GoBills808 Posted January 2, 2020 Posted January 2, 2020 Just now, Chaos said: Stipulate that for arguments stake. Why does that mean this new stat is better? Most importantly, it takes into account a bunch of different metrics that are attributable to the QB (some more directly than others, but all imo in the QB's purview) that passer rating doesn't. It's a much more refined view of the position. Secondly, passer rating is just a bad formula for quantifying QB play, especially in today's NFL.
BuffaloHokie13 Posted January 2, 2020 Author Posted January 2, 2020 7 minutes ago, Chaos said: Stipulate that for arguments stake. Why does that mean this new stat is better? I haven't, and wouldn't, say it's better than passer rating. Stats are stats, and they all have their purpose. Mine was created as a way to put numbers to the metrics I look for in a way that, if sorted, generally matched up with the order someone might come up with using the eye test. In that regard, if you sort by passer rating instead, then: Ryan Tannehill was the best QB this year. Kirk Cousins was better than Russell Wilson and Pat Mahomes. Case Keenum and Gardner Minshew were better than Tom Brady. 1
GunnerBill Posted January 2, 2020 Posted January 2, 2020 15 minutes ago, GoBills808 said: Fits what I see when I watch the Niners play as well. He is imo overrated by a lot of folks due to how scary good Shanahan's system is working and having hands down the most dynamic TE in the game...YAC monster. JG at this point is kind of similar to Goff w/McVay during their SB run; coach is pulling the strings, QB is doing his part but it's primarily the offense making him look good and not necessarily vice versa. Largely agree with this. Both the Rams and 49ers are what I would call "scheme led offenses" rather than "talent led offenses". Doesn't mean they don't have some decent talent and I think both Goff and Jimmy G are good Quarterbacks. But neither to me looks at this stage like a top rank Quarterback. What we saw with the Rams this season was a total scheme regression for a number of reasons - teams worked them out a bit, their line collapsed and Gurley is finished which resulted in a spluttering run game. That resulted in Goff being less effective and less efficient and having to try and throw into more tight windows. The interesting thing to watch with the 9ers will be whether Shanahan can adjust better than McVay did. I suspect he will be able to because the Shanahans are the real architects of that scheme. All McVay was doing was running it with a bit of eye candy to fool defenses.
DCOrange Posted January 2, 2020 Posted January 2, 2020 1 hour ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: I'm really curious about how low Jimmy G. is in your ranking. Since you know the ins and outs, any idea on why? As you know, I like the fact that you factor in running yards and total turnovers. I have not watched the Bucs this year ..... at all. There are INTs that are fluky, like the bounce off Beasley's thigh or an odd ricochet. Are the majority of Winston's in that category? Because otherwise, it's not so cinchy to eliminate INTs, without cutting back on passing yards. It requires a change in field vision, which might just not be the easiest thing for a 5 year vet. He threw 30 of them, so naturally, a lot of flukes and a lot of bad throws and a lot of throws that should have been INTs that were dropped. It was honestly pretty crazy watching him this year. He's also been a bit of a gunslinger but the pros always outweighed the cons. That is highly questionable this season. Still though, the Bucs have pretty much been a good to great offensive team ever since they got Jameis despite the fact that he's generally had horrible O-Line and RB play. Oddly enough, this season was probably the best that he's had from those two units.
GoBills808 Posted January 2, 2020 Posted January 2, 2020 1 minute ago, GunnerBill said: Largely agree with this. Both the Rams and 49ers are what I would call "scheme led offenses" rather than "talent led offenses". Doesn't mean they don't have some decent talent and I think both Goff and Jimmy G are good Quarterbacks. But neither to me looks at this stage like a top rank Quarterback. What we saw with the Rams this season was a total scheme regression for a number of reasons - teams worked them out a bit, their line collapsed and Gurley is finished which resulted in a spluttering run game. That resulted in Goff being less effective and less efficient and having to try and throw into more tight windows. The interesting thing to watch with the 9ers will be whether Shanahan can adjust better than McVay did. I suspect he will be able to because the Shanahans are the real architects of that scheme. All McVay was doing was running it with a bit of eye candy to fool defenses. Yeh exactly- I see Shanahan having staying power w/that scheme because he understands offense on a better level imo. McVay got away w/misdirection and a real talent for designing effective timing routes helped a lot by the threat of Gurley at pretty much any moment. That's only going to be effective for so long tho...those windows get peeked through and buttoned up once enough tape is out. Shanahan's offense is really great to watch because he understands the micro- and macro levels of balance matchups and leverage...his feel for how a defense will respond to particular motion or formation and how to counter that is really second to none imo. From play design to game flow management the Niners are a very solid unit, I actually compare how they operate to our McDermott/Frazier defense this year. No standouts outside White and Kittle but a comprehensive understanding of strengths and an innate ability to put the right players in positions of success. 1
C.Biscuit97 Posted January 2, 2020 Posted January 2, 2020 34 minutes ago, GunnerBill said: The majority of Winston's picks are bad decision making. He tries to fit balls where they don't go. Think Fitz on speed. https://mobile.twitter.com/PFTCommenter/status/1211370706501603333 1
Big Turk Posted January 2, 2020 Posted January 2, 2020 1 hour ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: I'm really curious about how low Jimmy G. is in your ranking. Since you know the ins and outs, any idea on why? As you know, I like the fact that you factor in running yards and total turnovers. I have not watched the Bucs this year ..... at all. There are INTs that are fluky, like the bounce off Beasley's thigh or an odd ricochet. Are the majority of Winston's in that category? Because otherwise, it's not so cinchy to eliminate INTs, without cutting back on passing yards. It requires a change in field vision, which might just not be the easiest thing for a 5 year vet. No. The majority are WTF are you doing?? Type INTs 35 minutes ago, GoBills808 said: Because passer rating is a bad stat Throwing 30 INTs in a season where many are in single digits is a bad stat too.
GunnerBill Posted January 2, 2020 Posted January 2, 2020 15 minutes ago, C.Biscuit97 said: https://mobile.twitter.com/PFTCommenter/status/1211370706501603333 He is legitimately my favourite QB ever. Not the one I think is the best but my favourite. Every snap is an adventure start to finish. 2
C.Biscuit97 Posted January 2, 2020 Posted January 2, 2020 1 minute ago, GunnerBill said: He is legitimately my favourite QB ever. Not the one I think is the best but my favourite. Every snap is an adventure start to finish. He’s so hilarious and exciting. Must be terrible rooting for him but as a non fan, he’s great entertainment. I think some people think we are holding Allen back but I can see him making some of these Jameis throws, good and bad. It’s so hard because you don’t want to take away their aggressiveness but Jameis puts them in some terrible spots.
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