H2o Posted November 21, 2019 Author Posted November 21, 2019 6 hours ago, Julio Hopkins said: Not sure you recognize how weak the Bills' schedule is. A combined 15-55 against the teams they've beaten, a third of those wins are from the 5-5 Titans. They have beaten the bottom of the barrel, maybe they prove more in future games though. And if we were a team full of "non-NFL caliber/JAG/decent players" as SoTier would like us all to believe then our record would not be 7-3 no matter whom we've played. It would probably be the exact opposite at this point. Then we'd all be talking who's getting fired, draft prospect, and 2020 FA.
BigDingus Posted November 21, 2019 Posted November 21, 2019 On 11/18/2019 at 7:58 AM, r00tabaga said: He has surpassed my expectations as well. Seems like a good kid too. Still glad we got Allen instead. Yeah, why have MVP level talent like Mahomes or Jackson when we can have mild success at the position & maybe in a few years, moderate success?! Sure glad we got at Allen instead too. 1
r00tabaga Posted November 21, 2019 Posted November 21, 2019 5 minutes ago, BigDingus said: Yeah, why have MVP level talent like Mahomes or Jackson when we can have mild success at the position & maybe in a few years, moderate success?! Sure glad we got at Allen instead too. Couldnt have chosen a more appropriate username. Well done! 2 1
H2o Posted November 21, 2019 Author Posted November 21, 2019 4 minutes ago, r00tabaga said: Couldnt have chosen a more appropriate username. Well done! There are a few around here if you haven't noticed and they all stick together. 1
Putin Posted November 21, 2019 Posted November 21, 2019 Would anyone here ( hypothetically) take Lamar or Watson ??
SoTier Posted November 21, 2019 Posted November 21, 2019 2 minutes ago, BigDingus said: Yeah, why have MVP level talent like Mahomes or Jackson when we can have mild success at the position & maybe in a few years, moderate success?! Sure glad we got at Allen instead too. Yeah ... teams with decent QBs have made the Super Bowl so many times in the last two decades that passing on 3 great talents in 2 successive drafts is no big deal. 2 minutes ago, Putin said: Would anyone here ( hypothetically) take Lamar or Watson ?? Of course not. Who needs a great QB when you can have mediocrity. After all, QBs who've been great early in their careers always taper off eventually but QBs that take two or three years to reach average are destined for greatness. //sarcasm off
Sundancer Posted November 21, 2019 Posted November 21, 2019 12 minutes ago, Putin said: Would anyone here ( hypothetically) take Lamar or Watson ?? Lamar long term worries me. Watson does not. 1
r00tabaga Posted November 21, 2019 Posted November 21, 2019 3 minutes ago, Sundancer said: Lamar long term worries me. Watson does not. Watson is better now and should prove to have a longer career as well. 1
Putin Posted November 21, 2019 Posted November 21, 2019 19 minutes ago, SoTier said: Yeah ... teams with decent QBs have made the Super Bowl so many times in the last two decades that passing on 3 great talents in 2 successive drafts is no big deal. Of course not. Who needs a great QB when you can have mediocrity. After all, QBs who've been great early in their careers always taper off eventually but QBs that take two or three years to reach average are destined for greatness. //sarcasm off What are even talking about ???? 5 minutes ago, r00tabaga said: Watson is better now and should prove to have a longer career as well. Watson ( IMO ) is a 100 times better passer then Lamar , 1
Hapless Bills Fan Posted November 21, 2019 Posted November 21, 2019 20 hours ago, DCOrange said: Their defense has become good since acquiring Peters. Before that, they were around 20th in the league while the Ravens offense has been #1 or #2 from the beginning of the year to now, and that is undoubtedly primarily because of Lamar's skills. The Bills' offense on the other hand has held the team back. It's a valid point that Peters definitely beefed up the Ravens pass D, which was shown as a weakness in the Browns and Chiefs game. But the Ravens D was above average all along. They were hurt by a 3 TO game on offense against the Browns with 2 leading directly to TD. Without those 2, giving up an average of 18.7 ppg before Peters. I really don't think you turn a meh D into an elite one by adding a CB, however talented he may be. A good D into a league leading one, sure. It's not to take anything from Lamar - he's legit too, and he's def. the sparkplug that's making that engine run, but primarily....the Baltimore O is nowhere near as capable without acquiring Ingram and drafting Marquise Brown to go with Andrews. They have a ton of talent and especially their depth at TE makes me salty. The Bills O has underperformed at times, but we also aren't where we are without the 4th Q comebacks, and some of the miscues that put us in bad spots were on ST, not O Yes, the Ravens O is better than their D, and yes the Bills D is better than their O, but neither is as one sided as some people see. 1
bills11 Posted November 22, 2019 Posted November 22, 2019 On 11/20/2019 at 10:23 AM, SoTier said: If wrapping yourself in up in the security blanket labeled "the league will figure Jackson out and he'll fail" makes you feel better, go for it, dudes. However, keep in mind that although NFL defenses long ago figured out how to stop both classic pocket QBs and mobile QBs, the best ones still regularly light up the league and win championships. DCs have known how to stop Tom Brady for 15 years or so, but they haven't been able to do it very frequently. If Jackson can continue to improve as a passer, there's no reason to think he can't continue to be successful although it's likely that his game may morph into a more traditional style much like Russell Wilson's game has and Patrick Mahomes' game seems to be trending that way, too. The athletic QBs that Jackson is frequently compared to -- Vick, Griffin, Kaepernick -- simply were never as good as passers as Jackson is now. Like Mahomes and Watson, he's made tremendous strides between last season and this season, and has gotten better as the season has progressed. That's completely disingenuous to say kaep and Vick were never as good as passers as Lamar Jackson ...Vick during his time with the eagles was one of the better passers in the league ...and kaep during his early 49ers years was a very good passer...and was making throws with far greater degree of difficulty then Lamar is making ...so cool it with the security blanket nonsense ... .
Hapless Bills Fan Posted November 22, 2019 Posted November 22, 2019 On 11/20/2019 at 11:15 AM, H2o said: They didn't inherit the 2016 team, they inherited the team after the 2016 season. Gilmore chose to leave the offseason they came in and I fully believe he was never going to re-sign here. Robert Woods bolted for LA, the place he wanted to be as well. Marquise Goodwin was the epitome of fragile while here, turning in one solid season, and SF gave him more money than we were willing to offer for sure. (....) Fact of the matter is many of the better players we had on the 2016 roster chose to leave on their own in FA in 2017 I'm just curious if we fail to resign some very good players like Tre' White, John Brown, etc will you say they "chose to leave on their own" or will you say we "failed to re-sign them"? I think the truth is usually somewhere in-between. We could have made Gilmore, Woods, and Goodwin FA offers they would have listened to....whether we could have handled a bidding war, if one developed, I don't know. The truth is, we under-valued them, especially the wide receivers, and didn't try, while over-valuing some WR who did not work out such as Zay Jones, Kelvin Benjamin, and Corey Coleman. 1
H2o Posted November 22, 2019 Author Posted November 22, 2019 31 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: I'm just curious if we fail to resign some very good players like Tre' White, John Brown, etc will you say they "chose to leave on their own" or will you say we "failed to re-sign them"? I think the truth is usually somewhere in-between. We could have made Gilmore, Woods, and Goodwin FA offers they would have listened to....whether we could have handled a bidding war, if one developed, I don't know. The truth is, we under-valued them, especially the wide receivers, and didn't try, while over-valuing some WR who did not work out such as Zay Jones, Kelvin Benjamin, and Corey Coleman. Whaley was still here then up until after the draft. They couldn't resign all of those guys for the money they got elsewhere. We still had Sammy and Marcel on the roster going into the 2017 season as well. If I'm not mistaken we only had like 12-14 mill left in cap at the beginning of that year. Sammy was moved after being showcased in the 3rd preseason game and Marcel later in the year. The next year we were right up against it cap wise. The money situation is completely different now and Beane has already shown that he takes care of our own. I'm not worried about us not re-signing our core players now because I trust they will manage things correctly.
SoTier Posted November 22, 2019 Posted November 22, 2019 10 hours ago, H2o said: Whaley was still here then up until after the draft. They couldn't resign all of those guys for the money they got elsewhere. We still had Sammy and Marcel on the roster going into the 2017 season as well. If I'm not mistaken we only had like 12-14 mill left in cap at the beginning of that year. Sammy was moved after being showcased in the 3rd preseason game and Marcel later in the year. The next year we were right up against it cap wise. The money situation is completely different now and Beane has already shown that he takes care of our own. I'm not worried about us not re-signing our core players now because I trust they will manage things correctly. These are the same old excuses that have been floated over the last two decades whenever the Bills have allowed their best players to leave in FA (Antoine Winfiled, Pat Williams, London Fletcher, Stephon Gilmore, Robert Woods) or have traded them away (Jason Peters, Marshawn Lynch, Sammy Watkins, Cordy Glenn) when they have absolutely nobody on the roster who was even close to being an adequate much less an equal or better replacement. A few of these players were replaced in the next draft with high draft picks but in several instances they were replaced by guys who should have never made a regular season NFL roster much less be starters. So far in the McDermott/Beane regime, I see too much emphasis on cutting current salary without regard to cap or talent implications and passing on opportunities to add very talented players, especially WRs, for a variety of reasons, which might be very valid. However, passing on grabbing Josh Gordon off waivers when the need for a third WR is so dire and the cost so relatively little, says that they aren't serious about putting enough good talent around Allen to give him the best chance to succeed. Gordon's checkered past didn't deter Pete Carroll who recognized that his Seahawks, even with MVP candidate Russell Wilson at QB, needed another WR to pair with Tyler Lockett.
H2o Posted November 22, 2019 Author Posted November 22, 2019 37 minutes ago, SoTier said: These are the same old excuses that have been floated over the last two decades whenever the Bills have allowed their best players to leave in FA (Antoine Winfiled, Pat Williams, London Fletcher, Stephon Gilmore, Robert Woods) or have traded them away (Jason Peters, Marshawn Lynch, Sammy Watkins, Cordy Glenn) when they have absolutely nobody on the roster who was even close to being an adequate much less an equal or better replacement. A few of these players were replaced in the next draft with high draft picks but in several instances they were replaced by guys who should have never made a regular season NFL roster much less be starters. So far in the McDermott/Beane regime, I see too much emphasis on cutting current salary without regard to cap or talent implications and passing on opportunities to add very talented players, especially WRs, for a variety of reasons, which might be very valid. However, passing on grabbing Josh Gordon off waivers when the need for a third WR is so dire and the cost so relatively little, says that they aren't serious about putting enough good talent around Allen to give him the best chance to succeed. Gordon's checkered past didn't deter Pete Carroll who recognized that his Seahawks, even with MVP candidate Russell Wilson at QB, needed another WR to pair with Tyler Lockett. And I love how you pick and choose what to chime in on when you feel you have an "answer", but can't come up with a rational defense of the rest of the things that you commonly ignore. Your claims are without foundation because you never go into detail about whom these other "non-NFL caliber/JAG/decent" players are. You just love to harp and argue for the sake of harping and arguing. Who cares they didn't put in a claim for Gordon? You don't know what discussions were had about it or the rationale behind it. You only throw it out there because you think it somehow justifies your stance. I went into full detail about your last post over the roster and it was laid out as plainly as could be. You can't hold Beane, McDermott, or even Pegula for that matter, accountable for things that were done long before any of them were here. The long term outlook in Buffalo right now is trending upward, whether you care to admit so or not, but it does seem like you're salty over it because it's not what GM SoTier would have done in his omnipotent hindsight.
Recommended Posts