Augie Posted December 11, 2019 Posted December 11, 2019 Just now, Guffalo said: We lost my Mother in Law last year, it may seem like an inconvenience to get those calls, but someday you will wish you could get just one more. Absolutely! My wife is on a new kick where she turns things around on people (mostly me until I learned to avoid the trap!). She will say “you don’t HAVE to take your mother to lunch (or grocery shopping, or to the doctor) today, you GET to take your mother to lunch today”. It’s the correct way to look at these things, for sure.
Warcodered Posted December 11, 2019 Posted December 11, 2019 13 hours ago, ExiledInIllinois said: Agree. The highlighted part I think is all he really means, a little humility... The importance of youth knocked down a peg. Don't bill little Sally and Johnny as the best thing since sliced bread... It goes to the heads of youth and causes problems later. This is what annoys me about this article it's basically clickbait in a newspaper you can infer the actual meaning by reading the whole thing but he also purposefully puts in a bunch of misleading crap to keep you interested. I mean the part about the most important thing in a classroom being the teacher is both right and wrong it just depends on the context. The whole purpose of a classroom is to teach the students so obviously they're the most important, but at the same time the most effective way to achieve the goal is through the teacher so in that way they're the most important. It's also fairly annoying that he just implies things are related/verified facts in his argument. I mean in what way is kids being the most important demand/cause the parents to not set boundaries and teach discipline? If the most important thing to someone was their dog they wouldn't just not stop their dog from eating chocolate when they drop it on the floor because their dog really wants it. They'd take it away from them because it could kill them and taking it away is what's best for them. 1
ExiledInIllinois Posted December 11, 2019 Posted December 11, 2019 40 minutes ago, Warcodered said: This is what annoys me about this article it's basically clickbait in a newspaper you can infer the actual meaning by reading the whole thing but he also purposefully puts in a bunch of misleading crap to keep you interested. I mean the part about the most important thing in a classroom being the teacher is both right and wrong it just depends on the context. The whole purpose of a classroom is to teach the students so obviously they're the most important, but at the same time the most effective way to achieve the goal is through the teacher so in that way they're the most important. It's also fairly annoying that he just implies things are related/verified facts in his argument. I mean in what way is kids being the most important demand/cause the parents to not set boundaries and teach discipline? If the most important thing to someone was their dog they wouldn't just not stop their dog from eating chocolate when they drop it on the floor because their dog really wants it. They'd take it away from them because it could kill them and taking it away is what's best for them. PETA People the most important thing in the world is the ethical treatment of animals. They want to knock on doors and release all the animals. Let me tell you this... Our cat Champ won't last two minutes out there. He's just a scared white cat in a black neighborhood. Now the other cat Chester. He'd hang in the hood swing for a few days before the coyotes got him. /smh... He's annoying like that. ?
Augie Posted December 11, 2019 Posted December 11, 2019 4 hours ago, Guffalo said: My thoughts are simple: Give them the tools they need to suceeed, the basics like food, shelter and education. Encourage higher learning and if they aspire to higher education, help them as best you can. But I would never let them get between my wife and I. That is #1, Mom and Dad are a unit, not individual components. 2 of our 3 kids have degrees, one uses her degree and is doing well, the other with the degree is free spirited and conemplating buying a house now. I could help him, but am currently on the sideline letting him learn about the real world. He is finding that his choices to be unconventional have consequences. The other is struggling and finding that dropping out of school (against our wishes) also has consequences. We help when they absolutely need it, but do not give regular financial support, but are always available for moral support or to go through "what ifs" when they run into problems. We were raised with similar rules, I am middle of 5, my wife is middle child of 15 (thats not a typo). Both sets of parent gave us as much encouragement and guidance as possible and offerred higher education (up to a certain point) to allow us to excel, but we were not given any financial assistance outside of help with college. I didn't see Disney till I was in my 30's and only recently started to take trips outside of the country now that the kids are grown up. Bottom line, we are doing what our parents did, and we have mixed results, being a parent is tough as hell, but sometimes the kid has to learn on his own. To the bold, and especially the underlined, know that it has been my experience that we, as parents, often take too much credit and too much blame for how our kids turn out. You can provide them with the same genes, the same household, the same values and parenting.....and get very different outcomes. You do all you can do, then cross your fingers, say a prayer and hope for the best. My wife went to a girls weekend with the old sorority gang. Her best friend from college started the weekend with “so, how’s everyone doing? Not the Facebook, Christmas card stuff. Real life! I’ll start, one kids in jail, another in rehab and the other is a cardiologist.” Go figure?
Halloween Land Posted December 12, 2019 Posted December 12, 2019 God is the most important thing in my life! 1
Cripple Creek Posted December 12, 2019 Posted December 12, 2019 18 hours ago, ExiledInIllinois said: Of course he does. I understand that What if he doesn't want to? Do you force him. He sends him to live with you. 1
ExiledInIllinois Posted December 12, 2019 Posted December 12, 2019 1 hour ago, Cripple Creek said: He sends him to live with you. We will show him what diversity is. Probably love it here (as I do)! We, as a country, really contain multitudes. On other hand, I need to ship my daughter to New York. Let the youth, that some of us so gleefully treat as the most important, get a good, very good idea of what's out there past their "internet" and own physical world. Sounds like many (not just children) need a "change of venue" to grasp what's really out there. 16 hours ago, Augie said: To the bold, and especially the underlined, know that it has been my experience that we, as parents, often take too much credit and too much blame for how our kids turn out. You can provide them with the same genes, the same household, the same values and parenting.....and get very different outcomes. You do all you can do, then cross your fingers, say a prayer and hope for the best. My wife went to a girls weekend with the old sorority gang. Her best friend from college started the weekend with “so, how’s everyone doing? Not the Facebook, Christmas card stuff. Real life! I’ll start, one kids in jail, another in rehab and the other is a cardiologist.” Go figure? Where do family resources ($$$) fit in? More the majority, people are simply making too little.
Augie Posted December 12, 2019 Posted December 12, 2019 11 minutes ago, ExiledInIllinois said: We will show him what diversity is. Probably love it here (as I do)! We, as a country, really contain multitudes. On other hand, I need to ship my daughter to New York. Let the youth, that some of us so gleefully treat as the most important, get a good, very good idea of what's out there past their "internet" and own physical world. Sounds like many (not just children) need a "change of venue" to grasp what's really out there. Where do family resources ($$$) fit in? More the majority, people are simply making too little. My point was, regardless of family resources, whether it be a little or a lot, you can have two or kids in a household with the exact same “family resources” and opportunities and get vastly different outcomes.
ExiledInIllinois Posted December 12, 2019 Posted December 12, 2019 1 minute ago, Augie said: My point was, regardless of family resources, whether it be a little or a lot, you can have two or kids in a household with the exact same “family resources” and opportunities and get vastly different outcomes. That's nice on paper, but I beg to differ. Something is different... In the equation. Not just the child.
Augie Posted December 12, 2019 Posted December 12, 2019 22 minutes ago, ExiledInIllinois said: That's nice on paper, but I beg to differ. Something is different... In the equation. Not just the child. That would be, largely, that life happened. One got picked on by a bully in kindergarten. The other had a very supportive first grade teacher who recognized them as gifted (or handicapped in some way) at an early age. One is tall, the other shorter. One was a talented athlete, while the other had a big nose and his ears stuck out. One makes friends easily, while the other is shy and dislikes the spotlight. All of these little things form a child to a large degree. I could go on forever, but at the same time, the family has the same resources, the same family values, the same parenting techniques and loves both children equally. LIFE experiences and the child’s emotional and physical makeup are not equal. 1
ExiledInIllinois Posted December 12, 2019 Posted December 12, 2019 (edited) 16 minutes ago, Augie said: That would be, largely, that life happened. One got picked on by a bully in kindergarten. The other had a very supportive first grade teacher who recognized them as gifted (or handicapped in some way) at an early age. One is tall, the other shorter. One was a talented athlete, while the other had a big nose and his ears stuck out. One makes friends easily, while the other is shy and dislikes the spotlight. All of these little things form a child to a large degree. I could go on forever, but at the same time, the family has the same resources, the same family values, the same parenting techniques and loves both children equally. LIFE experiences and the child’s emotional and physical makeup are not equal. That's never a constant. IMO. For the many out there. But I generally agree. Just not quick to claim those as hard constants. Even loving equally, sometimes may take a hit. Edited December 12, 2019 by ExiledInIllinois
Augie Posted December 12, 2019 Posted December 12, 2019 (edited) 18 minutes ago, ExiledInIllinois said: That's never a constant. IMO. For the many out there. But I generally agree. Just not quick to claim those as hard constants. Even loving equally, sometimes may take a hit. The resources are the resources at any moment in time. They may not be shared the same way. Maybe one kid gets all A’s on their report card, cuts the grass and takes out the trash after doing the dishes. The other kid gets C’s and is a lazy load on the couch. That does not merit equal allowances. The parenting technique may have been exactly the same, but only one kid stole a car with his delinquent buddies when he was 14. Or, maybe they put the first kid through college, then dad loses his job or is sick or disabled. There are too many variables for everything to be “equal”, even with the best of intentions. But that’s not necessarily because the parents “prefer” one child (though I know that’s the case sometimes). It’s mostly a reaction to what life throws at you and your state of affairs at that moment in time. It’s life....so it’s always complicated. . Edited December 12, 2019 by Augie 1
ExiledInIllinois Posted December 12, 2019 Posted December 12, 2019 3 minutes ago, Augie said: The resources are the resources at any moment in time. They may not be shared the same way. Maybe one kid gets all A’s on their report card, cuts the grass and takes out the trash after doing the dishes. The other kid gets C’s and is a lazy load on the couch. That does not merit equal allowances. The parenting technique may have been exactly the same, but only one kid stole a car with his delinquent buddies when he was 14. Or, maybe they put the first kid through college, then dad loses his job or is sick or disabled. There are too many variables for everything to be “equal”, even with the best of intentions. But that’s not necessarily because the parents “prefer” one child (though I know that’s the case sometimes). It’s mostly a reaction to what life throws at you and your state of mind at that moment in time. It’s life....so it’s always complicated. Only thing I have an issue. That's very subjective. I can tell you cases were the A student, worker is totally at a disadvantage... Struggling... Where the C student, lazy, playing video games is successful. Yet... Somethings come easy for some when they finally apply themselves. OR... Maybe, just maybe they were applying themselves all along. The decisions parents make, diverging roads they go down shouldn't be made at those junctures. The old adage: "Get good grades and work hard" is crashing and burning in the 21st Century. People are burning out.
Augie Posted December 12, 2019 Posted December 12, 2019 (edited) 5 hours ago, ExiledInIllinois said: Only thing I have an issue. That's very subjective. I can tell you cases were the A student, worker is totally at a disadvantage... Struggling... Where the C student, lazy, playing video games is successful. Yet... Somethings come easy for some when they finally apply themselves. OR... Maybe, just maybe they were applying themselves all along. The decisions parents make, diverging roads they go down shouldn't be made at those junctures. The old adage: "Get good grades and work hard" is crashing and burning in the 21st Century. People are burning out. Of course, the world is full of A students working for C students, but that’s getting pretty far afield from the original topic. We always did everything we could to reward hard work and doing the right thing. Every situation is different and in ours the “difficult” child needed for more investment in terms of time and resources. As a result, the “easy” child learned to be very independent and hard working. There is not a single thing I would have done differently, and that’s not something I say lightly. Life is complicated, and we all do the best we can as parents and as people. . Edited December 12, 2019 by Augie 1 1
Bill from NYC Posted December 12, 2019 Posted December 12, 2019 I grew up in a large neighborhood in Queens, NY. In the entire community, I only knew of 3 or 4 kids whose parents were divorced. Today, divorced parents are more common than married couples. This article seemed to reference "Donna Reed Show" or "Father Known Best (imaginary) families. In SOME cases, if parents showed more concern for their children and less self indulgence, perhaps the kids (if not the entire family) would be better off. In any case, I for one believe the old adage "you can only be as happy as your saddest child." At least it applies to me. 1
Needle Posted December 15, 2019 Posted December 15, 2019 It seems like everyone agrees on the best strategies to good parenting. It is all of the same thoughts in mildly different wording. Applying those tactics in a consistent manner while dealing with life's challenges is what it is all about. I have three young kids and they are on my mind from the moment I wake up until the moment I go to bed. It will be that way until they bury me somewhere. I applaud all of you who are doing the best you can because I know how hard it can be. In the end there are no guarantees and all of your sacrificing could mean nothing. That is why you never sleep the same as you did before becoming a parent! 1 1
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