thebandit27 Posted January 27, 2020 Posted January 27, 2020 17 minutes ago, BeastMaster said: I just think Armstead would be a better value. I don't mean to knock the guy's ability...he's clearly a very good pass rusher. The size and inability to be very effective against the run concern me, though. I'll be very interested if both these guys are available to see what interest the Bills would have. I imagine that they’re looking at all the EDGE guys; I’m really hoping for Clowney or Ngakoue, but ya never know what a UFA’s priorities will be—I mean the number is probably going to be there for them in multiple destinations. I’ll say that it wouldn’t surprise me if the Bills were prepared to settle for Mario Addison as a fallback option. His production is very similar to Ngakoue over the last 4 seasons and he’ll come cheaper since he’s getting up there in age. Plus there’s the whole Carolina connection. Still think there’s a better than fair chance that at least one veteran EDGE guy from the group of Campbell, Griffen, Miller, and C. Jones gets moved in a trade.
Cripple Creek Posted January 27, 2020 Posted January 27, 2020 11 hours ago, thebandit27 said: I imagine that they’re looking at all the EDGE guys; I’m really hoping for Clowney or Ngakoue, but ya never know what a UFA’s priorities will be—I mean the number is probably going to be there for them in multiple destinations. I’ll say that it wouldn’t surprise me if the Bills were prepared to settle for Mario Addison as a fallback option. His production is very similar to Ngakoue over the last 4 seasons and he’ll come cheaper since he’s getting up there in age. Plus there’s the whole Carolina connection. Still think there’s a better than fair chance that at least one veteran EDGE guy from the group of Campbell, Griffen, Miller, and C. Jones gets moved in a trade. With a hedge that high, you must really hate your neighbors.
thebandit27 Posted January 27, 2020 Posted January 27, 2020 1 hour ago, Cripple Creek said: With a hedge that high, you must really hate your neighbors. Not sure what you mean...I am saying that there are a number of aging EDGE guys that could get moved in trades. I’m also saying that I expect Buffalo to sign at least one high-priced EDGE guy in FA. Shouldn't read anymore into my post than that.
GG Posted January 27, 2020 Posted January 27, 2020 13 hours ago, thebandit27 said: I would be hesitant to give Armstead the premier pass rush money he may want because I don’t have confidence that he can perform anywhere near his 10 sack output once his supporting cast is Hughes/Star/Oliver as opposed to Bosa/Buckner/Ford. An argument can be made that if Bills had a half competent rusher opposite Hughes, he'd put up better numbers than Armstead.
thebandit27 Posted January 27, 2020 Posted January 27, 2020 16 hours ago, BADOLBILZ said: They can create enough space to tag him simply by cutting Marcell Dareus...........which they are going to do anyway............very simple. Ngakoue at the very least has great trade value..........late first or early second round maybe? So it would be crazy stupid for them to not at least apply the tag and work on a trade.......so I am basically considering him a non-entity in this free agent market. AJ Green likely gets tagged too but with it being a great WR class and Green being older and having built up some capital with the organization maybe they give him the chance to get to UFA. Ah, but if they tag Yannick, then you can be darn near certain that they’d listen to an offer for Campbell... 21 minutes ago, GG said: An argument can be made that if Bills had a half competent rusher opposite Hughes, he'd put up better numbers than Armstead. Huh? The two EDGE guys opposite Jerry had a combined 11.5 sacks...
BADOLBILZ Posted January 27, 2020 Posted January 27, 2020 14 minutes ago, thebandit27 said: Ah, but if they tag Yannick, then you can be darn near certain that they’d listen to an offer for Campbell... Yeah Campbell is coming off a tremendous year of putting pressure on the QB and he's a very high character player. I could see Calais Campbell and Gerald McCoy ending up being the replacements for Shaq and Phillips. Rentals.........but also ideal mentors for guys like Bam Johnson and Ed Oliver.
GG Posted January 27, 2020 Posted January 27, 2020 19 minutes ago, thebandit27 said: Ah, but if they tag Yannick, then you can be darn near certain that they’d listen to an offer for Campbell... Huh? The two EDGE guys opposite Jerry had a combined 11.5 sacks... Agree on Jags. Cutting Dareus and resigning Yannick would zero out, but they will need room for other guys and the rookies. They have to move a vet, because the Foles contract is a killer this year. I think you are contradicting yourself regarding Armstead. If two pass rushing stiffs like Murphy and Shaq can combine for 11.5 sacks, imagine what a more talented player can do. I don't think Bills DL is much worse than SFs.
thebandit27 Posted January 27, 2020 Posted January 27, 2020 14 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said: Yeah Campbell is coming off a tremendous year of putting pressure on the QB and he's a very high character player. I could see Calais Campbell and Gerald McCoy ending up being the replacements for Shaq and Phillips. Rentals.........but also ideal mentors for guys like Bam Johnson and Ed Oliver. I would be absolutely fine with that. 13 minutes ago, GG said: Agree on Jags. Cutting Dareus and resigning Yannick would zero out, but they will need room for other guys and the rookies. They have to move a vet, because the Foles contract is a killer this year. I think you are contradicting yourself regarding Armstead. If two pass rushing stiffs like Murphy and Shaq can combine for 11.5 sacks, imagine what a more talented player can do. I don't think Bills DL is much worse than SFs. I only mean that I think Armstead is going to want double digit sack money, and I don’t think that’s his base production level in any defense that isn’t as solid across the frontline as SF.
GG Posted January 27, 2020 Posted January 27, 2020 Just now, thebandit27 said: I would be absolutely fine with that. I only mean that I think Armstead is going to want double digit sack money, and I don’t think that’s his base production level in any defense that isn’t as solid across the frontline as SF. That's a fair point on Armstead.
NewEra Posted January 27, 2020 Posted January 27, 2020 16 hours ago, BeastMaster said: We have a good line as well. He's shown he can get pressure and be stout against the run, so I disagree that he has holes in his game. Ngokoue will be attacked in the run game. I don't want guys that can't stop the run starting on our Dline, and certainly not at top end money. His entire game WAS a hole for the first 4 years of his career. I watch every niner game (as long as they don’t play at the same time as the Bills) and armstead was a completely different player this season. Luckily for him, because we stunk for prior to this season
wppete Posted January 27, 2020 Posted January 27, 2020 I doubt it. Way too much $$$$$ always injured and seems like a diva.
NewEra Posted January 27, 2020 Posted January 27, 2020 22 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said: Yeah Campbell is coming off a tremendous year of putting pressure on the QB and he's a very high character player. I could see Calais Campbell and Gerald McCoy ending up being the replacements for Shaq and Phillips. Rentals.........but also ideal mentors for guys like Bam Johnson and Ed Oliver. That would be amazing and best case scenario imo. I’d love to acquire productive vets for 1-2 seasons without breaking the bank. All I ask is that the FO acknowledges the opportunity at hand the next year or 2 and they go for it.
noacls Posted January 27, 2020 Posted January 27, 2020 On 1/24/2020 at 2:54 PM, DrDawkinstein said: All DL are rotational in our D, and rightfully so. Keep em fresh. Rotate Yannick out and Shaq in on running downs. And agreed with the previous poster, but signing Yannick and re-signing Shaq you are planning long term for when Hughes is inevitably released in 2021. If Beane does this right, our DL next year looks like: DE: Hughes/Rookie DT1tech: Harrison/Taylor(or Liuget) DT3tech: JPhillips/Oliver DE: Yannick/Shaq That's a Super Bowl caliber DL if I've ever seen That's a 32nd ranked rush defense right there
thebandit27 Posted January 27, 2020 Posted January 27, 2020 17 minutes ago, noacls said: That's a 32nd ranked rush defense right there Not that this has to mean anything in particular, but the 22nd and 29th ranked teams in YPC allowed are facing each other for the Lombardi trophy on Sunday. 1
BeastMaster Posted January 27, 2020 Posted January 27, 2020 30 minutes ago, NewEra said: His entire game WAS a hole for the first 4 years of his career. I watch every niner game (as long as they don’t play at the same time as the Bills) and armstead was a completely different player this season. Luckily for him, because we stunk for prior to this season But it's not anymore...I think that's the point here. He's improved to the point where he's a very good all around player. Ngakoue has a glaring weakness and is small. I'd rather pay Clowney if I'm paying top dollar as opposed to Ngakoue, and I think Armstead could provide better value as high pricetag should be lower.
NewEra Posted January 27, 2020 Posted January 27, 2020 1 minute ago, BeastMaster said: But it's not anymore...I think that's the point here. He's improved to the point where he's a very good all around player. Ngakoue has a glaring weakness and is small. I'd rather pay Clowney if I'm paying top dollar as opposed to Ngakoue, and I think Armstead could provide better value as high pricetag should be lower. 4 bad years 1 good contract year where he was surrounded by the best front 7 in football. I’d pay him a Trent murphy like salary. That’s good value imo. Any more and it’s not good value. 4 bad years. One good year
thebandit27 Posted January 27, 2020 Posted January 27, 2020 7 minutes ago, BeastMaster said: But it's not anymore...I think that's the point here. He's improved to the point where he's a very good all around player. Ngakoue has a glaring weakness and is small. I'd rather pay Clowney if I'm paying top dollar as opposed to Ngakoue, and I think Armstead could provide better value as high pricetag should be lower. Is that true regarding Ngakoue? I mean, per football outsiders, the Jags’ best area for Adjusted Line Yards was left end—where Yannick plays. They were a full yard per carry better there than anywhere else.
DrDawkinstein Posted January 27, 2020 Posted January 27, 2020 1 hour ago, noacls said: That's a 32nd ranked rush defense right there You think Star was so crucial against the run? It's pretty much what we had this year except adding Yannick and losing Star and Murphy.
thebandit27 Posted January 27, 2020 Posted January 27, 2020 20 minutes ago, DrDawkinstein said: You think Star was so crucial against the run? It's pretty much what we had this year except adding Yannick and losing Star and Murphy. Star was probably our best run defender not named Shaq Lawson
DrDawkinstein Posted January 27, 2020 Posted January 27, 2020 1 minute ago, thebandit27 said: Star was probably our best run defender not named Shaq Lawson Fair enough, and that is why re-signing Shaq is a crucial piece of my plan.
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