Norway is the wrong country to bring up for a lot of reasons. Edited July 22, 2020 by shoshin
shoshin Posted July 22, 2020 Posted July 22, 2020 (edited) Holy spin cycle. The administration is really trying some new tactics. Trump was the voice of moderation and reason and the governors messed up the response! I'm sure DeSantis and Abbott like this support. Edited July 22, 2020 by shoshin 1
IDBillzFan Posted July 22, 2020 Posted July 22, 2020 18 hours ago, SoCal Deek said: Hey PPP posters! On Sunday afternoon I started running a mild fever that spiked at 102 by Monday afternoon. This morning, Tuesday, I made an appointment for a fifteen minute test ($195). I’m 61 and in very good health but live in Southern California so I feared the worst. The test was a swab deep up both nostrils and while eye watering uncomfortable was not painful. You stay in your car and they come out to you. Likewise they bring the results back to you signed by a Doctor. When it took a few minutes longer than fifteen I really started to worry, what with my fever and all. The results? Negative! Just a bad summer cold I guess. This is good news. Now, whatever you do, don't get in a motorcycle accident or have a drink at a bar without ordering food. You must continue to avoid the 'rona!
TH3 Posted July 22, 2020 Posted July 22, 2020 (edited) 3 hours ago, Dante said: Pretty much if you breath in the state of Texas you got Covaides! Lol what a absolute farce. This chick must have a iq below 75 to actually believe the script she is reading. Recap: Buy my stuff: I found a handful of miscounts: Buy my stuff:: LOL Edited July 22, 2020 by TH3
B-Man Posted July 22, 2020 Posted July 22, 2020 WEIRD, BECAUSE ALL WE’VE BEEN HEARING ABOUT ARE TEXAS, FLORIDA, AND ARIZONA: California now has most COVID-19 cases. 1
IDBillzFan Posted July 22, 2020 Posted July 22, 2020 1 minute ago, B-Man said: WEIRD, BECAUSE ALL WE’VE BEEN HEARING ABOUT ARE TEXAS, FLORIDA, AND ARIZONA: California now has most COVID-19 cases. That article misstates that NY had over 72,000 deaths. I think they're only at 32,000. Still, NY far and away has the worst showing of all states, but thank God they figured out that you'll be safe if you just order food when you sit at a bar.
Buffalo_Gal Posted July 22, 2020 Posted July 22, 2020 Link to covid-presser ● 100M doses with pfizer of vaccine immediately following approval + 500M doses shortly thereafter ● Median age is 78, and nearly half the deaths are in nursing homes or longterm care facilities ● Half of the fatalities were 1% on the population Additional actions: ● Increased testing of nursing homes in states with worst outbreaks ● Distribution 15K rapid point of care diagnostics devices (the 5-15 minute test) + 600 devices shipped to more facilities ● HHS $500M more to nursing homes [Maybe we can see my father more than 30 minutes per week?] ● Enhanced technical and support (highest risk nursing homes are the priority right now) ● They have 99% nursing home are reporting data, then they alert the state Outbreak in sunbelt: ● Likely a number of causes and infections (named the demonstrations), substantial increase in travel, young people at bars, etc (they have 12 listed on the guide) ● 19 States have less than 5% positive test rate ● 8 States less than 2% positive rate ● Surpassed more than 50M tests ● He is naming a lot of therapeutic researches that I had not heard of... (8 minute mark) 2
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