Bills Press and Fans...It’s Time to Move On With Pat Mahomes

[nedboy7]

Twitter sucks. 

[NoHuddleKelly12]

39 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

Not the least bit unfair.........at least the Bears took a shot.

 

What's unfair is comparing the franchises.

 

The Chicago Bears have won 9 NFL championships.........including a SB team which is considered among the most dominant of all time.......... and have the second highest winning % in the history of the league.

 

The Bills are a laughingstock organization......a hard earned distinction....... who didn't have the balls to even pick a QB even though they were desperate for one............and then GAVE a great QB to a team in their own conference.    

 

Wrt the hard earned part..........keep in mind that at the time they passed on Mahomes they had never picked a QB with their original first #1 pick in ANY draft. 

 

It was a colossal mistake...........accept it and use it as motivation.

It was never my intention to compare the lifetimes of the franchises—I was merely pointing out that in the moment of the draft 3 years ago wherein you painted the Bills as singularly awful in passing the pick to the Chiefs, the Bears under your logic committed an even more grievous offense, in that they had an uncontested shot at grabbing Mahomes and instead flopped with Trubisky (even trading up to get him!), together with the next group of teams leading to #10 pick. To imply the Bills were on some kind of island in terms of their ‘mistake,’ is again, unfair. In any other year, the Bills arguably won that year’s draft with the sheer number of quality starters gained from same. 

[blacklabel]

They knew Whaley was out after the draft. They weren't going to upend all the work he and his staff had done throughout the year. You're going to royally sh*t in the boat as a first-time head coach if you clean out your entire scouting department three months before the draft. 

 

And they've said it numerous times, they did not want to pick their franchise guy until they had the front office completely settled. McDermott wasn't going to make one of the most important decisions of his career with a GM that was on his way out. They weren't going to onboard Beane in January and try to reorganize the whole front office that close to free agency and the draft. 

 

They've talked about being on the same page and having a streamlined process since the day McDermott got here. They simply wanted to wait until they had everything lined up the way they wanted before making big time decisions like unloading a bunch of bad contracts and acquiring picks they could use to trade up and get their guy.

 

Shoulda, woulda, coulda, blah blah blah, we hear it every year. Hey, they could've had Russell Wilson too. Or OBJ, or JJ Watt, etc. We can play that game all day. What's done is done. It's an exercise in futility (and stupidity if you're Jerry Sullivan or whichever media jackwagon gets your jimmies rustled) to try and discredit a team for who they didn't take. It's a stupid practice that can be applied to every team. 

 

Would Mahomes have had the success he's had anywhere else but KC? Maybe. But he walked into a pretty good situation. Sat behind an experienced vet (who played pretty well) for a year and then has a QB guru head coach and a roster full of weapons. And not to discredit Mahomes, he's great, but did y'all see how much time he had yesterday? Mustache Mike screwed the pooch with a game plan that called for a simple three-man pass rush for most of the game. Give almost any QB that kinda time and they're gonna make some plays. 

 

And as others have mentioned, they flipped those picks into an All-Pro corner and a Pro Bowl MLB, who, I feel, has just begun to scratch the surface of his potential. 

 

Just like Joe Pesci states in The Irishman (three and a half hours spread over two evenings that I'm never getting back) "It's what it is."

[BADOLBILZ]

28 minutes ago, Meatloaf63 said:

A colossal mistake? 

 

 

Yes.

 

Passing on Mahomes was a colossal mistake.

 

 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

2 hours ago, NewEra said:

Not sure why any relatively happy person would even visit this thread.  Be miserable if you like, I can’t indulge is such lunacy.  What’s done is done. Get the f over it and move on

 

So what does that say about you, Bright Eyes?

[goldenboy81]

Go niners. Don't wanna here that anymore and next year bills are gonna dominate

[Golden*Wheels]

"I almost dated this chick in high school....."

[zow2]

I recall some rumblings leading up to the draft about DeShaun Watson...that maybe he was in play.  There was not one radio interview or lead up draft rumor of Buffalo being interested in Pat Mahomes.  There was nada, zippo!  So how can anyone possibly be mad about trading w/ KC?  If anyone wants to be fake outraged, then do it over Watson because he was actually mentioned as a possibility.  Give credit to Andy Reid.  Because everyone who drafted in front of Buffalo would've taken Mahomes with 20/20 hindsight.  

[Alphadawg7]

19 minutes ago, BringBackOrton said:

Yeah man, if Allen is an All-Pro next year it all worked out. The odds of that are super low.

 

And why is that?  29 TD's where he had no continuity at WR and most the year his top 3 guys were 5'11, 5'8, 5'8...and his TE was a raw rookie and his RB was a 5'8" rookie and a 36 year old guy at end of his career.

 

Bills led the NFL in drops. 

 

Our OL was all new guys but one, and had a rotation at one of the starting spots (RT).  

 

I would say the odds are quite a bit better than you think. 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

10 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

Passing on Mahomes was a colossal mistake.

 

OK, Bet!

[HOUSE]

 

 

[BADOLBILZ]

4 minutes ago, goldenboy81 said:

Go niners. Don't wanna here that anymore and next year bills are gonna dominate

 

 

Well there is the Shanahan/Lynch vs. McDermott/Beane comparison.........McDermott inherited a lot more in 2017 than Shanahan and now Shanny has the best roster in football and is in the SB.    

 

The matchup is actually very reminiscent of that Dolphins/Niners SB...........Mahomes is Marino carrying a high octane/no run game offense and vulnerable defense to the SB against the much more well rounded Niners team lead by a less flashy but ridiculously successful young veteran QB.

 

Hopefully the Mahomes/Allen dynamic works out for Bills fans like the Marino/Kelly did.    It sucks that Kelly isn't mentioned as a top 5 all-time kinda' QB like Marino but it's about the hardware and the Bills got more.  

[muppy]

26 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

The NFL is a business.........in business it's dumb not to remember your mistakes and learn from them and use them as motivation.

 

"Dwelling" is for those with nothing else to do.........which certainly isn't the case for people running an NFL organization.

 

Now if you are......let's say........ a secretary at OBD.......and the biggest decision you make that day is what to have for lunch............yeah it's probably not productive to think too much.

I buy this enboldened actually...Motivate them how exactly...... to try to scout better, evaluate better, choose better. Okay I would think everyone would be on board for that..in other words continuing betterment of their evaluation skills in hopes of drafting better players. Fine. Having said that there is NO Way a person or organization is going to be successful 100% every time pick the player whose skills will be have been PROVEN to not be a bust at the next level.....show me One organization who nails every one of their picks every time there is none. I'll say it again it isn't an exact science if it were then no team would draft busts. But all do. To want to do and be better should be a given but WITHOUT the fans whining and weeping gnashing of teeth about every unchosen pick or opportunity I tend to think the folks in charge already want to do and be better especially because for they unlike us their jobs are on the line based on those decisions,. 

[K-9]

17 minutes ago, zow2 said:

I recall some rumblings leading up to the draft about DeShaun Watson...that maybe he was in play.  There was not one radio interview or lead up draft rumor of Buffalo being interested in Pat Mahomes.  There was nada, zippo!  So how can anyone possibly be mad about trading w/ KC?  If anyone wants to be fake outraged, then do it over Watson because he was actually mentioned as a possibility.  Give credit to Andy Reid.  Because everyone who drafted in front of Buffalo would've taken Mahomes with 20/20 hindsight.  

And everyone who drafted behind Buffalo would have tried to trade up to get him. 

[BillsFan4]

https://theathletic.com/1478914/2019/12/21/pompei-mahomes-or-mitch-here-is-what-nfl-execs-said-about-them-before-the-2017-draft/

Mahomes or Mitch? Here is what NFL execs said about them before the 2017 draft (Athletic sub. required)

 

Quote

The first thing to establish is there was no consensus on the top three quarterbacks — Mahomes, Trubisky, and Deshaun Watson, who was selected 12th by the Texans. Three of the front office men said Watson was their highest-rated quarterback. One said Trubisky was his favorite, but noted that his team had Watson ranked first. The fifth said Mahomes was his top-rated. Mahomes was ranked third by three of my sources; Trubisky was ranked third by two of them.

 

Quote

The next thing to establish is these scouts didn’t consider any of the three to be can’t-miss prospects. All five pointed out issues with each that concerned them.

“None of them should go in the first round,” front office man 1 said.

 

Quote

Front office man 1 said Mahomes had more upside than Trubisky. But he said many other evaluators ranked Trubisky ahead of Mahomes because Mahomes had a 13-16 record as a starter at Texas Tech. Front office man 5 saw past the record, to a degree, because Mahomes was backed by one of the worst defenses in college football. But front office man 2 pointed out Mahomes failed to beat quality opponents.

Sound familiar?

Quote

Three of the scouts mentioned that Watson showed more “it” factor than Trubisky and cited how Watson played his best in big games, the kind of contests that neither Mahomes nor Trubisky experienced. Watson was repeatedly referred to as a “gamer,” but there was trepidation about his 32 interceptions at Clemson.

 

Quote

Looking back, it’s interesting how much NFL scouts knew about Trubisky and Mahomes.

“Mahomes is the most gifted in terms of arm talent of all of them,” front office man 4 said. “He’s also the biggest wild card.”

Mahomes was the most divisive of the prospects. It might have been difficult to see past some of the traditional guideposts for quarterback evaluations with him. But those who did, loved him.

 

“I just like the way he plays the game,” front office man 5 said. “Has a moxie to him. He sees the field well. I liked him best from day one.”

 

Looking back at what these NFL talent evaluators thought in 2017 leaves us with these takeaways:

 

- The safe pick was Watson. Both Trubisky and Mahomes were risky.

- Both Trubisky and Mahomes were challenging to scout.

- Choosing Trubisky or Mahomes meant “betting on the come,” as front office man 4 said, using craps verbiage to describe a long-term bet with risk.

 

 

Thought this was was an interesting read and a good reminder that Mahomes was far from a sure thing (which is why so many QB needy teams passed on him). A lot was said about his mechanics/footwork (I remember a common thing was people saying no one had ever succeeded in the NFL with footwork/mechanics as bad as Mahomes), him struggling against quality opponents, having a losing record as starter, and that qb’s from air raid systems are a big gamble, etc.

 

Sure, it looks like the Bills screwed up passing on Mahomes, but at the time many thought it was a smart move to stack assets for what was almost universally considered a much deeper/stronger 2018 QB class. 

 

I know now I thought it was a smart move at the time. I don’t do the deep dives into college prospects that some do, so I rely on what I read and the little I watch.

 

Mahomes was the only QB I wanted but I thought pick #10 was too high to draft him (shows what I know! ?).Everyone said it was a great draft for CBs and 2018 was the year to take a QB. 

So I applauded the Bills for making what seemed like a smart move. I was worried they’d draft a QB in a weaker 2017 draft class and then pass on a QB the next year in a much stronger class (like what happened in 2013 with EJ Manuel).

 

 

 

 

Its also worth mentioning that Kansas City was a very good team even before Mahomes, with elite weapons on offense. They had 11, 9, 11, 12 and 10 win seasons in the 5 years under Andy Reid before Mahomes and made the playoffs all but 1 season. He stepped into a pretty ideal situation, especially w/Andy Reid mentoring him.

[Ramza86]

Call me delusional, but i dont see him being half as good as he currently is today. 

If we had some talent, and a talented OC id probably be pissed about it....but i just had no faith back then.

[K-9]

4 minutes ago, Margarita said:

I buy this enboldened actually...Motivate them how exactly...... to try to scout better, evaluate better, choose better. Okay I would think everyone would be on board for that..in other words continuing betterment of their evaluation skills in hopes of drafting better players. Fine. Having said that there is NO Way a person or organization is going to be successful 100% every time pick the player whose skills will be have been PROVEN to not be a bust at the next level.....show me One organization who nails every one of their picks every time there is none. I'll say it again it isn't an exact science if it were then no team would draft busts. But all do. To want to do and be better should be a given but WITHOUT the fans whining and weeping gnashing of teeth about every unchosen pick or opportunity I tend to think the folks in charge already want to do and be better especially because for they unlike us their jobs are on the line based on those decisions,. 

Nobody, NOBODY, in the NFL is NOT motivated to do their jobs better. In a business that defines the very nature of the “what have you done for me lately” mindset, EVERYBODY involved is dedicated to doing something NOW. 
 

We, as fans, just can’t believe that’s the case. And that says more about us than it does about those in charge of our favorite teams. 

[Doc Brown]

5 hours ago, Chemical said:

I have no problem moving on. The problem comes from fans that won’t admit Mahomes is great. Why can’t they admit that? Admit it was a mistake to draft Nathan Peterman then a project QB the following year instead of Mahomes and then move on. 

That's my main beef is the fans out there that think we made the correct decision in getting White, Edmunds, and Allen instead of Mahomes.  That Mahomes wouldn't have succeeded in Buffalo because he didn't have the pieces or coaches around him that he does in Kansas City.  I don't even think Hue Jackson could've prevented Mahomes from being a Superstar if Cleveland drafted him.

 

I'll give Pegula for firing Whaley the next day after that draft for that blunder (albeit incidentally).

[Success]

I don’t know why people get hung up on this stuff.  Draft hindsight is always 20/20 - without fail - and can drive you bananas.

 

I never think for a second “what if we had Mahomes.”  Because we don’t have him, and won’t.  We have Josh Allen.

[NewEra]

50 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

So what does that say about you, Bright Eyes?

Lol.  Got me there.  I should have said “read this thread” not visit.  I haven’t read a bit of it minus your reply

 

its fixed

Edited January 20, 2020 by NewEra