Dablitzkrieg Posted December 10, 2019 Posted December 10, 2019 14 hours ago, Poleshifter said: Again, Knox is a rookie so we need to cut him some slack. He was primarily a blocker at Ole Miss, and he really seems to kick butt as a blocker. Yes, the drops are annoying, but when he catches it, he has shown some beast mode after the catch. Belichek wanted Knox during the draft, so that tells me a lot about Knox's abilities. He actually is a very poor blocker! 1 hour ago, Mrbojanglezs said: Don't forget Croom, he's not going anywhere next year because he's banging the owners daughter. Really dude? Grow the ***** up
Bills Survivor Posted December 10, 2019 Posted December 10, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, jrober38 said: Rookie tight ends rarely produce anything. Knox is right behind TJ Hockenson statistically, and he was the 8th overall pick. Knox is going to be amazing in a year or two. It's been interesting seeing your recent positivity regarding our roster jrober. As someone I recognized as a fellow skeptic of our previous mediocre regimes, its good to see you feel the same about where we stand now and can be positive regarding our outlook moving forward. Beane and McD are building us a team that is not near its peak yet. Our last two drafts are looking pretty damn good, can't wait to see where we land if Beane keeps up his wizardry the next few years. Edited December 10, 2019 by Bills Survivor
jrober38 Posted December 10, 2019 Posted December 10, 2019 (edited) 13 minutes ago, Bills Survivor said: It's been interesting seeing your recent positivity regarding our roster jrober. As someone I recognized as a fellow skeptic of our previous mediocre regimes, its good to see you feel the same about where we stand now and can be positive regarding our outlook moving forward. Beane and McD are building us a team that is not near its peak yet. Our last two drafts are looking pretty damn good, can't wait to see where we land if Beane keeps up his wizardry the next few years. Our defense is amazing. We have depth at every position. If we can lock up key guys like Jordan Phillips and Shaq Lawson and add a few more pieces for next year, they should remain elite. On offense, I think the offensive line is very good, Singletary is going to be incredible next year, and our receivers are solid with Brown and Beasley under contract next year. I'd bring back Robert Foster, and I think we need to add multiple receivers to this team in the offseason (I'd use two draft picks on WRs). I also think Knox is going to be a borderline top 10-12 TE next year. He's been incredible value. If Allen can figure out his deep ball (one of the things I'm still skeptical of) and we can keep the coaching staff intact, the Bills should be an elite NFL team next year. Edited December 10, 2019 by jrober38
Over 29 years of fanhood Posted December 10, 2019 Posted December 10, 2019 15 hours ago, Rob's House said: Is catching ability something that typically improves significantly with time? It seems like it could, but I'm struggling to think of an example of someone with consistently bad hands who turned it around. Roddy White comes to mind. 3 hours ago, stuvian said: sorry but I'm ready to call Knox a bust. Bad hands are bad hands While he’s had bad drops, he’s also made some spectacular high skill catches. Im not sure what you do with that. Other than hope for that rook to softmore growth? And move on if it doesn’t happen.
jrober38 Posted December 10, 2019 Posted December 10, 2019 1 hour ago, hemma said: Knox has been targeted 45 times, caught 26, dropped 9. 20% drop rate is absurd and his catching ability does not seem to be improving. I'd move Sweeney up. Catching the ball is a fundamental part of the position, otherwise, Knox is a 2nd Lee Smith. A blocker. IMO. None of Kroft, Smith or Sweeney can get open. They're not worth having on the field as receivers because they're never open. Knox just needs to keep his eye on the ball. His issue is turning to run before the football arrives. That seems like something that can be corrected in the offseason with extensive practice.
947 Posted December 10, 2019 Posted December 10, 2019 If we're talking about drafting a TE because we need one with speed, let's remember that Knox ran a 4.57. 40-times of guys mentoned in this thread: Kittle- 4.52 Fant- 4.51 OJ Howard- 4.51 Hooper- 4.72 Knox is already a better blocker than every one of these guys, and is pretty darn close in speed. Kittle's rookie stats were 43rec, 515yds, 2 TD. Knox isn't too far off from that. Now it remains to be seen if Knox's drops are rookie-itis, or if we have another Zay situation on our hands. But if he can shake the drops, he's absolutely our TE of the future. 1
KW95 - JA17 Posted December 10, 2019 Posted December 10, 2019 I was pissed that Knox dropped the easy first down and very pissed on the whiffed block for fumble. However, if you noticed during the game, all rookies/2nd year players made crucial mistakes. Singletary easy drop, Allen overthrowing, Ford missed block on 3rd and 1, Tre White reading the playbook ( hahah ) Its odd how Knox catches the tough ones and drops the easy ones. I think next year the game slows down for him. Everytime he drops the easy ones, it seems like hes expecting a hit. Once he gets comfortable in those areas and gets used to hits, he will be fine. Game winning play yesterday was that receiver for Ravens who got totally crushed but still held on to the ball. That was huge.
JerseyBills Posted December 10, 2019 Posted December 10, 2019 16 hours ago, Nick the Greek said: Knox need to make catches. He single handedly killed a couple drives yesterday. Those could have been game changers. He also made a game changing play with a defender draped all over him. We got 8 points that drive. Those drops were bad and potentially cost us points but he's a rookie. His future looks extremely bright and a guy that could be a franchise TE if he keeps improving
ngbills Posted December 10, 2019 Author Posted December 10, 2019 1 hour ago, jrober38 said: Rookie tight ends rarely produce anything. Knox is right behind TJ Hockenson statistically, and he was the 8th overall pick. Knox is going to be amazing in a year or two. I think in the old days rookie TE's dont produce and took a few years. I think this is changing as the position has become a more highly skilled one and more integral part of offenses. The Bills are missing the boat if they do not think the position has value especially with Allen as QB. Look how many of the top TE's in rec yards were drafted the last few years. 1 Travis Kelce KC TE 75 989 13.2 76.1 47 4 12 3 51 68.0 1 2 Darren Waller OAK TE 72 880 12.2 67.7 48 3 10 1 41 56.9 1 3 Zach Ertz PHI TE 79 827 10.5 63.6 30 5 11 0 44 55.7 1 4 George Kittle SF TE 60 754 12.6 68.5 61T 4 12 2 36 60.0 0 5 Mark Andrews BAL TE 54 707 13.1 54.4 51 7 13 1 37 68.5 2 6 Austin Hooper ATL TE 58 640 11.0 64.0 35 6 6 0 34 58.6 0 7 Greg Olsen CAR TE 48 552 11.5 46.0 41 2 5 1 33 68.8 0 8 Hunter Henry LAC TE 43 536 12.5 59.6 30T 4 7 0 30 69.8 0 9 Jared Cook NO TE 34 523 15.4 47.5 40 6 11 1 25 73.5 0 10 Noah Fant DEN TE 35 492 14.1 37.8 75T 3 9 2 21 60.0 1 11 Evan Engram NYG TE 44 467 10.6 58.4 75T 3 4 1 23 52.3 0 12 Jason Witten DAL TE 53 455 8.6 35.0 33 3 2 0 24 45.3 1 13 Tyler Higbee LA TE 40 435 10.9 36.2 33 2 8 0 20 50.0 0 14 Gerald Everett LA TE 37 408 11.0 37.1 33 2 6 0 22 59.5 0 15 Mike Gesicki MIA TE 37 407 11.0 31.3 34 2 5 0 17 45.9 1 16 Jack Doyle IND TE 38 404 10.6 31.1 23 4 4 0 26 68.4 1 17 Dallas Goedert PHI TE 40 396 9.9 33.0 28T 4 5 0 22 55.0 2 18 Jimmy Graham GB TE 32 382 11.9 29.4 48 3 6 1 19 59.4 0 19 Eric Ebron IND TE 31 375 12.1 34.1 48T 3 4 1 20 64.5 0 20 T.J. Hockenson DET TE 32 367 11.5 30.6 39 2 6 0 19 59.4 0 20 O.J. Howard TB TE 27 367 13.6 33.4 33 1 7 0 18 66.7 1
Matt_In_NH Posted December 10, 2019 Posted December 10, 2019 We need to address OT and WR over TE, that is my opinion. Sure another talent at TE would also be great but at this point we have to assume Knox will improve and he has been decent but inconsistent, that can change. 3
JerseyBills Posted December 10, 2019 Posted December 10, 2019 32 minutes ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said: Roddy White comes to mind. While he’s had bad drops, he’s also made some spectacular high skill catches. Im not sure what you do with that. Other than hope for that rook to softmore growth? And move on if it doesn’t happen. You also have to remember he caught under 50 passes in his college career! Mostly due to scheme. So this is his first season in years where he is getting multiple targets per game, at the next level . He's a star in the making I think. Very good blocker too. I think Beans did it again and snatched our future #1 RB and TE in the 3rd round of the same draft! 1
Bleeding Bills Blue Posted December 10, 2019 Posted December 10, 2019 1 minute ago, JerseyBills said: You also have to remember he caught under 50 passes in his college career! Mostly due to scheme. So this is his first season in years where he is getting multiple targets per game, at the next level . He's a star in the making I think. Very good blocker too. I think Beans did it again and snatched our future #1 RB and TE in the 3rd round of the same draft! I'm not against taking a TE if there's value there - but i do think we need to evaluate needs at RT, WR, and OLB/DE.
ctk232 Posted December 10, 2019 Posted December 10, 2019 16 hours ago, Process said: Kroft is useless and should be cut this off-season. That signing was a head scratcher from the beginning. Knoxs drops are a huge concern. Even if he ends up getting over it and becoming a good player for us, plenty of teams use two TEs. Bills should go all out for Hooper this off-season. Sign Hooper, sign a young RB, draft a WR in the first round. Offense set. Except for maybe the OL... Kroft I could take or leave but honestly feel he could still contribute if he could stay healthy. Knox's drops aren't great, but the kid has shown enough upside in the passing game and consistent blocking in his first year. There's no reason to make any definitive statements on him at the moment. I'd rather not spend money on Hooper and first focus on re-signing our own through the next couple years before making any splashes. One could argue OL/DE would be better in FA this year, but honestly would rather we re-sign known talent in our otherwise very young roster. Draft, develop, retain, repeat.
LABILLBACKER Posted December 10, 2019 Posted December 10, 2019 2 hours ago, hemma said: Knox has been targeted 45 times, caught 26, dropped 9. 20% drop rate is absurd and his catching ability does not seem to be improving. I'd move Sweeney up. Catching the ball is a fundamental part of the position, otherwise, Knox is a 2nd Lee Smith. A blocker. IMO. Not giving guys like Sweeney and Duke more opportunities after they've performed over guys like Laura Kroft and Dawson Creek is embarrassing to this staff. Knox, a 20% drop ratio sends you to the CFL. 1
N.Y. Orangeman Posted December 10, 2019 Posted December 10, 2019 1 hour ago, LABILLBACKER said: Not giving guys like Sweeney and Duke more opportunities after they've performed over guys like Laura Kroft and Dawson Creek is embarrassing to this staff. Knox, a 20% drop ratio sends you to the CFL. What has Duke done?
Kelly the Dog Posted December 10, 2019 Posted December 10, 2019 Just now, N.Y. Orangeman said: What has Duke done? He did score a game-winning TD in his first game. 1
Boatdrinks Posted December 10, 2019 Posted December 10, 2019 3 minutes ago, Kelly the Dog said: He did score a game-winning TD in his first game. Good point. Another question would be what has Foster done this year ? This offense is lacking playmakers, so if one thing isn’t working they need to try another to generate some scoring. 1
Kelly the Dog Posted December 10, 2019 Posted December 10, 2019 1 minute ago, Boatdrinks said: Good point. Another question would be what has Foster done this year ? This offense is lacking playmakers, so if one thing isn’t working they need to try another to generate some scoring. I would play and feature Foster more. And I would activate Duke instead of a ST guy like Perry or another and just play him 6-10 plays a game like in the red zone. 1
jrober38 Posted December 10, 2019 Posted December 10, 2019 3 hours ago, ngbills said: I think in the old days rookie TE's dont produce and took a few years. I think this is changing as the position has become a more highly skilled one and more integral part of offenses. The Bills are missing the boat if they do not think the position has value especially with Allen as QB. Look how many of the top TE's in rec yards were drafted the last few years. 1 Travis Kelce KC TE 75 989 13.2 76.1 47 4 12 3 51 68.0 1 2 Darren Waller OAK TE 72 880 12.2 67.7 48 3 10 1 41 56.9 1 3 Zach Ertz PHI TE 79 827 10.5 63.6 30 5 11 0 44 55.7 1 4 George Kittle SF TE 60 754 12.6 68.5 61T 4 12 2 36 60.0 0 5 Mark Andrews BAL TE 54 707 13.1 54.4 51 7 13 1 37 68.5 2 6 Austin Hooper ATL TE 58 640 11.0 64.0 35 6 6 0 34 58.6 0 7 Greg Olsen CAR TE 48 552 11.5 46.0 41 2 5 1 33 68.8 0 8 Hunter Henry LAC TE 43 536 12.5 59.6 30T 4 7 0 30 69.8 0 9 Jared Cook NO TE 34 523 15.4 47.5 40 6 11 1 25 73.5 0 10 Noah Fant DEN TE 35 492 14.1 37.8 75T 3 9 2 21 60.0 1 11 Evan Engram NYG TE 44 467 10.6 58.4 75T 3 4 1 23 52.3 0 12 Jason Witten DAL TE 53 455 8.6 35.0 33 3 2 0 24 45.3 1 13 Tyler Higbee LA TE 40 435 10.9 36.2 33 2 8 0 20 50.0 0 14 Gerald Everett LA TE 37 408 11.0 37.1 33 2 6 0 22 59.5 0 15 Mike Gesicki MIA TE 37 407 11.0 31.3 34 2 5 0 17 45.9 1 16 Jack Doyle IND TE 38 404 10.6 31.1 23 4 4 0 26 68.4 1 17 Dallas Goedert PHI TE 40 396 9.9 33.0 28T 4 5 0 22 55.0 2 18 Jimmy Graham GB TE 32 382 11.9 29.4 48 3 6 1 19 59.4 0 19 Eric Ebron IND TE 31 375 12.1 34.1 48T 3 4 1 20 64.5 0 20 T.J. Hockenson DET TE 32 367 11.5 30.6 39 2 6 0 19 59.4 0 20 O.J. Howard TB TE 27 367 13.6 33.4 33 1 7 0 18 66.7 1 How many were drafted last year? I'm saying that in a year or two, when Knox isn't a rookie, I think he'll be a really good player. People think we need to upgrade on Knox. Given how easily he's got open this year, I think that's nuts. 1
BuffaloBill963 Posted December 10, 2019 Posted December 10, 2019 19 hours ago, Rc2catch said: Why is Kroft so hated? How many balls did he drop? How many were thrown to him? Are we saying the one year he actually played and was involved in Cincinnati Dalton could find him open but in buffalo he’s covered every route? Could it not be Allen doesn’t look to throw his way? Like ever? Or that Daboll doesn’t want him open so it frees someone else up one on one? Can’t be any form of a weapon in the receiving game if there’s no targets. Is his blocking bad? The blocking part is serious on my end cause I honestly don’t pay attention to tight end blocks ever in a game. Just don’t get why there’s such a need to upgrade a position we’re not heavily using in the pass game. Knox will progress, we haven’t seen Sweeney in real games, how many balls are we throwing to tight ends next year we ain’t Baltimore here. Pretty silly and short sighted take. You ever consider maybe we might use the TE position more with better pass catching TEs?
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