BillsFanNC Posted July 14, 2020 Posted July 14, 2020 25 minutes ago, Winston Zeddemore said: You know, 100% vs 9.4% -- it's the same thing really right? Numbers are just numbers... There's just no way any even halfway incompetent scientist reports out results like that. If it only happened at one lab I could maybe understand it being a clerical error, but this stinks to high heaven. 1
plenzmd1 Posted July 14, 2020 Posted July 14, 2020 48 minutes ago, Penfield45 said: Conservatives literally believe that all "liberals" collectively conspired with every world government and health organization to tank the economy, force everybody to stay home for a full year, and close all forms of service and entertainment because... they want trump to look bad. no, what some of us liberals believe is that the far left, especially the media, has fear mongered this pandemic to make sure Trump looks bad no matter what happens. The effects of the fear mongering are what you have listed above...but the press just keeps pressing forward. See my posts on the Houtan Chronicle special obit section. That things is being rewteeted like crazy with people thinking " oh lord, so many people died last week in Houston and they have a 43 page obit section of Covid deaths" The reality is nothing close to that, it is over a several months timeframe and includes people who have dies of Covid, and drug ODs, and Cancer and just flat out old age. But it has been retweeted over 100K times in various forms and tweets, and the paper itself likes to tweets so much it refusing to come public and tweet the facts...that is fear mongering and baiting at its worst, all designed to make Trump and Abbot look bad..and is despicable 1 1
Taro T Posted July 14, 2020 Posted July 14, 2020 2 hours ago, ALF said: That is true but only the federal gov can stop air travel to and from China and Europe . The European strain hit NYC and NJ very hard. On 31 January, the Italian government suspended all flights to and from China and declared a state of emergency. This is when the U.S. should have stopped flights to and from Europe. (I know hindsight is 20/20) In HINDSIGHT, yes, all flights from China should've been halted on NYD & all flights from Europe on 1/31. In real time, 45 caught serious flack for halting travel from China at the end of January & nobody knew how bad things were going to get in Italy & Spain then either. MAYBE he could've shut down travel from Europe earlier in March, but that's reviewing with the benefit of hindsight & can't see any way travel from there would've been shut down in February. Can't really blame anyone (but the CCP) for decisions this winter, but by mid-April some rules such as forcing NYS nursing homes to admit residents with COVID should have been rescinded. And the deaths caused after that due to rules like it fall squarely on the decision makers' shoulders. 3
123719bwiqrb Posted July 14, 2020 Posted July 14, 2020 1 hour ago, Penfield45 said: Conservatives literally believe that all "liberals" collectively conspired with every world government and health organization to tank the economy, force everybody to stay home for a full year, and close all forms of service and entertainment because... they want trump to look bad. wrong, took advantage of a bad situation are the words your looking for Rochester bro
Buffalo_Gal Posted July 14, 2020 Posted July 14, 2020 8 minutes ago, Taro T said: In HINDSIGHT, yes, all flights from China should've been halted on NYD & all flights from Europe on 1/31. In real time, 45 caught serious flack for halting travel from China at the end of January & nobody knew how bad things were going to get in Italy & Spain then either. MAYBE he could've shut down travel from Europe earlier in March, but that's reviewing with the benefit of hindsight & can't see any way travel from there would've been shut down in February. Can't really blame anyone (but the CCP) for decisions this winter, but by mid-April some rules such as forcing NYS nursing homes to admit residents with COVID should have been rescinded. And the deaths caused after that due to rules like it fall squarely on the decision makers' shoulders. As someone who went off to Spain in February (and came home March 14th right after Trump closed down flights from Europe to non-US, non-green card, non-UK people (the UK got the boot shortly thereafter)), I agree with you. I chronicled earlier in this thread what was going on as we crossed over border after border, and what was being reported in various parts of the world. Spoiler alert: next to nothing. Not in January, not in February. In March Morocco was a bit more serious about who they let in and the questioning and forms, but Spain, and the UK were not. I told the story about the driver we had to the airport in Spain (in March) who laughed that the when Italy closed down, the citizens went over to Spain calling it "Vacation time!" (Probably why Madrid was so impacted.) People simply did not know. But once the world closed down, it was time for our local elected leaders to take this seriously. Not pack in the elderly with recovering COVID-19 patients. It took them until May (early June?) to decide that when they were residents of the nursing home diagnosed with COVID-19 the hospital would keep those people until they tested negative. Since people knew from Italy that this disproportionately killed the elderly, why was Cuomo sending non-residents to nursing home to recover? No bueno as we saw from the death statistics. And while he was sentencing some nursing home patients to death, others were denied visits to their doctors, or visits from family. I am guessing the long term health repercussions to Americans due to this virus is going to be even worse than the disease. The lock downs did the US no favors, and the suicides, un-diagnosed aliments, "non-critical" surgeries that were postponed ... negative health consequences of the shut downs are going to simply add exponentially to the numbers. China certainly has a lot to answer for... ? 1 2
spartacus Posted July 14, 2020 Posted July 14, 2020 2 hours ago, Magox said: Are you ***** kidding me??? You leftists have got some gall Revisionist history clearly is popular among you guys. In any case this is newsworthy. Looks like the positivity rate is lower than what has been reported. You want cases, we'll give you cases everyone's positive!! probably diverting real tests to the NBA in their bubble at least with the new test below now being used in other hospitals, your odds move up to a coin flip https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/covid-19-antigen-test-could-give-quick-results-but-is-not-foolproof#New-antigen-test
snafu Posted July 14, 2020 Posted July 14, 2020 3 hours ago, Kemp said: And you're totally ignoring the federal government's non-response, that continues until today. NYS is abiding by CDC guidelines for reopening. It says it right in the NYS Forward materials. The CDC is a Federal Agency last I checked. Cuomo publicly thanked the Administration a few times during the worst of the NYS outbreak. Are you sure that you're not overstating things? Pretty much everyone made some big mistakes when little was known and everyone was panicked. Whether the mistakes get repeated or continue is worthy of criticism.
keepthefaith Posted July 14, 2020 Posted July 14, 2020 3 hours ago, Kemp said: And you're totally ignoring the federal government's non-response, that continues until today. Dogma.
snafu Posted July 14, 2020 Posted July 14, 2020 1 hour ago, GG said: That's the issue though. The cases should have been transferred to those places and not infect the other hospitals and nursing homes. They were transferring sick patients all over the hospital system and made a bad situation worse. Not only that, but they could have used these facilities and kept a couple hospitals covid-free in order to deal with other health matters and even elective surgeries.
MILFHUNTER#518 Posted July 14, 2020 Posted July 14, 2020 5 hours ago, Kemp said: When the antibody test is at least close to 100% accurate, your statement will be true. When Trump claims that the coronavirus is the fault of Obama and Biden for stopping the testing process, before the virus existed, how does one not understand that he is either making things up or unbelievably stupid? How can someone agree with that Trump statement and not be backing up the lie or unbelievably stupid? I was told by a medical professional that the one used here in NYS is at least 90 something percent accurate. Do you live in NYS? If so, the ones used here by NYS DOH should be pretty good.
Melon Posted July 14, 2020 Posted July 14, 2020 3 minutes ago, BillStime said: Good advice Melania As my husband Donald has said from the beginning of the pandemic, it is extremely important to wear a mask to help stop the spread. Thank you for BeingBest, @BillStime. 1
Big Blitz Posted July 14, 2020 Posted July 14, 2020 Over 90K deaths from March 15 to May 15 Less than 40K from May 15 to today. Nothing to see here. 2
shoshin Posted July 14, 2020 Posted July 14, 2020 2 hours ago, GG said: That's the issue though. The cases should have been transferred to those places and not infect the other hospitals and nursing homes. They were transferring sick patients all over the hospital system and made a bad situation worse. The result is clear now. But in the moment, NYC Metro had more sick patients in hospitals than they could deal with and thought they needed a load of ventilators and super clean spaces (because remember: We didn't yet know better), so they transferred them to other hospitals and places where there was some standard of care and patient knowledge (nursing homes). Cuomo gets a lot of blame for the nursing home decision but unlike PA and other states that did the same thing, in NYC there were way more bodies needing treatment than beds available and at that point we had no idea where the #s would top out. I sometimes feel like people (maybe not you because you have a lot of NYC exposure) forget how dire things felt in NYC Metro. There was a lot of seat-of-pants flying. I don't have a problem with blaming Cuomo because heavy lays the crown and all that, but let's all remember ***** was really bad when he made those decisions. 45 minutes ago, snafu said: NYS is abiding by CDC guidelines for reopening. It says it right in the NYS Forward materials. The CDC is a Federal Agency last I checked. Cuomo publicly thanked the Administration a few times during the worst of the NYS outbreak. Are you sure that you're not overstating things? Pretty much everyone made some big mistakes when little was known and everyone was panicked. Whether the mistakes get repeated or continue is worthy of criticism. NYS is the ONLY state that made an attempt to follow those guidelines. Literally the only one. They modified them but the essence of the state decisions was based on those.
BillsFanNC Posted July 14, 2020 Posted July 14, 2020 6 hours ago, Kemp said: When the antibody test is at least close to 100% accurate, your statement will be true. When Trump claims that the coronavirus is the fault of Obama and Biden for stopping the testing process, before the virus existed, how does one not understand that he is either making things up or unbelievably stupid? How can someone agree with that Trump statement and not be backing up the lie or unbelievably stupid? Trump is wrong for blaming the early testing roll-out failures on Obama and you're wrong for blaming it on Trump. Most sane people blame it on a plethora of variables that can be distilled down to: bloated government bureaucracy. 1
shoshin Posted July 14, 2020 Posted July 14, 2020 8 minutes ago, BillsFanNC said: Trump is wrong for blaming the early testing roll-out failures on Obama and you're wrong for blaming it on Trump. Most sane people blame it on a plethora of variables that can be distilled down to: bloated government bureaucracy. I don't blame the early problems on government either. It was a new virus that spread fast. It's unrealistic to think we would have instantly been ready to have testing capacity. But...that we still have shortages of test and massive delays is a problem.
GG Posted July 14, 2020 Posted July 14, 2020 2 hours ago, TH3 said: Fixed some things for you. BTW - I tought DT proclaimed himself a "war time president" in regards to CV.....coward ran and hid and now you cover for him.... How does it feel to always be wrong? Must really suck. Quote (April 7, 2020) President Trump said the USNS Comfort docked in New York will now be open to coronavirus patients, after the ship was initially meant to take only non-COVID-19 patients to free up beds in New York hospitals. The floating hospital is now open to New Jersey patients too. Mr. Trump said New York Governor Andrew Cuomo had contacted him about the Comfort. "He asked whether or not it would be possible to use the ship with respect to fighting the virus, and we hadn't had that in mind at all, but we're going to let him do it,"
BillsFanNC Posted July 14, 2020 Posted July 14, 2020 43 minutes ago, shoshin said: I don't blame the early problems on government either. It was a new virus that spread fast. It's unrealistic to think we would have instantly been ready to have testing capacity. But...that we still have shortages of test and massive delays is a problem. The initial roll out failure was certainly the fault of the CDC. They screwed up the test kits themselves, wouldn't let public health labs use their own homebrewed tests based on the published sequences etc. Even if they hadn't screwed up the kits themselves and decided to loosen regulations so labs could run their own tests, there are many variables related to the logistics of testing millions of potential cases that limit testing. For example my wife is a pediatrician....they are still limited in the number of tests they can order because there isn't enough viral transport media to collect patient samples in. This is at the front lines just trying to take an NP swab and really has nothing to do with performing the test itself. Then there are other shortages I've read about further down the chain like RNA extraction reagents and reverse transcriptase to run the PCR. These reagents are of course supplied by private companies and you're right had nothing to do with the government.
SoCal Deek Posted July 14, 2020 Posted July 14, 2020 (edited) I've been watching European soccer over the past many weekends. The stadiums throughout Europe are empty, all the players on the sideline are separated from each other, and all support personnel are wearing masks. This is NOT a Donald Trump issue! Nor is this an American problem. Edited July 14, 2020 by SoCal Deek 1
BillStime Posted July 14, 2020 Posted July 14, 2020 1 hour ago, BillsFanNC said: Trump is wrong for blaming the early testing roll-out failures on Obama and you're wrong for blaming it on Trump. Most sane people blame it on a plethora of variables that can be distilled down to: bloated government bureaucracy. Well, and Trump absolutely DESTROYED our pandemic infrastructure... so that played a role in our lack of preparedness.
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