Did the lack of production from Jones/Foster/Kroft hamper Daboll & the offense?

[Hapless Bills Fan]

4 minutes ago, Meatloaf63 said:

Did you ever notice how far Mahomes drops?

 

@Meatloaf63, as I understand it, it's not the depth of the drop per se that's important - depth will be different in a 3, 5 and 7 step drop

It's the consistency and where the line expects him to be so they can block accordingly.

[NoSaint]

On 1/17/2020 at 11:34 AM, Jerry Jabber said:

While the offense underperformed this season, was it mainly due to the surprisingly lack of production from Zay Jones/Robert Foster/Tyler Kroft who were expected to have big roles in the offense, Daboll's play calling or a combination of the two? I'm sure the coaches were expecting Zay to be their #2 WR, Foster to be their deep threat and Kroft to be that underneath guy that could move the chains.

I mean it surely didn’t help but you can’t count on three guys that haven’t proven it to all be above their average. 
 

that said I’m surprised zay went from heavy load of ok play to totally not functioning. 

[Meatloaf63]

3 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

@Meatloaf63, as I understand it, it's not the depth of the drop per se that's important - depth will be different in a 3, 5 and 7 step drop

It's the consistency and where the line expects him to be so they can block accordingly.

I’m rewatching yesterday’s game now and Mahomes is consistently dropping deeper which seems to give him more time with a clean look in front of him. But this can only be done with better line play especially the tackles. We just don’t on average give Allen this protection. It allows him to move an adjust as the pressure does come, but what’s really amazing is watching Mahomes move backwards and sideways, his eyes are always going downfield. He’s so quick backing up and scrambling, it’s really something to watch...

[NoSaint]

6 minutes ago, Meatloaf63 said:

I’m rewatching yesterday’s game now and Mahomes is consistently dropping deeper which seems to give him more time with a clean look in front of him. But this can only be done with better line play especially the tackles. We just don’t on average give Allen this protection. It allows him to move an adjust as the pressure does come, but what’s really amazing is watching Mahomes move backwards and sideways, his eyes are always going downfield. He’s so quick backing up and scrambling, it’s really something to watch...

I haven’t quantified it but I bet he bails with his back to the line less often 

[Meatloaf63]

2 minutes ago, NoSaint said:

I haven’t quantified it but I bet he bails with his back to the line less often 

I just watched two series and no matter how he moved, he keeps his body facing forward more than qb I’ve ever seen. Just incredible...

[muppy]

On 1/17/2020 at 11:42 AM, LABILLBACKER said:

Daboll made his bed and now he'll have to lie in it. He chose to limit Singletary. He chose to sit Duke & TJ all year for Gore and Foster. You live and die with the decisions you make. Yes he was limited on weapons but he still made stupid decisions on play calling. This team with a little more innovation could've produced more than 19 pts per game. Our lack of offense probably forces McD to crawl into his defensive conservative shell. 

HERE HERE I concur with all of this. The fact that Daboll lacked innovation as well as the players he DID utilize and some of the calls he did make at times was head scratching (a few DiMarco plays come to mind) and some very inopportune costly penalties hurt the offense production at times also. Talent could have helped in some situations but in others when drops occurred its like DANG that play was 6 or a long gainer if the guy had hung on to the ball..in other words the call WAS right it was the EXECUTION that lacked. So it is a mixed bag. 

[Nihilarian]

On 1/17/2020 at 1:15 PM, John from Riverside said:

The Robert Foster thing I will never understand...that guy looked like a breakout player the 2nd half of the year before

The only thing i can think of is that in 2018 the Bills led the NFL with the most deep passing attempts...this with one of the leagues worst offensive lines. Which gave Allen very little time in the pocket to complete those deep passes. Hence all the QB running. 

 

 That, along with Allen's completion percentage which wasn't so great from all those deep passing attempts. The deep pass has a very low chance for completion even among the better QB's. So, in my view McD went to Daboll and wanted to change all this. 

 

The Bills brought in Cole Beasley to help with the short passing game which would intern help with the completion percentage. Now Robert Foster was injured at the start of the season and no idea when he was fully healthy. Then looking at how long it took this OC to get Duke Williams involved in the offense, who knows. 

 

The one thing I know for certain is the only way to get better at something is repetition, practice. The way the Bills offense failed at the deep pass this season tells me they simply didn't practice it enough. You would think that with the upgrades to the O line and the strongest arm in the league that they would work that deep passing game over and over this year. A lot didn't make much sense this season...particularly when the run game is working so well and they go pass happy. All in all this made Allen look much worse IMO.

[3rdand12]

8 hours ago, Thurman#1 said:

 

 

Plenty of good, unscared QBs have bad games against very good defenses. I never saw him scared. Confused, yeah. Overwhelmed at times, yeah, that's fair I think.

 

But did he regress? I mean of course he had areas and times when he did, but overall? Just the opposite, he improved. Still has a lot farther to go, but he's trending in the right direction.

 

 

 

 

 

As father of a bilingual four year-old daughter, I approve of this message. And she did start slowly, but now speaks both languages naturally and appropriately.

Let me change my word to "rattled"

and i am not worried he will over come and continue to improve. as he has shown from game to game and season to season.

[Jerry Jabber]

14 hours ago, NoSaint said:

I mean it surely didn’t help but you can’t count on three guys that haven’t proven it to all be above their average. 
 

that said I’m surprised zay went from heavy load of ok play to totally not functioning. 

After the incident in the hotel room, it's apparent Zay has some mental issues. That could be a huge reason why Zay's production took a nose dive this season in both Buffalo and Oakland. 

[NoSaint]

8 hours ago, Jerry Jabber said:

After the incident in the hotel room, it's apparent Zay has some mental issues. That could be a huge reason why Zay's production took a nose dive this season in both Buffalo and Oakland. 

Or he just got high/drunk and did something dumb.  I’ve always suspected that while his home life is likely a bit dramatic that night was probably mostly youthful indiscretion and not psychotic break.

[Buffalo Bills Fan]

22 hours ago, Nihilarian said:

The only thing i can think of is that in 2018 the Bills led the NFL with the most deep passing attempts...this with one of the leagues worst offensive lines. Which gave Allen very little time in the pocket to complete those deep passes. Hence all the QB running. 

 

 That, along with Allen's completion percentage which wasn't so great from all those deep passing attempts. The deep pass has a very low chance for completion even among the better QB's. So, in my view McD went to Daboll and wanted to change all this. 

 

The Bills brought in Cole Beasley to help with the short passing game which would intern help with the completion percentage. Now Robert Foster was injured at the start of the season and no idea when he was fully healthy. Then looking at how long it took this OC to get Duke Williams involved in the offense, who knows. 

 

The one thing I know for certain is the only way to get better at something is repetition, practice. The way the Bills offense failed at the deep pass this season tells me they simply didn't practice it enough. You would think that with the upgrades to the O line and the strongest arm in the league that they would work that deep passing game over and over this year. A lot didn't make much sense this season...particularly when the run game is working so well and they go pass happy. All in all this made Allen look much worse IMO.

 

Problem is Foster is skilled one area go deep. For defense it's much easier to defend it when it is one skilled area.. Bill's need more players multiple skills and good at it.  

Edited January 22, 2020 by Buffalo Bills Fan

[Jerry Jabber]

11 hours ago, NoSaint said:

Or he just got high/drunk and did something dumb.  I’ve always suspected that while his home life is likely a bit dramatic that night was probably mostly youthful indiscretion and not psychotic break.

Hopefully that was the case