To All the People Saying They Went Into a Shell up 16-0...You're Missing the Strategy

[Teddy KGB]

Hopefully Daboll runs away from his problems like Lebron 

[The Firebaugh Kid]

Step. On. The. Throat. 

Kill their hope.

Game over. 

[Boatdrinks]

50 minutes ago, HardyBoy said:

 

For sure on the 3rd and 18, but we need to wait for the All-22 before we can say too much there...could have been a blown coverage or a great play call against the defense that opened the middle if the field up. The issue is he wasn't contacted 5 yards sooner, not that they were in a shell.

Yep. The call was fine. 3 Bills failed to swarm and wrap up. The defense was to force the underneath throw short of the sticks. 

[Process]

The bills got out coached by bill obrien 

 

Let that sink in

[Hapless Bills Fan]

1 hour ago, HardyBoy said:

The only goal there is to get up by three scores, period, end of story. They were in perfect position to do that before the Watt sack and Allen got rattled after that, which happens and impacted everything that came after it...and they still almost won. Put away the pitchforks.

 

That was the biggest game of Josh Allen's life he'll learn from this. Shoot it took Lebron James getting posted up by JJ Barea and the Mavs to learn the lessons that allowed him to mentally excel in that level of stress and expectation.

 

I don’t think the goal is to get up by 3 scores unless they are TDs.  McDermott has said over and over they want 21 points

 

I think you might be missing that we understand the strategy, we just disagree

[Fixxxer]

1 hour ago, eSJayDee said:

It seems our strategy is to try & win games 17-13.  I was saying in the 3rd quarter we need over 20 pts to win.

Our TD on the 1st drive was largely a result of 2 plats where we had the Dee fooled.  After that drive?  Only FGs.  You're not going to win too many games against good competition in today's NFL scoring less than 20 points.

 

I agree, but the chances were there, Duke dropped a TD pass and John Brown culdn't drag his feet inside their five yard line (or was their 10 yard line)

 

We could use another playmaker on offense and a complement to Singletary.

 

 

Edited January 5, 2020 by Fixxxer

[Best Williams Available]

53 minutes ago, HardyBoy said:

 

They were in prevent from what I could tell, and it worked perfectly until he was able to run for a first...he caught the ball in the middle of the field 10 yards or so from a first down with the entire defense ready to swarm and tackle him short by 5 yards...they were too far away though...why is the question, I'm thinking that was on players and not coaches...again, the ball went to the exact spot you would want in that situation to force a 4th down.

I agree. That play and the Watson double sack was lack of execution not some poor D philosophy; players not tackling or knowing where the first down was. The blitz by Neal was dialed perfectly but executed terribly. 

[DuckyBoys]

29 minutes ago, transplantbillsfan said:

I told @GunnerBill this earlier in the week:

 

I don't think any of us are missing McDermott's strategy, we just think it's a bad one in today's NFL.

 

Today's NFL is built around the offense. The rules themselves favor the offense. In-game playcalling should never change unless it absolutely has to because either it's not working (clearly not the case based on our 1st half) or you've fallen seriously behind (which we didn't).

 

On top of that, it's probably a bad idea to veer away from things that have worked for your offense recently, and with that I'm talking about the no-huddle we'd been using with Daboll talking into Allen's headset about coverage and what he saw as long as he could.

 

I fear that McDermott isn't ideal for the new NFL. He's good enough that he'll keep his job I think. But his coaching mentality and approach is always going to leave open the risk of good opposing QBs doing exactly what Watson did yesterday. 

 

And by the way, I call total BS that 3 scores is the benchmark for McDermott. I think 3 scores with a half to go would be almost acceptable as a benchmark. 

 

Almost.

 

However, McDermott wasn't playing for a 3 score lead. If he were, he wouldn't have run Gore up the middle on 1st down to end the 1st half with 30 seconds left on the Texans 23 up by 10. He would have allowed Allen to use those 30 seconds to get off 5 or 6 good plays to try to score a TD and THEN be up by 3 scores.

 

Instead, he coached like a weeny, wasted 2 downs, was almost bailed out by a great pass to the EZ that Duke couldn't come down with, we kick the FG and go into the half up by just 2 scores against one of the best QB/WR combos in the NFL.

 

Honestly the more I think about this game, the more it irritates me.

 

Allen made a bunch of mistakes and has a lot to work on this offseason. But the thing about Allen is he's not stubborn. He knows he made critical mistakes and you can expect he'll grind this offseason to fix them so he comes back better for 2020.

 

I feel like McDermott is too unaware and/or stubborn to realize that he has work to do with his gameday coaching and maybe needs to reevaluate his whole approach to the game.

 

I want a perennial winner year in and year out. McDermott's coaching doesn't set us up for that because he will always leave windows open for the other team to get back into it.

 

It was almost shameful the was after the game yesterday McDermott seemed to put the onus of the loss on Josh when he said something about Josh trying to do too much--which he did, but probably because McDermott's coaching approach forced him into it--rather than holding himself personally accountable.

 

Here's to hoping everyone gets better this offseason.

 

You nailed it on all points.  I worry more that McDermott cant change his mindset than I do about Allen improving.  He's so stubborn

[Fixxxer]

31 minutes ago, transplantbillsfan said:

I told @GunnerBill this earlier in the week:

 

I don't think any of us are missing McDermott's strategy, we just think it's a bad one in today's NFL.

 

Today's NFL is built around the offense. The rules themselves favor the offense. In-game playcalling should never change unless it absolutely has to because either it's not working (clearly not the case based on our 1st half) or you've fallen seriously behind (which we didn't).

 

On top of that, it's probably a bad idea to veer away from things that have worked for your offense recently, and with that I'm talking about the no-huddle we'd been using with Daboll talking into Allen's headset about coverage and what he saw as long as he could.

 

I fear that McDermott isn't ideal for the new NFL. He's good enough that he'll keep his job I think. But his coaching mentality and approach is always going to leave open the risk of good opposing QBs doing exactly what Watson did yesterday. 

 

And by the way, I call total BS that 3 scores is the benchmark for McDermott. I think 3 scores with a half to go would be almost acceptable as a benchmark. 

 

 

 

I get the sentiment of the post, it is obvious that rules make it diffcult on conservative coaches, but the play where we lost the game, was plenty aggresive and it should have worked, hats off to Watson that could escape what should have been a 10 loss yards on a sure sack.

[BuffaninATL]

49 minutes ago, Penfield45 said:

if you can't score more than 1 TD against the 28th ranked defense in the league you don't deserve to move on in the playoffs. STOP blaming the defense 

 

we would have been humiliated by KC or Baltimore in the next round. this offense isn't good enough for playoff football. 

 

sad but very true

[3rdand12]

8 minutes ago, Fixxxer said:

 

I get the sentiment of the post, it is obvious that rules make it diffcult on conservative coaches, but the play where we lost the game, was plenty aggresive and it should have worked, hats off to Watson that could escape what should have been a 10 loss yards on a sure sack.

agreed

 execution.

 

execution and Off turnovers are still stumbling blocks.

and in regards to McD and his ability to learn as a HC
 I think it is underrated . But heck yes , much work to be done.

 Losing sucks.
but we improved from last year, and the year before. and the year before that. and the decade before that

 

 

Just now, BuffaninATL said:

 

sad but very true

it is true.

 Lets see how they recover themselves next season.

 Thank gosh we are not going to need another rebuild

[Beast]

I get the strategy. Play to the strength of the team (defense).

 

It should have worked. It did pretty much all year. It didn't this time.

[yungmack]

If Beane is a for-real, cold-hearted GM who truly knows the game, and if McD is truly the problem, then he has to be at least thinking about making a change at HC. And if he's

not, then maybe McD isn't the problem.

[HardyBoy]

58 minutes ago, Teddy KGB said:

Hopefully Daboll runs away from his problems like Lebron 

 

Ugh...so he didn't run away, that happened in his first year with Miami...it was the first of crazy long streak of straight finals appearances where he won a bunch of championships, but choked away the first one...a lot of those years he completely carried the team and with the Cavs he beat arguably the best team in the history of the league in a best of 7 series to win a championship.

[JoshAllin]

I wouldnt have mind the shell up at 16-0 lead, if they fed the red hot singletary but making allen throw 46 times and a the hot rb for 13 carries is ridiculous when you have that lead, played too predictable with allen did not help at all

[Sweats]

Yep, they almost won.........almost.

 

 

[HardyBoy]

51 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

I don’t think the goal is to get up by 3 scores unless they are TDs.  McDermott has said over and over they want 21 points

 

I think you might be missing that we understand the strategy, we just disagree

 

Sure I understand the overall sentiment and the larger strategy and coaching philosophy debate, which I tend to agree that you need to go for as many points as quickly as possible while things are working, and letting your foot off the gas gives the other team a chance to get back in it.

 

I'm talking specifically being up 16-0 starting the second half, you play for a field goal first to get it to a three score game. If you have the ball 4th and inches on their 13 yard line in that situation you basically have to kick I think as painful as that would be.

 

Being up by 17+ points in the second half is absolutely huge and forces the other team to have to pass basically every down. 19 points where it would require 3 tds to lose is absolutely gigantically huge (assuming you can stop one of two 2pt conversions, which well...)

[BillsVet]

1 hour ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

I don’t think the goal is to get up by 3 scores unless they are TDs.  McDermott has said over and over they want 21 points

 

I think you might be missing that we understand the strategy, we just disagree

HBF - McD talks plenty about scoring points, but his actions say more about his coaching strategy.  He’s a conventional HC that has resisted where the game has gone offensively. McD is a dinosaur in a 45 year olds body. 

Edited January 5, 2020 by BillsVet

[Ethan in Cleveland]

1 hour ago, HardyBoy said:

 

Yup, huge play. Seriously, at 16-0 the strategy is to get it to 19-0 first. Bad strategy would be going for a td and taking a sack and getting out of fg range...now, I think on that Watt sack that sparked the comeback, they were trying an out and up double move with Duke, which is why Allen turned right into the sack, but need to A22 for that. In my opinion that should have been a draw or a quick hitter to get in better fg range, and I think they went for a td...which is why this they went all conservative narrative is a bit annoying, or at the very least premature.

Ford was beaten badly. Any route other than a slant or out on a 3 step drop and its a sack. Not Allen's fault. Line was terrible in the second half. Singletary missed a pass block terribly and led to a sack or incompletion.  Daboll never gave Ford help. It was fine to see if Watt could do anything one on one at first but once it was obvious he was going to he destructive force he needed to be doubled. Just like Hopkins should have been doubled all game. Stars win in the playoffs. Belichick takes away your best weapon.  All they had to do was take away a WR. And they win. 

They were outcoached. And win they were in a good spot the players choked - 3 blokckers on QB sweep missed their SS, and Milano/Neal miss a drive killing sack. 

[Ethan in Cleveland]

As for the OP's point. Yes I generally agree and posted during the game one more score and game over. Getting any points to get it to a three score game in the third quarter or early 4th and its a win. But you do that by being aggressive on defense and offense. You can play for a FG if you get behind in down and distance in the red-zone but until then you have to be aggressive.  Lining up in run heavy and then passing to Lee Smith is just dumb. If you want to run it sown their throats and kill clock then do it. No issue with that strategy.  Just stick with it and take it to them.