Good Twitter Thread Breaking Down Allen vs. Houston

[DCOrange]

Breaking it up into chunks of two tweets at a time:

 

Edited January 7, 2020 by DCOrange

[dave mcbride]

Good stuff - thanks.

[JoshAllenHasBigHands]

This is why the Dabol hate is so stupid.  Like, I don't think its just wrong. Its just stupid. 

[GunnerBill]

13 minutes ago, JoshAllenHasBigHands said:

This is why the Dabol hate is so stupid.  Like, I don't think its just wrong. Its just stupid. 

 

It isn't even that Daboll doesn't deserve any criticism. He does. It is just that you read this board and every offensive play that doesn't work is Brian Daboll's fault.

 

Josh Allen makes a wrong read? Daboll's fault. 

Receiver drops a catchable ball? Daboll's fault. 

Three blockers fail to execute basic block in a game on the line position? Daboll's fault. 

Josh Allen checks into a run with 30 seconds left and 1 time out? Daboll's fault.

 

It is particularly the case with Allen because there are some fans who will just put the blame anywhere else. But it is a theme of Bills fans for years. Always blame the offensive coordinator for not getting more out of sub standard offensive talent. 

 

You know when we had a decent offense? 2015 and 2016.... when we had two offensive linemen go to the pro bowl, Lesean McCoy still close to his prime, a decent tight end in Charles Clay (before his knee became positively arthritic) and talent at receiver - Watkins, Woods, Hogan, Harvin and Goodwin. Yes we had Greg Roman who was and is a very good offensive coordinator but we know those other guys are good because with the exception of Wood, who never played anywhere else, they all have solid NFL production in other spots before Buffalo, after Buffalo or both. 

 

I know I sound like a broken record. But I just can't stress how strongly I feel that the biggest problem offensively remains talent. We just don't have enough good players. 

 

And I should say that I don't think Josh played a bad game on Saturday and while I see the point on some of those clips, on others yes there might have been different places Josh could have gone with the ball but the places he did go were still somewhat effective in those situations. 

 

But firing Daboll is not the answer to improving our offense. Josh getting better and the Bills improving the talent around him is. 

[Coach Tuesday]

There's that McKenzie play I've been ranting about - would've taken it to the house, most likely, but Josh throws it into the dirt.  Frustrating.

[Lurker]

IDK.  I disagree with about half of his analysis.     

 

But, one thing I do agree on is that Josh needs to get rid of the ball quicker.     That will be the year-3 make or break tell we'll have to look for...

[JoshAllenHasBigHands]

27 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

It isn't even that Daboll doesn't deserve any criticism. He does. It is just that you read this board and every offensive play that doesn't work is Brian Daboll's fault.

 

Josh Allen makes a wrong read? Daboll's fault. 

Receiver drops a catchable ball? Daboll's fault. 

Three blockers fail to execute basic block in a game on the line position? Daboll's fault. 

Josh Allen checks into a run with 30 seconds left and 1 time out? Daboll's fault.

 

It is particularly the case with Allen because there are some fans who will just put the blame anywhere else. But it is a theme of Bills fans for years. Always blame the offensive coordinator for not getting more out of sub standard offensive talent. 

 

You know when we had a decent offense? 2015 and 2016.... when we had two offensive linemen go to the pro bowl, Lesean McCoy still close to his prime, a decent tight end in Charles Clay (before his knee became positively arthritic) and talent at receiver - Watkins, Woods, Hogan, Harvin and Goodwin. Yes we had Greg Roman who was and is a very good offensive coordinator but we know those other guys are good because with the exception of Wood, who never played anywhere else, they all have solid NFL production in other spots before Buffalo, after Buffalo or both. 

 

I know I sound like a broken record. But I just can't stress how strongly I feel that the biggest problem offensively remains talent. We just don't have enough good players. 

 

And I should say that I don't think Josh played a bad game on Saturday and while I see the point on some of those clips, on others yes there might have been different places Josh could have gone with the ball but the places he did go were still somewhat effective in those situations. 

 

But firing Daboll is not the answer to improving our offense. Josh getting better and the Bills improving the talent around him is. 

 

There is no way to look at every play, in isolation, and not have some criticism.  But that is true of every OC.  Whether its McDaniels (who is booe'd by fans at Gillette) or Reid (or was boo'd in Philly for running too many screens), all OCs will make bad calls through a game.  But, on the whole, when their offense executes, they are superb. The same will be true of Dabol. The proof is in the pudding--the films reveals that absent the execution errors, this game ends in a blow out. 

 

For me, its 90% on Allen and 10% on talent.  I just think Allen is not seeing the whole field yet. He has improved dramatically, but he has a ways to go.  If he takes that next step (similar to last season's jump), he, and this offense on a whole, will be elite.  I am crazy excited for the future.   

[Marvlevydraftdaygenius]

Dabol, is to blame because he has QB out there saving his fat ass as a coordinator.  There is a reason Dabol, for how long he has been a coordinator has never had a top offense.  He has Josh Allen, throwing to 5'8 wide receivers no size on deep balls and when he throws the deep ball in the game Josh gets destroyed for throwing to a full back well I guess Tom Ratham, should never be considered for the hall of fame he was a full back, Darrell Johnson, should not be in the hall of fame he was full back.  Keep blaming Josh and not blame the real person Dabol.

[blitzboy54]

13 minutes ago, Marvlevydraftdaygenius said:

Dabol, is to blame because he has QB out there saving his fat ass as a coordinator.  There is a reason Dabol, for how long he has been a coordinator has never had a top offense.  He has Josh Allen, throwing to 5'8 wide receivers no size on deep balls and when he throws the deep ball in the game Josh gets destroyed for throwing to a full back well I guess Tom Ratham, should never be considered for the hall of fame he was a full back, Darrell Johnson, should not be in the hall of fame he was full back.  Keep blaming Josh and not blame the real person Dabol.

This is dumb. Nothing is ever that black and white. There is no way you have the expertise to be correct here.  If you read this thread the evidence clearly shows that its way more complicated than that and Allen is the real question mark on this team

Edited January 7, 2020 by blitzboy54

[quinnearlysghost88]

Yes, I’m curious what the random Twitter man from Montreal has to say about football. 

[oldmanfan]

Who is he and what is his expertise when it comes to assessing QB play?

[K-9]

He lost me in the first tweet when he said the whole narrative is different if Houston hangs onto the pics. Really? Is that the only thing that changes the narrative? It is when your predetermined conclusion needs to be supported. As intellectually dishonest as it gets. 

[GunnerBill]

22 minutes ago, JoshAllenHasBigHands said:

 

There is no way to look at every play, in isolation, and not have some criticism.  But that is true of every OC.  Whether its McDaniels (who is booe'd by fans at Gillette) or Reid (or was boo'd in Philly for running too many screens), all OCs will make bad calls through a game.  But, on the whole, when their offense executes, they are superb. The same will be true of Dabol. The proof is in the pudding--the films reveals that absent the execution errors, this game ends in a blow out. 

 

For me, its 90% on Allen and 10% on talent.  I just think Allen is not seeing the whole field yet. He has improved dramatically, but he has a ways to go.  If he takes that next step (similar to last season's jump), he, and this offense on a whole, will be elite.  I am crazy excited for the future.   

 

I disagree on 90% Allen and 10% the rest of the talent. I think it is about 40% Allen still growing, 40% the talent around him being sub standard and 10% scheme / playcalling. 

[blitzboy54]

7 minutes ago, oldmanfan said:

Who is he and what is his expertise when it comes to assessing QB play?

 

 

Twitter guy doesn't matter.  He broke down the film. you can watch the clips yourself and see the miscues. What we do know is nobody on this board NOBODY knows how the play was called, what was supposed to happen,  was there an audible, how much influence the HC has in game. You don't, I don't,  nobody does. But message board people claiming with conviction that Daboll is the "problem" are talking out of their collective asses. He might be but you don't know that.

That aside everyone can clearly see a few things about Allen. He has improved a ton, he is still not good enough. We all hope (don't know) that he takes the next step. If he plays next year exactly like this one I suspect we are looking for a new QB in 2021.  Again we all hope he takes the next step

Edited January 7, 2020 by blitzboy54

[JoshAllenHasBigHands]

1 minute ago, GunnerBill said:

 

I disagree on 90% Allen and 10% the rest of the talent. I think it is about 40% Allen still growing, 40% the talent around him being sub standard and 10% scheme / playcalling. 

 

FOOL!!! 

 

I'm kidding. Yeah, I get it.  I'm just not sure.  I don't believe in the #1 receiver as being an important component to an offense, and I think we need a 2nd to 3rd RB more than anything for the offense to succeed.  So, as you can see, I see things a little different.  But I get where you are coming from. 

[oldmanfan]

4 minutes ago, blitzboy54 said:

 

 

Twitter guy doesn't matter.  He broke down the film. you can watch the clips yourself and see the miscues. What we do know is nobody on this board NOBODY knows how the play was called, what was supposed to happen,  was there an audible, how much influence the HC has in game. You don't, I don't,  nobody does. But message board people claiming with conviction that Daboll is the "problem" are talking out of their collective asses. He might be but you don't know that.

That aside everyone can clearly see a few things about Allen. He has improved a ton, he is still not good enough. We all hope (don't know) that he takes the next step. If he plays next year exactly like this one I suspect we are looking for a new QB in 2021.  Again we all hope he takes the next step

what do you mean the twitter guy doesn't matter?  Anybody can post stuff on twitter and it's supposed to be believable?

 

We all know Allen still has a lot of room to grow.  What do tweets from some guy we don't recognize and who apparently ignored all the good plays Allen made add to anything?

[ngbills]

It is a combination of Daboll and Allen. But if Allen improves it would help out Daboll a ton. During the game I get frustrated with Daboll. I watch the film afterward and get frustrated with Allen. Its not just the bad throws but the many left on the field or the inaccurate passes that turn a TD into a 5-10 yd gain. 

 

Daboll - Gets too cute. Some of the plays seem overly complex and take too long to develop. Many plays lack options - bunch everyone and have only one real option. Lacks balance - 100 passes in a row after running with success etc. 

 

Allen - Still makes dumb decisions. Accuracy issues lead to lack of TD's and many missed plays. Takes bad sacks. Know when to run, throw away and get down. Speed up decision making process. Did I say accuracy...

 

I still have faith this tandem can work. Next year is huge for both. If the Bills are still a bottom feeder offensively then both could be running out of time. 

[blitzboy54]

1 minute ago, oldmanfan said:

what do you mean the twitter guy doesn't matter?  Anybody can post stuff on twitter and it's supposed to be believable?

 

We all know Allen still has a lot of room to grow.  What do tweets from some guy we don't recognize and who apparently ignored all the good plays Allen made add to anything?

 

He didn't post video of the tooth fairy. That was actual NFL footage from the actual game. What is there not to "believe".  We all know his "good plays" but we scored 19 points (average like 17 a game) in a world where everyone else scores 24. It's not complicated.  This guy doesn't owe you balance, his opinion doesn't matter but he took the time to break down his bad plays. They are part of the story. Who cares if some random twitter guy "likes" Allen.  

 

 

 

5 minutes ago, ngbills said:

It is a combination of Daboll and Allen. But if Allen improves it would help out Daboll a ton. During the game I get frustrated with Daboll. I watch the film afterward and get frustrated with Allen. Its not just the bad throws but the many left on the field or the inaccurate passes that turn a TD into a 5-10 yd gain. 

 

Daboll - Gets too cute. Some of the plays seem overly complex and take too long to develop. Many plays lack options - bunch everyone and have only one real option. Lacks balance - 100 passes in a row after running with success etc. 

 

Allen - Still makes dumb decisions. Accuracy issues lead to lack of TD's and many missed plays. Takes bad sacks. Know when to run, throw away and get down. Speed up decision making process. Did I say accuracy...

 

I still have faith this tandem can work. Next year is huge for both. If the Bills are still a bottom feeder offensively then both could be running out of time. 

 

This feels 100% right.  All of it

[Boatdrinks]

1 hour ago, Coach Tuesday said:

There's that McKenzie play I've been ranting about - would've taken it to the house, most likely, but Josh throws it into the dirt.  Frustrating.

I get that it’s a missed opportunity, but tap the brakes on McKenzie a bit. That guy gets caught by the turf monster more than any other Bill, I think. He’s fallen down on his own countless times this season, so it may have been just a nice gainer once he bit the dust. 

20 minutes ago, oldmanfan said:

Who is he and what is his expertise when it comes to assessing QB play?

He’s another guy that doesn’t care for Josh Allen. Ergo- expert. 

3 minutes ago, blitzboy54 said:

 

He didn't post video of the tooth fairy. That was actual NFL footage from the actual game. What is there not to "believe".  We all know his "good plays" but we scored 19 points (average like 17 a game) in a world where everyone else scores 24. It's not complicated.  This guy doesn't owe you balance, his opinion doesn't matter but he took the time to break down his bad plays. They are part of the story. Who cares if some random twitter guy "likes" Allen.  

 

 

 

 

This feels 100% right.  All of it

Only one team scored more than the Bills this WC weekend. That was the Houston Texans. No one scored 24, so who the heck is “ everyone else ? “. I’d bet that all the QBs still playing and the ones that lost to them left plays out on the field. 

[racketmaster]

Bills fans should be happy to have Josh Allen. He has all the tools to be special and the competitive spirit to keep getting better. Allen has yet to be surrounded by a dynamic talent on offense. The best skill player he has had so far is probably Devon Singletary and he was a rookie. Josh has been our playmaker since he was inserted into the staring lineup and I would expect that he will get some more help next year.
 

I have absolutely no doubt he is a franchise qb and we can win a Super Bowl with him and be in contention year after year. He might be the most scrutinized qb I can remember. Allen can make 2-3 plays that maybe only 1 or 2 qbs in the league could make and his play is met with mostly surprise. Then he makes a mistake as all qbs do and it seems like so many are all too eager to be the first to say he is a project. We have WRs dropping passes or having no sideline awareness that compound things and very little is said. But as soon as Josh makes the mistake its like putting honey out near a hornets nest. I’m convinced that some people won’t admit Josh is a franchise qb until he has won a championship and even then it might be done begrudgingly.