Andre Roberts is a waste on the 46

[colin]

Our roster problems:

 

We need at least one more OT.  Ford needs to either make a huge step up, or move to og because we aren't likely to keep Spain.  If Ford does step up we need a new og, in which case I suppose we can keep Spain but I don't see how we will know that Ford improves until into next season.

 

We have a total of two WRs in the roster, Miami for example has three or four and their top two are better than ours.  Denver too.  We need a prototype.

 

We kinda need another pass rusher.  I'm 50/50 on this one, but a clowney or someone like that would super charge our d

 

We need another Corner.

 

We need another rb who can hurt a d.  Lots of guys drafted this year and prolly next will do this.

 

Last, and not least, the bottom 12 or so guys on our roster, and I think 7 or 8 of them are on O, are scrubs and we need to upgrade.  This will help special teams a ton, and honestly might be the biggest difference between us and Baltimore.  We won zero one on ones in special teams and our punter sucks too.  If we added yards to our seven returns or punted better we prolly win the game 

[ganesh]

11 hours ago, LABILLBACKER said:

Andre has been a surprising disappointment. He hasn't busted 1 good kickoff or punt return all season.  But our punt and kickoff block coverage might be the worst in the league. Farwell is actually worse than Crossman. 

which games have you been watching

[Bakin]

Roberts doesn’t make mistakes.
No muffs. 
That’s why he’s there. 

[JMF2006]

12 hours ago, TPS said:

Something I've been thinking about and today confirms it for me.  The Bill's return game isn't good enough to waste a spot dressing Roberts. 

I believe they'd be better off dressing Duke.  

 

 

How many times has he fumbled?

 

He gives us certainty back there and if he doesn't ever run it out of the EZ we will never hit a big play.

 

Keep on keeping on Andre I love what you do for the team.

[TPS]

The issue isn't about Roberts himself, it's the trade off on the decision for the 46.

 

Roberts is strictly a return man. In 11 games he has 2 catches for 13 yards. He is in the top 4 in kickoff return average; however, I'm not certain he has given the Bills a significantly different starting position than not returning the kick? 

 

One alternative is dressing Duke to provide a big sure-handed WR. He has 6 catches (on 7 targets) in 3 games and a game-winning TD. Yes, he doesn't have the speed or the separation, but his separation is his size, and his stats show he's more valuable on O than Roberts. 

 

So, In an ideal world, the Bills would have both on the 46, but they have to make a choice. Some of you may think it's a clear choice; I don't, which was the point of my post.  

Btw, This Is also the the reason there's a Duke thread going again. 

[CLTbills]

The Bills are fourth in the NFL in kickoff return average.

 

If I'm not mistaken, they were #1 going in to the Baltimore game. 

[Brian3488]

Bring back Marcus thigpen 

[Rochesterfan]

21 minutes ago, TPS said:

The issue isn't about Roberts himself, it's the trade off on the decision for the 46.

 

Roberts is strictly a return man. In 11 games he has 2 catches for 13 yards. He is in the top 4 in kickoff return average; however, I'm not certain he has given the Bills a significantly different starting position than not returning the kick? 

 

One alternative is dressing Duke to provide a big sure-handed WR. He has 6 catches (on 7 targets) in 3 games and a game-winning TD. Yes, he doesn't have the speed or the separation, but his separation is his size, and his stats show he's more valuable on O than Roberts. 

 

So, In an ideal world, the Bills would have both on the 46, but they have to make a choice. Some of you may think it's a clear choice; I don't, which was the point of my post.  

Btw, This Is also the the reason there's a Duke thread going again. 

 

There is no trade off.  Roberts is excellent on special teams and if you replace him with McKenzie - the issue is the fumbles go way up.  Ask Carolina about allowing Ray Ray to field punts.

 

The position Andre plays is typical of how most teams build.  You have a core special teams guys that handles kickoff and punts and does not turn the ball over - just like you have a dedicated kicker, punter, and snapper.  Any production he gives us on offense is a plus.

 

Is Duke a better WR - yep, but he can not do the things that Andre does - so that is not the replacement that would occur.  It would be sitting WR speed (McKenzie or Foster) for size. 
 

The Bills are also running more 11 personnel with 3 WRs - so I could see a trade off of a TE for a WR at some point, but to start a thread about Roberts being useless is just crazy.  
 

Plus if your big issue is not having Duke on the active roster - then post that in the Duke thread.  Don’t blame Roberts - that is still one of the top returners in the NFL - for keeping Duke on the bench.  It should be an easy and clear choice of Roberts over Duke - it is not even close.  There are many other positions to sit to activate Williams if they think he will be a difference maker.

[Hebert19]

This.  He cost us field position multiple times yesterday.  Duke must have banged someone's wife. 

[SmokinES3]

His numbers are among the best in the NFL. This is just a bitchfest about him not breaking one.

His instincts and judgement, knowing when to call for a FC and when to block etc. 

He doesn't fumble. 80% of those returns for 9-15 yards w 3 guys bearing down on him anyone else fair catches. He's been worth every penny in my opinion. I've been saying all season how nice it is to have an all-pro return guy.

[TPS]

46 minutes ago, Rochesterfan said:

 

There is no trade off.  Roberts is excellent on special teams and if you replace him with McKenzie - the issue is the fumbles go way up.  Ask Carolina about allowing Ray Ray to field punts.

 

The position Andre plays is typical of how most teams build.  You have a core special teams guys that handles kickoff and punts and does not turn the ball over - just like you have a dedicated kicker, punter, and snapper.  Any production he gives us on offense is a plus.

 

Is Duke a better WR - yep, but he can not do the things that Andre does - so that is not the replacement that would occur.  It would be sitting WR speed (McKenzie or Foster) for size. 
 

The Bills are also running more 11 personnel with 3 WRs - so I could see a trade off of a TE for a WR at some point, but to start a thread about Roberts being useless is just crazy.  
 

Plus if your big issue is not having Duke on the active roster - then post that in the Duke thread.  Don’t blame Roberts - that is still one of the top returners in the NFL - for keeping Duke on the bench.  It should be an easy and clear choice of Roberts over Duke - it is not even close.  There are many other positions to sit to activate Williams if they think he will be a difference maker.

I would agree with your take, for the most part.  If you read my post as blaming Roberts, then you've misinterpreted it.  His contribution has been on ST, not offense, and that is the trade-off I'm looking at--giving up something on ST to get more on O. However, where I'm in agreement is your point that it may be Foster where the real decision lies?  

9 minutes ago, SmokinES3 said:

His numbers are among the best in the NFL. This is just a bitchfest about him not breaking one.

His instincts and judgement, knowing when to call for a FC and when to block etc. 

He doesn't fumble. 80% of those returns for 9-15 yards w 3 guys bearing down on him anyone else fair catches. He's been worth every penny in my opinion. I've been saying all season how nice it is to have an all-pro return guy.

It's not a bitchfest. The issue is the Bills need a big-bodied WR, and if they want one on the 46, then they have a decision to make. 

I think  @Rochesterfan probably has the right take.

 

[Buffalo Boy]

15 hours ago, LABILLBACKER said:

Andre has been a surprising disappointment. He hasn't busted 1 good kickoff or punt return all season.  But our punt and kickoff block coverage might be the worst in the league. Farwell is actually worse than Crossman. 

   I asked this in another thread.

   WHY don’t we block the outside gunners when we are receiving a punt????

    The other teams outside guys are given a free release to the inside. It has to be by design because our guys don’t even try to engage them or bracket them to the outside.

     Every single punt Roberts is back there catching it with both outside coverage guys on him as he signals the fair catch.

WTF????

Anybody???? Thoughts????

15 hours ago, Freddie's Dead said:

Roberts can't do much when the Ravens gunners are running down the field freely, not even slowed down by the Bills.  He had no chance on the PR's.  

This is every game, all season long

[SmokinES3]

On 12/9/2019 at 8:34 AM, TPS said:

I would agree with your take, for the most part.  If you read my post as blaming Roberts, then you've misinterpreted it.  His contribution has been on ST, not offense, and that is the trade-off I'm looking at--giving up something on ST to get more on O. However, where I'm in agreement is your point that it may be Foster where the real decision lies?  

It's not a bitchfest. The issue is the Bills need a big-bodied WR, and if they want one on the 46, then they have a decision to make. 

I think  @Rochesterfan probably has the right take.

 

You won't get any pushback from me on the need for a 6'4" #1 receiver.

[Gugny]

https://www.footballdb.com/stats/stats.html?mode=KR

 

He's 5th in the league in kickoff return yards.

He's 3rd in the league in average yards/kickoff return.

 

Yep.  He sucks balls.

 

 

Edited December 12, 2019 by Gugny

[DaBillsFanSince1973]

2 minutes ago, Gugny said:

https://www.footballdb.com/stats/stats.html?mode=KR

 

He's 5th in the league in kickoff return yards.

He's 3rd in the league in average yards/kickoff return.

 

Yep.  He sucks balls.

I guess since he hasn't had a return for a touchdown he sucks?

 

Edited December 12, 2019 by DaBillsFanSince1973

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

On ‎12‎/‎8‎/‎2019 at 5:50 PM, Binghamton Beast said:

The Ravens have one of the best ST units in the league. Roberts has been a very good returner for us.

 

Not a waste of a spot....at all.

Kick & Punt Returns

• * Selected to Pro Bowl, + First-Team All-Pro

Kick & Punt Returns Table

					Games		Punt Returns					Kick Returns
Rk	Player	Tm	Age	Pos	G	GS	Ret	Yds	TD	Lng	Y/R	Rt	Yds	TD	Lng	Y/Rt	APYd
1	Deonte Harris	NOR	22		11	0	27	269	1	53	10.0	20	494	0	51	24.7	804
2	Richie James	SFO	24	wr	13	1	31	258	0	32	8.3	16	313	0	27	19.6	728
3	Andre Roberts	BUF	31		11	0	26	194	0	22	7.5	21	562	0	66	26.8	776
4	Kenjon Barner	ATL	29		11	0	26	225	1	78	8.7	10	276	0	47	27.6	547
5	Trevor Davis	2TM	26		11	4	16	112	0	32	7.0	19	411	0	52	21.6	707
6	Mecole Hardman	KAN	21	wr	13	4	11	138	0	36	12.5	22	510	0	34	23.2	1163

[Watkins90]

On 12/8/2019 at 4:45 PM, Warcodered said:

Didn't he have the 3rd most return yards going into this game? I mean he hasn't had a homerun yet but he's been consistently good.

See, people just think if he doesn't have punt and kick returns for a TD, then he is worthless. He is third in kick-off return average at 26 yards per return. He averages 7 yards per return and most importantly, hasn't turned the ball over, which was a big issue last year. We don't need him to break big returns every time. We just need him to catch teh ball and make good decisions so we aren't in terrible field position. 

[Codyny13]

This guy catches punts and kickoffs effortlessly. Usually with his hands like someone is flicking him the ball from 5 feet away. I have no worries about this guy fumbling the ball or not doing what he’s supposed to back there, and that goes entirely unnoticed by the majority of fans. Our blocking has not been good enough, but I think up until recently, and maybe still, we are leading the league in kickoff return average. He’s also one of the only guys in the league that has the green light to take the ball out of the end zone consistently because of his big play ability, that sometimes leads to getting tackled at the 20. 

[foreboding]

How many fumbles have we seen? Missed catches? See my point?

[Gugny]

16 minutes ago, Watkins90 said:

See, people just think if he doesn't have punt and kick returns for a TD, then he is worthless. He is third in kick-off return average at 26 yards per return. He averages 7 yards per return and most importantly, hasn't turned the ball over, which was a big issue last year. We don't need him to break big returns every time. We just need him to catch teh ball and make good decisions so we aren't in terrible field position. 

 

It's the same way many view the QB position.  A Bills QB is either Tom Brady in his prime, or he's Ryan Leaf.

 

Because Andre Roberts isn't Devin Hester, he has to be terrible in some people's eyes.