Myles Garrett suspended indefinitely (minimum 2019 season), Pouncy 3 games, Ogunjobi 1 game

[dubs]

Last night went perfect for the bills. Steelers lose. Browns lose their best defensive player for the year. Steelers lose their starting center for a few game. 
 

Super Bowl!!!

[Nextmanup]

1 minute ago, SinceThe70s said:

 

If you can't beat 'em - beat 'em!

 

What's different here is that the Browns were playing at home, had the game in hand and hadn't beaten the Steelers in 5 years. Usually it's the team on the losing end that does the dumbest sh!t. Should have been a great night for the Browns.

 

 

This is true, but it wasn't that type of thing on Thursday night (i.e., sour grapes by the losing team sending a message at the end of the game).  It was just a chippy game throughout.  Kind of a throwback to earlier times, when rivalries among players were actually a thing!  

 

Way too much player movement now for that stuff to exist.

 

 

[Rob's House]

6 minutes ago, BarkleyForGOATBackupPT5P said:

For a permanent injury, sure. Regardless I'd bet the house nothing substantial will come to Myles Garrett other than a lengthy suspension. That's all I'm saying. There's a million examples of nothing happening from these brawls in sports for every Heller / Baker suit.

 

And I'd rate the Gronk hit on Tre White to be worse than this IMO. I was calling for something to happen there but should have figured nothing would happen.

 

I agree with you. I don't want him charged criminally. In fact, I'd probably be defending Garrett if he were facing the repercussions the law would impose upon him in most states if he had connected cleanly in a real world setting. But it could happen if the proper parties felt so inclined.

 

The point is that being in the midst of a contact sport doesn't prevent one from being charged if the act of violence is not within the course and scope of the sport itself. Also, you can consent to a battery but not to malicious wounding* (this didn't rise to that level, but could have).

 

* Laws vary by state and I don't know exactly what the equivalent of Mal wounding is  in OH.

[Nextmanup]

Just now, dubs said:

Last night went perfect for the bills. Steelers lose. Browns lose their best defensive player for the year. Steelers lose their starting center for a few game. 
 

Super Bowl!!!

Add it to the list of other favorable stuff that has made this an unusual year. 

 

Luck's retirement, Big Ben's season ending injury, New England's offensive slump, etc.

 

 

 

 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

?

 

Someone in the Shoutbox suggested it should come with a matching set of cleats signed by the Pittsburgh OL

[Rocket94]

1 hour ago, 19Bills83 said:

Garret went Norman Bates. Mason is no choir boy either instigating this fight. 

It was an alarming  expression of violence on Garret's part. A little excessive for the situation. Kind of scary...perhaps it warrants a psychological evaluation.

Edited November 16, 2019 by Rocket94

[Rbleyle]

1 hour ago, BarkleyForGOATBackupPT5P said:

There's assault every play in football. It's a violent sport where players are doing things to each other they'd never do off the field. It should and will stay on the gridiron.

Heard of Todd Bertuzzi? 

[SinceThe70s]

17 minutes ago, Nextmanup said:

This is true, but it wasn't that type of thing on Thursday night (i.e., sour grapes by the losing team sending a message at the end of the game).  It was just a chippy game throughout.  Kind of a throwback to earlier times, when rivalries among players were actually a thing!  

 

 

 

That's exactly my point. In earlier times, in a chippy game when the home team had the game well in hand they'd take the foot off the gas and let the losing team do the stupid sh!t and only respond to it if necessary. 

 

[blacklabel]

I'm sure Rudolph will end up with a fine, but the decision to suspend Garrett indefinitely is the right one. 

 

Every discussion I've seen about this today has a lot of debate about who started it. IMO, Garrett has no reason to drag the guy down. Ball is gone a split second before Garrett wraps him up and then he keeps pushing to take him down. He has a reputation for hitting QBs late. Leads the league in roughing the passer penalties since he entered the league in '17. He wanted one more shot before the game ended. Dipsh*t train of thought, no foresight. Your team is gonna win their second straight game, they could've rode that momentum but instead they have to deal with this. Words were exchanged when they were on the ground and I think that's what sent Rudolph over the edge. He's played like hot garbage throwing four picks and now this dude wants to drag him down when be absolutely didn't need to. DeCastro steps in and seems to be doing well at separating them until Rudolph decides he still wants a piece. That's where he's gonna get fined. Then Garrett completely loses his marbles and swings the helmet. DeCastro flops on him and Pouncey thinks he's in Mortal Kombat. 

 

Myles Garrett could go on to break Bruce Smith's sack record and the first thing people will remember when his name is mentioned will be, "Wait, he's the lunatic who hit a guy in the head with a helmet, right?" Dirty player.

 

And 65 for Cleveland (I know his name but I don't respect him enough to go and check to make sure I spell it right, cause he's a ten pound turd in a five pound bag) is absolutely what Rudolph called him, a b*tch. Dude isn't even involved, comes up and shoves Rudolph in the back. That's 100% a b*tch move on the field or off. Real tough guy display right there, lemme hit you when you're not looking.

 

Browns and Kitchens are a joke. Browns behave like jackwagons and their attitudes suck, you know what they say, attitude reflects leadership. My cat who routinely yells at me and leads me to his already full bowl has better leadership skills than Kitchens. 

[K-9]

52 minutes ago, Nextmanup said:

Yeah right.  Plenty of folks here call for injury to Tom Brady routinely.

 

I remember one thread where the poster literally called for not just an injury to Brady, but a career ending and life threatening injury!

 

Made me laugh out loud!

 

 

Yeah, right. Anyone who does that is a clueless moron. 

[Bing Bong]

3 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

?

 

Someone in the Shoutbox suggested it should come with a matching set of cleats signed by the Pittsburgh OL

I like how the Browns DL collectively allowed Myles Garrett get his teeth kicked in by Pouncey and co. as if he deserved it

[Buffalo Barbarian]

Wonder how he would have gotten suspended if he hit him with the crown of the helmet and knocked him out??

 

 

[Doc Brown]

Why was Garrett (the best defensive player on your team) in the game up 14 with seconds remaining?  Comeon Kitchens.  

[row_33]

29 minutes ago, Buffalo Barbarian said:

Wonder how he would have gotten suspended if he hit him with the crown of the helmet and knocked him out??

 

 

or he rolled on the ground pretending he was hurt

 

 

[folz]

12 hours ago, transplantbillsfan said:

 

The Gronk play was despicable, too.  And he should have been suspended.

 

But that was also a football player hitting another football player.  Yes, it was after the play was over.  And yes, Gronk is a behemoth.  But it was man on man.

 

Garrett had Rudolph's helmet in his hand and swung it.  If Garrett dropped the helmet and punched Rudolph in the face with his fist, Garrett would and should still be suspended, but probably not indefinitely.

 

Swinging a helmet at another player's head is a huge deal.

 

I'm amazed ANYONE could defend Garrett after that.

 

Don't forget that Gronk was wearing a brace made of metal on his elbow that day and that was what he used to drill into Tre's back/neck/head area. It wasn't just his bear forearm. He basically used the brace as a weapon. Luckily Tre still had his helmet on. But what if Gronk connected with Tre's neck directly, under the helmet, with that brace rather than his helmet or shoulder pads? With all of his weight (Gronk is a big dude)? He could have broken Tre's neck. 

 

The helmet swing looks and is much more shocking and Garrett deserves everything he gets for it, but the Gronk play to me was just as reckless in regards to another player's health, was just as dangerous, and also used an object as a weapon. So I'd say the plays are pretty similar, despite the Garrett play looking and feeling much worse.

 

And Rudolph was very lucky that he got hit with the underside of the helmet which had some padding on it. If Garrett had connected with the back (hard shell) of the helmet, who knows what could have happened to Rudolph.

 

As to the great debate regarding Rudolph's culpability, it was probably smart of the NFL to hold off on any possible punishment for him for the moment until they could investigate and get a better idea of the initial stages of the skirmish. I think you have to throw out the "he kicked him in the nuts" stuff. To me it is clearly Rudolph just using his leg to keep Garrett away from him, not purposefully kicking him in the groin. If you've ever been in a fight with a brother, or cousin, or friend (serious or just play fighting) and they get the upper position and you are on the ground, you stick out your leg so they can't get close enough to hurt you or pin you down. That is such a normal, instinctive reaction. And if Garrett didn't already have a grasp of Mason's helmet when the QB's leg went up, he was definitely at least reaching toward him to do so. So the so-called "kick" is a nonfactor for me. The question then becomes was Rudolph trying to rip Garrett's helmet off. At first glance it seemed obvious to me that he was. But after watching the video a bunch of times, with the hand stuck in the facemask narrative in mind, some of Rudolph's body language could be seen as that being a possibility. So, it is probably good for the NFL to get to the bottom of that before handing out fines and suspensions. If they find, no he was just mad and trying to rip off Garrett's helmet, then you go to the rulebook. Is ripping (or attempting to rip) another player's helmet off a suspendable offense? Just a penalty? An ejection with no future suspension? A fine? And then you dole out the punishment according to the rules. If his hand wasn't stuck and he was just trying to rip off Garrett's helmet, then he deserves some punishment, but it wasn't anything beyond what happens in a lot of NFL skirmishes. So, punishable by normal standards. But what Garrett did was so far beyond a scuffle, or throwing a punch, etc. that he deserves the most severe penalty they can hand out.

 

In regards to the initial tackle, I wouldn't call it a cheap shot by any means, but there is no question that he could have pulled up and not dragged Rudolph to the ground. The ball was gone before he dragged him down. He didn't body slam him or anything, it wasn't egregious, but the way Rudolph fell, he did pretty much land face first into the turf on a play that Garrett could have and probably should have held up on. It was a borderline penalty, but nothing more. Yet, I can still understand Rudolph being upset by it because it was totally unnecessary.

[Doc Brown]

4 hours ago, blacklabel said:

I'm sure Rudolph will end up with a fine, but the decision to suspend Garrett indefinitely is the right one. 

 

Every discussion I've seen about this today has a lot of debate about who started it. IMO, Garrett has no reason to drag the guy down. Ball is gone a split second before Garrett wraps him up and then he keeps pushing to take him down. He has a reputation for hitting QBs late. Leads the league in roughing the passer penalties since he entered the league in '17. He wanted one more shot before the game ended. Dipsh*t train of thought, no foresight. Your team is gonna win their second straight game, they could've rode that momentum but instead they have to deal with this. Words were exchanged when they were on the ground and I think that's what sent Rudolph over the edge. He's played like hot garbage throwing four picks and now this dude wants to drag him down when be absolutely didn't need to. DeCastro steps in and seems to be doing well at separating them until Rudolph decides he still wants a piece. That's where he's gonna get fined. Then Garrett completely loses his marbles and swings the helmet. DeCastro flops on him and Pouncey thinks he's in Mortal Kombat. 

 

Myles Garrett could go on to break Bruce Smith's sack record and the first thing people will remember when his name is mentioned will be, "Wait, he's the lunatic who hit a guy in the head with a helmet, right?" Dirty player.

 

And 65 for Cleveland (I know his name but I don't respect him enough to go and check to make sure I spell it right, cause he's a ten pound turd in a five pound bag) is absolutely what Rudolph called him, a b*tch. Dude isn't even involved, comes up and shoves Rudolph in the back. That's 100% a b*tch move on the field or off. Real tough guy display right there, lemme hit you when you're not looking.

 

Browns and Kitchens are a joke. Browns behave like jackwagons and their attitudes suck, you know what they say, attitude reflects leadership. My cat who routinely yells at me and leads me to his already full bowl has better leadership skills than Kitchens. 

I wonder the lasting mark that Gregg Williams left on that defense the two years he was there.  The Browns did take out Juju an Conner last night.  Just a thought.

[atlbillsfan1975]

League got this one right. 
indefinitely was the right way to go. Puts it to rest for the 2019 season and allows the league to check the feel of owners, and teams in offseason. 
personally Garrett getting an entire year seems right. He would be eligible to come back in week 10 of 2020.  

[CorkScrewHill]

Nice video from 2018 where UFC Chuck Liddell teaches the Browns how to fight .. did not see the session on how to use the opponents helmet as a cudgel.

 

 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

5 hours ago, blacklabel said:

I'm sure Rudolph will end up with a fine, but the decision to suspend Garrett indefinitely is the right one.

 

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000001077016/article/mason-rudolph-will-be-fined-for-role-in-tnf-brawl

 

Fine said to be coming.  Deserved IMO.

[Boca BIlls]

17 hours ago, MAJBobby said:

 

So he didnt violate ANY Rules? lol

Nope, penalty at the most but the game is over.

Edited November 16, 2019 by Boca BIlls