Comparing Lamar & Josh

[H2o]

2 minutes ago, Billsfan1972 said:

Yes I was, but I still maintain that Allen would be farther ahead with better coaching that did not play it so close to the chest.  The Bills have way too many difficult down & distance plays every game (i.e. 3rd & 6+, 2nd & 9).....

And you know what, this is the first time in over 20 years I don't worry about the down and distance with our QB. Why? Because of the fact he has shown time and time again that there is no down or distance that is insurmountable with him throwing from the pocket, throwing on the run, or his scrambling ability. 

[Buffalo Junction]

3 hours ago, SlimShady'sGhost said:

 

YAWN .. 

The Ravens team has one more win than Buffalo and lets not forget that NE game, which was very close, they took Josh out of a game with a hit to the head. 

A game when the Bills were down by 6 points and Josh was playing a much better 3rd QRT than the first half AND the Defense shut down the Pats for ZERO points in the 4th QTR.

 

Being a media darling doesn't mean anything 

Actually, being a media darling might mean that opponents don’t get away with or attempt the aforementioned hit to the head because it’ll be lambasted everywhere all week as a cheap shot. 

[H2o]

3 minutes ago, Buffalo Junction said:

Actually, being a media darling might mean that opponents don’t get away with or attempt the aforementioned hit to the head because it’ll be lambasted everywhere all week as a cheap shot. 

Where you had blithering idiots all over tv and in the media blaming Josh for the hit. That was the absolute DUMBEST  I had ever heard in my entire life. 

[Buffalo Junction]

10 minutes ago, H2o said:

Where you had blithering idiots all over tv and in the media blaming Josh for the hit. That was the absolute DUMBEST  I had ever heard in my entire life. 

Well, QBs are obviously not defenseless when they’re already wrapped up by a tackler.  

[Formerly Allan in MD]

Comparing them simply does a disservice to Allen.  Let it go and just win.

[Say When...]

the first rule about comparing Allen to Jackson is don't compare them...

 

the systems, tailored to their strengths, they are in appear to be successful for them.

 

Now, would Allen be successful In the Ravens O and vice versa?

 

how would things look with Harbaugh as Allens HC and vice versa?

 

i'll tell you one thing, i don't think the Ravens put up as much points with McD due to the fact they've been ahead early in a lot of their games and he goes ultra conservative.  now think Josh with Harbaugh's 'killer' attitude?

 

let's not forget here, the Ravens have been up early and big this year and that can dramatically skew stats, they put 643 yards on very demoralized Miami in game 1, 643!!!  McD would NEVER do that to an opponent;  last weeks game they didn't even break 300 yards total.

[Hatszel]

4 hours ago, SlimShady'sGhost said:

 

There it is.  The race card.    SMH.  Being a media darling has nothing to do with skin color. 

 

FWIW I'd take Deshaun Watson, Russel Wilson, Pat Mahomes easily before I'd think of Lamar. 

 

All of them were media darlings and 2 of them have a multiple seasons to back them up.

 

Faker Mayfield was a media darling.

Sam Darnold was a Media darling. 

 

All shiny new toys to gush over and then forgotten

 

I thought Lamar was better in College than Deshaun, I think Lamar will be the better QB than Deshaun in the pros as well.   If the draft I would have been content to stay where we were and draft Lamar.  Thought the pick at 7 was to take our LB Tremaine Edmunds.  All is good please with Josh but wonder what our other picks could have been .  I am not a fan of the trade up for picks as it still is all a crap shoot.

 

Edited December 5, 2019 by Hatszel

[starrymessenger]

6 minutes ago, Hatszel said:

I thought Lamar was better in College than Deshaun, I think Lamar will be the better QB than Deshaun in the pros as well.   If the draft I would have been content to stay where we were and draft Lamar.  Thought the pick at 7 was to take our LB Tremaine Edmunds.  All is good please with Josh but wonder what our other picks could have been .  I am not a fan of the trade up for picks as it still is all a crap shoot.

 

 

You trade up if you need to to nab a legit franchise QB prospect. Always. Ravens did it too.

[ngbills]

Beat NE 37-20 and the media pays more attention. Then follow that up by scoring 49, 41, 45. That is why he gets so much attention. If he was winning games like the Bills are it would be a different story. 

 

Nothing to see here. 

[LJs Bodyguard]

I keep hearing the same narrative that jackson is a one-read, then run QB...so seeing is believing. He leads the league in TD passes from empty set formations...

 

https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nfl/defenses-are-basically-powerless-to-stop-lamar-jackson-in-empty-formations/ar-BBXqWhK

 

Both QBs have bright futures and BOTH can play from inside the pocket, so even if they lose their abilities to run, they will still have successful careers.

[Rigotz]

Why are we comparing 2018 stats?

Lamar Jackson has 10 more TD's and 3 less INTs than Josh this year ... and a better record ... and better completion percentage ... and is a better runner.

 

The reason people have acted like he's better is because he's been better.

He's probably the league MVP right now.

[ngbills]

30 minutes ago, Rigotz said:

Why are we comparing 2018 stats?

Lamar Jackson has 10 more TD's and 3 less INTs than Josh this year ... and a better record ... and better completion percentage ... and is a better runner.

 

The reason people have acted like he's better is because he's been better.

He's probably the league MVP right now.

I think most people are talking without watching. Folks should go watch some games and then say it is only because of the system or he would not do well in our system etc. He actually is doing a lot of the same things as Josh. Difference is when he runs he is faster and makes you miss rather. Josh has good speed but not at this level and Josh does not have the same evasiveness. When throwing he has good arm strength to make the throws and has shown great touch. Josh has a stronger arm, but not quite as accurate and Josh needs more work on throwing touch passes. Lastly, both can improvise. Jackson can escape the pass rush and keep plays alive a bit better than Allen. 

[DrDawkinstein]

I havent gone through the whole thread yet, so apologies if this has been said...

 

But the way I see it, it's looking like the best 3 prospects from the 2018 QB class were: Darnold, Allen, and Jackson.

 

If you put those three on a "Type" Spectrum, you'd have Darnold on one far side as your blue-chip Passer, and Jackson on the other far side as your elite athlete.

 

And best yet, smack in the middle with a bit of column A and a bit of column B, would be Allen. Bridging both worlds together.

 

Pure Passer----------------------------------------------------------------------------Pure Athlete

-------Darnold----------------------------Allen-------------------------------------Jackson---------

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

7 minutes ago, DrDawkinstein said:

I havent gone through the whole thread yet, so apologies if this has been said...

 

But the way I see it, it's looking like the best 3 prospects from the 2018 QB class were: Darnold, Allen, and Jackson.

 

If you put those three on a "Type" Spectrum, you'd have Darnold on one far side as your blue-chip Passer, and Jackson on the other far side as your elite athlete.

 

And best yet, smack in the middle with a bit of column A and a bit of column B, would be Allen. Bridging both worlds together.

 

Pure Passer----------------------------------------------------------------------------Pure Athlete

-------Darnold----------------------------Allen-------------------------------------Jackson---------

 

As I see it ..

 

Josh is also a very good athlete.  Was it 3 straight games and damn near 300 yards rushing?  Yup Over three games last season Josh Allen is averaging 111.7 rushing yards per game!    https://buffalonews.com/2018/12/09/buffalo-bills-josh-allen-surpasses-lesean-mccoy-leading-rusher-broken-running-game/

 

PEOPLE ARE FORGETTING THAT!

 

This organization is, or was molding Josh to be a passer first then a runner.  

 

When McDermott Quote "sat them all down today and said, 'play fearless,'""  the team Turned up the Volume and Josh was being Josh again!!

 

Another tid bit  -  From week 7 to week 12 or 13 Josh was leading the league in TD's scored. 

[BuffaL0L0k0]

On 12/5/2019 at 6:37 AM, BehindTheWoodshed said:

 

It's not so much a race card issue as opposed to promoting diversity (some people will see them as the same thing however).  We all know the QB position has been the one position on the field that has been "resisting" diversity for decades now. Bottom line, if we still have guys like Polian saying players like Lamar Jackson should be a WR instead of a QB, the push for diversity at  the position will still be a "thing" in the media.  Players should just be players regardless of skin color, but we are all smart enough to know that society is simply not there yet.

 

Personally, I think Jackson is better right now.  Long term, no idea.

If goodól Polian said that, and even with the respect he earned while working at Orchard Park, he sounds foolish IMHO, who in his right mind woud rather have their superb athlete touching the ball 15-20 times, when you can have him touching it 50-60 times as your QB? ...

Edited December 6, 2019 by Cyber Bill ®

[Don Otreply]

Compare; 

being that The ravens coaching staff has more experience than the Bills, they had a clearer idea of where they were going at QB, so LJ is ahead of JA, but that gap is shrinking as time goes on, and the Bills are figuring out how to use the JA more effectively.

 

This upcoming game should be a knock down drag out affair, but I feel confident the Bills come out with the win. 

 

Go Bills!!!

[Rock'em Sock'em]

Running: 

Josh - "Yards after contact". Physical runner, faster than expected.

Lamar - "Yards without contact". Agile runner, extremely quick.

 

Passing:

Josh - Excels on medium routes against zone coverage.  Accuracy issues on deep throws earlier in the season.  Good pocket awareness. Fumble issues.

Lamar - Accurate passer. Often single read plays opened by the threat of the run. Improvisational skills outside the pocket.  MVP season.

 

Overall:

Two of the best and most exciting young quarterbacks in the game today.

 

[Alphadawg7]

On 12/5/2019 at 4:06 AM, Billsfan1972 said:

I have Allen 5-6 last year & 9-3 this year.....  Seems to be winning  or 60.9% 

Simple, no playoffs.  Lamar took a losing Ravens team and turned them into a playoff team last year.  Now he’s an MVP candidate and widely seen as leading the best team in football and potentially the #1 seed.  He just beat an elite defense and a 10-1 team that had been chewing up teams all year.  
 

There is a reason he is getting more attention.  He’s also been more explosive and had more wow games both running and throwing.

 

I still think Josh will be the better QB and have the better career, but Lamar has earned his praise fairly.  Josh will start getting his when we keep beating teams the media doesn’t think we will win. Or when he makes a deep playoff push.  Or when he starts dominating statistically.  Or all of the above.  

[Luka]

On 12/5/2019 at 7:05 AM, H2o said:

You can't really compare the two by statistics or style because they are completely different. Lamar is Randall Cunningham and Michael Vick rolled into one person. Athletically he just has no equal right now. Josh reminds me more of John Elway than anyone else. He has the rocket arm, the improvisation skills, and he has that clutch gene that just can't be taught or manufactured on it's own. One thing about both Josh and Lamar that is admirable in this day and age, the thing which makes me like them the most, both of them are humble. It's not about them, it's about the team as a whole. The only thing both of them are concerned with is winning. Whatever comes with that, successes and failures, they take it all in stride, continue to show the same humility, and work harder to get better. They will be forever linked as will Darnold, Mayfield, and Rosen with them because they were all of the 2018 class of QB's. Imo, the best two from the crop will be head to head on Sunday. 

 

Clutch gene, sure, Elway but athletically he is Steve Young.

[wppete]

Hey Lamar!!!!!!