Success Posted January 8, 2020 Posted January 8, 2020 29 minutes ago, GunnerBill said: I think the "Belichick is an average drafter" thing is so overdone. The last few years they have traded away draft picks to load up with vets for final runs with Brady so they have not had many 1st round picks (have still done okay in later rounds) but there was a spell when they drafted really well in the 1st (around the turn of the last decade: Patrick Chung, Devin McCourty, Nate Solder, Chandler Jones, Donate Hightower, Jamie Collins) they really killed it there for a few years and were still finding Gronk and Hernandez and Edelman and Spikes and James White in later rounds. He's average. BB the coach bails out BB the GM more often than not. I think he outsmarts himself in the draft. He loves trading down & loading up on later round picks. Which ultimately means that he's replacing great players w/ middlin' players, and hoping for the big "hit" like Brady in the 6th all those years ago.
GunnerBill Posted January 8, 2020 Posted January 8, 2020 56 minutes ago, atlbillsfan1975 said: Go look at their last 4 years worth of picks, which is relevant to now and then next 3-4 years. Most of those players you mentioned are aging quickly or out of the league. I agree but that is because they have loaded up and traded away pics for vets to eek the last few drops out of Brady. Belichick has not always been a poor drafter. It is a common misconception.
eball Posted January 8, 2020 Posted January 8, 2020 2 hours ago, Chris66 said: I think he is contemplating the quickest way to fix it. He has stated several times this year he is not ready to hang em up. I think the all time win record is important to him. He's still 50+ wins behind Shula...that's a minimum of 4-5 years.
Hapless Bills Fan Posted January 8, 2020 Posted January 8, 2020 Topic titles must reflect the content of the topic (and it must contain more than just a name). This helps to reduce the number of duplicate topics and makes the community much more user friendly. Please edit the title so that it properly reflects the discussion that you started. Thank you.
hjnick Posted January 8, 2020 Posted January 8, 2020 4 hours ago, njbuff said: and tanking for Trevor in 2020. I know it’s not in BB’s DNA to tank, but if Brady is not there in 2020, would BB tear it down to get his hands on the next Brady to carry him thru his twilight coaching years???? Interesting I would if I was New England. He's the best prospect to come out in a long time IMO. Have Bellycheck keep coaching thru the preseason... THEN he goes down with an 'illness' that will sideline him for the season... PERFECT reason for a tank. Please don't tell New England this. Thanks.
atlbillsfan1975 Posted January 8, 2020 Posted January 8, 2020 1 hour ago, GunnerBill said: I agree but that is because they have loaded up and traded away pics for vets to eek the last few drops out of Brady. Belichick has not always been a poor drafter. It is a common misconception. In 2017 they traded away a bunch of picks. Other than that they have had plenty of picks. In 2018 they had two first rounders. Neither one of those have made anywhere near the impact Buffalo’s 2 2018 first rounders have made.
RiotAct Posted January 8, 2020 Posted January 8, 2020 4 hours ago, njbuff said: and tanking for Trevor in 2020. I know it’s not in BB’s DNA to tank, but if Brady is not there in 2020, would BB tear it down to get his hands on the next Brady to carry him thru his twilight coaching years???? you answered your own question
GunnerBill Posted January 8, 2020 Posted January 8, 2020 8 minutes ago, atlbillsfan1975 said: In 2017 they traded away a bunch of picks. Other than that they have had plenty of picks. In 2018 they had two first rounders. Neither one of those have made anywhere near the impact Buffalo’s 2 2018 first rounders have made. In fairness what did we pick in 2018? #7 and #16? What did they pick? mid 20s and #31? Add to that Isaiah Wynn got injured in training camp and missed his whole rookie year and then missed another 6 or so weeks this year. Their oline was noticeably better when he returned (not that this says a huge amount) but he can play. He will prove a very good pick. Sony Michel I will give you, that was a poor selection at the time in my mind. I thought he was a 3rd round prospect who I can't really explain their reach for. They also picked Duke Dawson in the 2nd, who I had been high on the whole way through and was a "late riser" in the process but even I thought that was early for him. He isn't even on the roster now he is at Denver. But while they had two firsts and a 2nd they then didn't pick again until later on in day 3. They were still trading away picks. I think some of their drafting struggles in recent years are on a change in approach to load up for runs now. But the backbone of the team that saw the 2nd half of the dynasty come to fruition, making 4 Superbowls in 5 years, came through the draft. I accept so far they haven't done a good enough job at drafting to replace those players and I think you could argue their best player the past two years has been Stephon Gilmore who as we all know was drafted by Good ole' Buddy Nix. But the argument that Belichick is a bad to average drafter doesn't really stack up when you look at his resume in full.
1ManRaid Posted January 8, 2020 Posted January 8, 2020 4 hours ago, Rc2catch said: If that’s the case then I’d expect him to trade for cam newton and possibly attempt to mimic what Baltimore is doing. They already have the personnel minus needing some tight ends. Cam would probably stay healthy in New England too because refs would flag anyone even looking the wrong way at the Patriots' QB.
LOVEMESOMEBILLS Posted January 8, 2020 Posted January 8, 2020 1 hour ago, GunnerBill said: I agree but that is because they have loaded up and traded away pics for vets to eek the last few drops out of Brady. Belichick has not always been a poor drafter. It is a common misconception. So let's look the most recent year they had some front end capital. In 2018 they had (2) 1st and a 2nd round pick. They selected Isaiah Wynn, Sony Michel & Duke Dawson respectively. Wynn has been hurt twice already and has only played in 8 of the 32 games so far. Michel has been good, but definitely not great for the 2 years he's been there. Chubb was there for the taking and has been the better RB of the two to date. Duke Dawson was traded away a year later with a 7th rounder for a 6th round pick. A 2nd + 7th for a 6th one year later, that's no bueno. All in all for (2) firsts and a 2nd that's not very much production at all over the first two years.
GunnerBill Posted January 8, 2020 Posted January 8, 2020 1 minute ago, LOVEMESOMEBILLS said: So let's look the most recent year they had some front end capital. In 2018 they had (2) 1st and a 2nd round pick. They selected Isaiah Wynn, Sony Michel & Duke Dawson respectively. Wynn has been hurt twice already and has only played in 8 of the 32 games so far. Michel has been good, but definitely not great for the 2 years he's been there. Chubb was there for the taking and has been the better RB of the two to date. Duke Dawson was traded away a year later with a 7th rounder for a 6th round pick. A 2nd + 7th for a 6th one year later, that's no bueno. All in all for (2) firsts and a 2nd that's not very much production at all over the first two years. I agree. And I said as much above. I think Wynn will be good but I have never been a big Sony Michel man. But Belichick has been in charge of personnel at New England nearly 20 years. He has drafted much more good than bad.
MrEpsYtown Posted January 8, 2020 Posted January 8, 2020 5 hours ago, njbuff said: and tanking for Trevor in 2020. I know it’s not in BB’s DNA to tank, but if Brady is not there in 2020, would BB tear it down to get his hands on the next Brady to carry him thru his twilight coaching years???? Interesting I 100% agree with this. I think Belichick is going to coach forever and I think Brady wants to prove he can win without him. For them, I think it is the perfect time to tank. I think NE tanks and drafts Lawrence. I think Brady goes to Dallas to play behind that offensive line with Elliot in the backfield and Amari Cooper on the outside. It also allows Dallas to move on from Dak, which deep down is something I think they want. No one can argue with moving on from Dak if he is replaced by Brady. (ala Tebow for Peyton) I think Joe Buck's head might explode if Brady is playing for America's team. Dak goes to MIami where he is a much better fit in Chan Gailey's offense and Miami has their long term quarterback. I think Rivers goes to Tampa and plays for Bruce Arians, I think they would be a good fit. Winston goes to the Chargers and plays for Anthony Lynn. I also like Andy Dalton in Indy. That's the end of my quarterback carousel that will likely never happen. 1
MAJBobby Posted January 8, 2020 Posted January 8, 2020 5 hours ago, njbuff said: and tanking for Trevor in 2020. I know it’s not in BB’s DNA to tank, but if Brady is not there in 2020, would BB tear it down to get his hands on the next Brady to carry him thru his twilight coaching years???? Interesting No But I bet he is SUPER Pissed about having Brady and Kraft force him to trade Jimmy G. 1
njbuff Posted January 8, 2020 Author Posted January 8, 2020 1 hour ago, RiotAct said: you answered your own question I know. I just wonder what would happen to NE if Brady didn’t re-sign there.
LOVEMESOMEBILLS Posted January 8, 2020 Posted January 8, 2020 33 minutes ago, GunnerBill said: I agree. And I said as much above. I think Wynn will be good but I have never been a big Sony Michel man. But Belichick has been in charge of personnel at New England nearly 20 years. He has drafted much more good than bad. You're correct, but the good seems to be in the distant past and the bad seems like recent memory. Even their 1st round pick this year N'Keal Harris, missed the first 9 games(Seems like there's a pattern here) then played the rest of the year. In 7 games:12 catches for 105 yards and 2 TDs with the best QB ever throwing him the ball. There's probably at least 8-10 rookie WRs that would've outperformed him if he had play all year, several catching passes from average QB, to below average QBs. 1
GunnerBill Posted January 8, 2020 Posted January 8, 2020 1 hour ago, LOVEMESOMEBILLS said: You're correct, but the good seems to be in the distant past and the bad seems like recent memory. Even their 1st round pick this year N'Keal Harris, missed the first 9 games(Seems like there's a pattern here) then played the rest of the year. In 7 games:12 catches for 105 yards and 2 TDs with the best QB ever throwing him the ball. There's probably at least 8-10 rookie WRs that would've outperformed him if he had play all year, several catching passes from average QB, to below average QBs. Again I thought AJ Brown was the best receiver in the class and DK was 2nd so it doesn't surprise me those two are better than Harry. But 1 year is early to write off his 2019 class I think. And as I say.... you have to look over the entity of his time there.
Jay_Fixit Posted January 8, 2020 Posted January 8, 2020 7 hours ago, dave mcbride said: No, and I can practically guarantee you that he’s thinking of ways to secure home field advantage in 2020 and avoid WC weekend. They had the number one defense in practically every category, for chrissake. It’s for Christ’s Sake.
PatsFanNH Posted January 8, 2020 Posted January 8, 2020 2 hours ago, MrEpsYtown said: I 100% agree with this. I think Belichick is going to coach forever and I think Brady wants to prove he can win without him. For them, I think it is the perfect time to tank. I think NE tanks and drafts Lawrence. I think Brady goes to Dallas to play behind that offensive line with Elliot in the backfield and Amari Cooper on the outside. It also allows Dallas to move on from Dak, which deep down is something I think they want. No one can argue with moving on from Dak if he is replaced by Brady. (ala Tebow for Peyton) I think Joe Buck's head might explode if Brady is playing for America's team. Dak goes to MIami where he is a much better fit in Chan Gailey's offense and Miami has their long term quarterback. I think Rivers goes to Tampa and plays for Bruce Arians, I think they would be a good fit. Winston goes to the Chargers and plays for Anthony Lynn. I also like Andy Dalton in Indy. That's the end of my quarterback carousel that will likely never happen. One major issue with Brady to Dallas. He absolutely HATES the Dallas Cowboys.. he can’t stand them.. said so numerous times it’s his 49er fandom coming out lol 1
dave mcbride Posted January 8, 2020 Posted January 8, 2020 (edited) 11 minutes ago, Jay_Fixit said: It’s for Christ’s Sake. https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/Chrissake PS - Here's the OED entry: https://www.oed.com/view/Entry/32426?redirectedFrom=chrissake#eid Chris(s)ake, n. Etymology: Shortened < Christ's sake. colloq. ‘Christ's sake’, used in oaths, etc. Usually preceded by for. 1933 E. Hemingway Winner take Nothing (1934) 199 ‘Oh for Chrisake,’ the detective sergeant said. 1943 P. Cheyney You can always Duck vi. 96 ‘For chrissake!’ he says. ‘What do you mean?’ 1951 J. D. Salinger Catcher in Rye iii. 28 For Chrissake, grow up. 1953 W. R. Burnett Vanity Row ii. 18 Chrissake, can't she sit up here? 1954 M. Procter Hell is City iii. xv. 143 For Chrissake gimme a cigarette. Edited January 8, 2020 by dave mcbride
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