Mr. WEO Posted January 5, 2020 Posted January 5, 2020 1 minute ago, Real McNasty said: You should make this your avatar wow, what part of that did you need to edit? lol
Motorin' Posted January 5, 2020 Posted January 5, 2020 9 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said: What were the ratings at 16-0 in the 3rd? Better when the Texans were getting the ball back then what they would have been after onfe of the biggest bone headed touchdowns in playoff history.
TheBrownBear Posted January 5, 2020 Posted January 5, 2020 This is stupid. The guy clearly gave himself up. The refs made the right call and I certainly wouldn't have wanted to win the game in that fashion. 1 1
White Linen Posted January 5, 2020 Posted January 5, 2020 Yeah but Booger said it was the right thing to do. 1
pennstate10 Posted January 5, 2020 Posted January 5, 2020 As i said in the other thread. 100% chance that every NFL ST coach is showing this to his team, telling his returner to ALWAYS TAKE A EFFIN KNEE!!! Texans lucked out and avoided the TD, or safety. At the time, I said McD should've blown up, that Bellichek would have done so. Mistake by McD in my book. 2
Mr. WEO Posted January 5, 2020 Posted January 5, 2020 Just now, Motorin' said: Better when the Texans were getting the ball back then what they would have been after onfe of the biggest bone headed touchdowns in playoff history. right, of course. Milions were hovering their thumbs over their TV remotes around the globe pending the refs conference that followed that play! Think of all the NFL fans switching to that other that was on that rival network..
nedboy7 Posted January 5, 2020 Posted January 5, 2020 There were several other actual bad calls that influenced the game. That one however is a non issue.
familykwi Posted January 5, 2020 Posted January 5, 2020 1 minute ago, TheBrownBear said: This is stupid. The guy clearly gave himself up. The refs made the right call and I certainly wouldn't have wanted to win the game in that fashion. Congrats! You didn't win.
Mr. WEO Posted January 5, 2020 Posted January 5, 2020 Just now, pennstate10 said: As i said in the other thread. 100% chance that every NFL ST coach is showing this to his team, telling his returner to ALWAYS TAKE A EFFIN KNEE!!! Texans lucked out and avoided the TD, or safety. At the time, I said McD should've blown up, that Bellichek would have done so. Mistake by McD in my book. He must not have disagreed with the call.
MILFHUNTER#518 Posted January 5, 2020 Posted January 5, 2020 (edited) I thought all scoring plays were reviewed no?? Edited January 5, 2020 by MILFHUNTER#518
pennstate10 Posted January 5, 2020 Posted January 5, 2020 1 minute ago, TheBrownBear said: This is stupid. The guy clearly gave himself up. The refs made the right call and I certainly wouldn't have wanted to win the game in that fashion. Yikes! Glad you're not on my team! Say the Texans muff a punt. Should the Bills hand him the ball and say, I know you didnt mean to drop this? 1 2 1
BuffaloMatt Posted January 5, 2020 Posted January 5, 2020 A player giving himself up is a relatively new concept. I believed he did give himself up by handing the ball to the ref. Go Bills!
nedboy7 Posted January 5, 2020 Posted January 5, 2020 Just now, pennstate10 said: Yikes! Glad you're not on my team! Say the Texans muff a punt. Should the Bills hand him the ball and say, I know you didnt mean to drop this? how are those two things even in the same ballpark . 1
Boatdrinks Posted January 5, 2020 Posted January 5, 2020 4 minutes ago, TheBrownBear said: This is stupid. The guy clearly gave himself up. The refs made the right call and I certainly wouldn't have wanted to win the game in that fashion. I’ll take a playoff win aided by the opponents lack of knowledge of the rulebook every time, thank you. No shame in that and no reason for mercy.
bmur66 Posted January 5, 2020 Posted January 5, 2020 So was the ref in the end zone trying to prove a point by going by the rules?
egd Posted January 5, 2020 Posted January 5, 2020 1 hour ago, Michael1962 said: I did not see this posted, if I missed it please delete. Another reason to be grumpy. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_bJ7s40eey8&feature=share&fbclid=IwAR3FGh-OuiC_1abYGuf5ze4VYtrXsgZ3rbdSrC22MLf_YNCJH_LobQSRV6w Next time, please put the time in so I don't have to waste my time watching the whole video.
Boatdrinks Posted January 5, 2020 Posted January 5, 2020 1 minute ago, BuffaloMatt said: A player giving himself up is a relatively new concept. I believed he did give himself up by handing the ball to the ref. Go Bills! It’s not new at all.
egd Posted January 5, 2020 Posted January 5, 2020 57 minutes ago, Dafan said: Actually if you think about it, it should have been a safety. He tossed the ball forward which makes it an illegal pass in the endzone. Penalty in the endzone results in a safety. This is what I thought the refs were talking about...not overturning the whole TD. Nope. The Bills would have just declined the penalty and taken the TD instead.
zoid8jr Posted January 5, 2020 Posted January 5, 2020 12 minutes ago, familykwi said: As an official (local high school, not NFL), I've been bothered about what was actually ruled on the end zone play. I've been going through the 2019 NFL rulebook to sort out what should have been ruled. If a fair catch signal was given, the kick would have ended in a touchback, but no signal shows on film and the referee action makes it clear none was given. Now the rule book: Rule 6, Section 1, Article 5a: It is a touchback, if a free kick: touches the ground in the end zone before being touched by the receiving team. * This did not occur as the ball was caught in flight. It is a touchback, if a free kick: is downed in the end zone by the receiving team. * This required further research to determine what constitutes downing the ball. Unfortunately, the word "downed" is not defined in the rule book. I then went to a player giving himself up. Rule 7, Section 2, Article 1d: An official shall declare the ball dead and the down ended: when a runner declares himself down by: falling to the ground, or kneeling, and clearly making no immediate effort to advance. sliding. When a runner slides, the ball is dead the instant he touches the ground with anything other than his hands or his feet. Neither of these things happen either. The burden of knowing this rule is on the player and this is where the problem occurs. At this point, the referee is correct in letting the play continue. Rule 7, Section 2, Article 1 An official shall declare the ball dead and the down ended: when a forward pass (legal or illegal) is incomplete. THIS is what the kick returner did and this is what should have been ruled as the action of the play. As such, no touchdown should have been awarded. What should have been the outcome of the incomplete pass you ask? Since the forward pass was not thrown to an eligible receiver Rule 11, Section 5, Article 1(exception 2b) If a player of the team which intercepts, catches, or recovers the ball commits a live-ball foul in the end zone, it is a safety. A SAFETY WOULD HAVE BEEN THE CORRECT RULING. My observation is that no one on the crew considered the toss forward a forward pass. That wasn't the player's intention obviously, but there are a lot of actions the players don't intend to do, but rulings must be made. The referee was initially ruling this correctly by not awarding the fair catch, but confused the issue by ruling a touchdown. For those wondering who the black shirts were, it was noted during the broadcast that they were the backup officials. If an official goes down and needs to leave the field, they come in. I cannot say for sure they've never been consulted to assist with an on field ruling before, but I've never seen it as an official, or as a fan. Ruling that the player gave himself up may have been "common sense," but is not supported by the rule book. FTR, I submit this for clarity, not as a belief that the Bills were conspired against. it was a weird play and I hadn't considered the forward pass element myself until seeing someone mention it on twitter after the game. I beg responders to consider this informational, nothing more. This is really good stuff. I appreciate it. I guess we move onto passively watching football. So much less exciting.
JMF2006 Posted January 5, 2020 Posted January 5, 2020 7 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said: The point is, the refs were never determining his "intent"--they didn't have to because everyone knew the guy was not going to take that ball out of the EZ....everyone who was waghcing knew that. The issue is whether they can equate that with "giving himself up" in tha same manner as kneeling. They decided he gave himself up They(Refs) decided what they wanted to in their panicked moment and there is nothing the Bills can do about it. Corrente had it right IMHO 1
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