row_33 Posted January 8, 2020 Posted January 8, 2020 33 minutes ago, whatdrought said: It's possible that that perception was there and going back far enough definitely finds racist history deeply entrenched in the NFL, and obviously I don't agree with it. I just like to be careful with sweeping statements about how things "used to be" or "it's just how they are" (not accusing you, just in general) instead of looking at specific situations and what factors went into them. Hindsight always help the evaluation process. I didn't follow the draft that closely then, but I know the idea of Mitch being the cream of the QB crop wasn't a small population saying that, and I don't think that has to do with racist intent or undercurrent. lots of other key factors beside stats....
pennstate10 Posted January 8, 2020 Posted January 8, 2020 College Football doesn’t have a Rooney rule, but the number of black coaches has increased. For instance Penn State has a black head coach. And over half of PSU assistant coaches are black also. I think it takes time. I know there are exceptions but head coaches Typically have to grind and grind as assistants for 15-20 yrs before they get a shot at a head coaching position. I think rather than a Rooney rule, increasing opportunities as interns and volunteer assistant position coaches is the way to go. These guys will pay their dues and learn coaching (which, to be clear, is MUCH different than playing) from the bottom up. In addition, they will have developed the relationships and networks that will be necessary for a head guy to successfully recruit his staff of assistants.
whatdrought Posted January 8, 2020 Posted January 8, 2020 1 hour ago, C.Biscuit97 said: There isn’t any truth in this? Why did Matt Nagy who wasn’t the Chiefs playcaller either get a job yet EB who oversaw a record breaking one not get one? i do understand that it is annoying how it can be that race works it’s way into the conversation but there are some bad optics. I didn't see the second half of this post (responding to the tweets) until just now. The first tweet (first in my post, not chronologically) is accurate, he isn't a playcaller but neither were those guys so it should be looked past and it isn't a good reason not to hire him. The second tweet I posted is disingenuous as it ignores Judge's work with the Pats ST's and that (along with several other tweets regarding the RR) really heavily imply that he believes Bienime (I've spelt that 80 different ways today, still don't know what's right) was passed over due to being A.A. Not only does it accuse the Giants of racism, but it further accuses Judge of being unqualified and only getting the position because of his race. The Giants interviewed both of these guys and the implication, i think, with this line of discussion (Wyches tweets) is that the Giants sat back, said "this guy is a better candidate, but he's a minority, so lets go with the NE guy." and I just refuse to believe that in the absence of some concrete proof. I just find it upsetting that that accusation, whether direct or implied, is so easily bandied about without validation. There's nothing that clearly says that B. is a better coach than Judge is. If it was clear as all of that, there would be no ambiguity to the coaching carousal each year and it would be a matter of which team was gonna shell out the most cash. Now, I will say this to be completely fair to SW- I could be misreading this and piecing together a narrative that isn't there. His tweets directly about Judge and B. don't reference race or the RR. That being said, given the entire context of his twitter dealings from that day, it seems as if the race issue is his focus. But again, it may be two unrelated things so take my interpretation as just that.
Buffalo Junction Posted January 8, 2020 Posted January 8, 2020 21 hours ago, whatdrought said: Almost made a thread on this earlier, but wasn’t sure how it would go over. The flak now is is that the rule isn’t resaulting in many minorities being hired. Technically speaking, something like 20% of the open positions have been filled with a minority candidate this year (Rivera in WSH) which is not all that much lower than the 30% minority makeup of the US. The problem, and the argument that Stephen A. and others don’t seem to want to engage regarding this, is that you can’t debate the Rooney rule and the lack of minority coaches in a racial vaccum. You have to present actual examples of minority coaches who are more deserving of the position being passed over. That’s kinda hard to do, I think. The problem, in my humble opinion, is that any time you look at anything but qualifications for a job or position, you break the system. This anger about minorities not being respresented has to intrinsically include an accusation that an owners racism is worth more to them than winning. That’s a hard pill to swallow. I’m not necessarily sure that it’s an owners issue. It’s an issue that needs to be examined from the bottom up.... How many assistant coaching hires are minority candidates, are they promoted, is there more or less equality in the college ranks? Many of the best candidates tend to rise to the top, but if the best prospects never get that job as Asst LB coach at Middle Tennessee State they’ll never sniff a career. Another thing to look at with these coaching hires is the prevalence of former QBs and minority QB trends over the past few decades. A lot of these offensive coaches played QB.
Mr. WEO Posted January 8, 2020 Posted January 8, 2020 21 hours ago, Limeaid said: Every employer I have been with in last 20 years where clearance was not required. They have a different pay scale for Asians and people from the Middle East at your company? How does that fly?
Jpsredemption Posted January 9, 2020 Posted January 9, 2020 23 hours ago, Jauronimo said: There are literally riots in the street whenever whitey gets hired. I have a dream, that one day a white man can get a fair shake in America!! Until then, we shall overcome!!! And what you said was racist. Hope you are proud of yourself and your party of choice.
row_33 Posted January 9, 2020 Posted January 9, 2020 17 hours ago, Mr. WEO said: They have a different pay scale for Asians and people from the Middle East at your company? How does that fly? they both make the highest $$$
Mr. WEO Posted January 9, 2020 Posted January 9, 2020 3 minutes ago, row_33 said: they both make the highest $$$ Not at Limeaid's sweatshop
row_33 Posted January 9, 2020 Posted January 9, 2020 17 hours ago, Mr. WEO said: They have a different pay scale for Asians and people from the Middle East at your company? How does that fly? they are punished for a history of SAT scores that break the model.
Jauronimo Posted January 9, 2020 Posted January 9, 2020 11 minutes ago, Jpsredemption said: And what you said was racist. Hope you are proud of yourself and your party of choice. Da fuq are you talking about?
Putin Posted January 9, 2020 Posted January 9, 2020 On 1/7/2020 at 6:35 PM, Sunshower said: I couldn’t disagree more. I think if an owner thinks an African American coach gives you a better chance than a white guy, they’ll get hired. Could be wrong but teams are way too competitive to not hire the best coach. Could be wrong though but I’ll try n keep an open mind. That's what I believe as well AND at the end of the day ( I HOPE ) it's ALL ABOUT WINNING . If the owner is racist then he's in the wrong business its just hard for me to believe that a GM or the owner would pass on a African American coach knowing that he gives him a better chance of winning ,
row_33 Posted January 9, 2020 Posted January 9, 2020 4 minutes ago, Putin said: That's what I believe as well AND at the end of the day ( I HOPE ) it's ALL ABOUT WINNING . If the owner is racist then he's in the wrong business its just hard for me to believe that a GM or the owner would pass on a African American coach knowing that he gives him a better chance of winning , you have an example of an owner's prime reason for not hiring is the race of the applicant?
Rodney1243 Posted January 9, 2020 Posted January 9, 2020 Hello. I want to ask how much you know for the Spanish economy, now you can look for their progress here https://www.mundiario.com/articulo/economia/economia-espanola-otono-2015-y-prestamos-momento/20151210135143050644.html
Jauronimo Posted January 9, 2020 Posted January 9, 2020 4 minutes ago, Rodney1243 said: Hello. I want to ask how much you know for the Spanish economy, now you can look for their progress here https://www.mundiario.com/articulo/economia/economia-espanola-otono-2015-y-prestamos-momento/20151210135143050644.html Hi! You seem cute. Lets chat on PM. Wanna see my pics?
Putin Posted January 9, 2020 Posted January 9, 2020 34 minutes ago, Jpsredemption said: And what you said was racist. Hope you are proud of yourself and your party of choice. And here we go
whatdrought Posted January 9, 2020 Posted January 9, 2020 Wow... That isn't even the trolliest thing to happen to this board this week.... 1
PatsFanNH Posted January 9, 2020 Posted January 9, 2020 IMO this year teams are hiring before they do their do diligence. Every one of them (except Cleveland) made a decision in a weeks time.. not allowing any current coordinators to interview (white, black, Martian) and ALL before they talked to McDaniels who is suppose to be this hot commodity this year again. (He has earned a new HC job even if I believe his entire success is because Brady made him look good.) 1
vincec Posted January 9, 2020 Posted January 9, 2020 (edited) I think the basis of the Rooney rule was to raise the profile for viable minority candidates by granting them interviews with decision makers as well as the media attention that goes with it. Then they are at least on people's radar screens when positions arise. I know as a past employee and current employer that it's never bad to have a good interview. Even if you don't get the position your name will circulate and put you in better contention for other opportunities. People hire based on relationships. That's a big reason that the same coaches get recycled from position to position. If someone hasn't met you or has never even heard of you then your chances are pretty slim. The rule is supposed to help with this. Edited January 9, 2020 by vincec
Jauronimo Posted January 9, 2020 Posted January 9, 2020 21 minutes ago, Putin said: That's what I believe as well AND at the end of the day ( I HOPE ) it's ALL ABOUT WINNING . If the owner is racist then he's in the wrong business its just hard for me to believe that a GM or the owner would pass on a African American coach knowing that he gives him a better chance of winning , Think of it a little differently, as in a scenario where a GM or Owner has a bias, consciously or subconsciously, and thinks that no African American coach or executive gives them a better chance of winning than their white counter parts. It seems unthinkable, but then again we saw similar attitudes toward black QBs. Less nefariously, people often hire those that they relate to better. Often people who look like themselves and share more similar backgrounds.
vincec Posted January 9, 2020 Posted January 9, 2020 10 minutes ago, PatsFanNH said: IMO this year teams are hiring before they do their do diligence. Every one of them (except Cleveland) made a decision in a weeks time.. not allowing any current coordinators to interview (white, black, Martian) and ALL before they talked to McDaniels who is suppose to be this hot commodity this year again. (He has earned a new HC job even if I believe his entire success is because Brady made him look good.) It's like musical chairs. No one wants to be left with some leftover that no one wanted when the music stops... 1
Recommended Posts