Tolstoy Posted November 13, 2019 Posted November 13, 2019 (edited) My apologies if this is in another thread somewhere, but it occurred to me that Daboll may have a mandate to develop Josh Allen as a QB at virtually all costs, even if it means possibly risking wins this season. The reasoning would be that we are very unlikely to win without more talent and experience anyhow, and we will need a top flight QB to win in future years. We are better off developing an elite QB, instead of squeaking out every victory we can, only to never win the big prize because we lack the QB we need. This would explain why we opened the season with 18 straight passes, as if Daboll was intentionally trying to get Allen into a rhythm regardless of what might be more likely to succeed. It explains why the Bills are so reluctant to become a running team, even though it seems like running the ball more might lead to more wins. It even explains why Allen has played more conservatively of late--because not playing hero-ball and becoming more turnover free is essential to a top flight QB. I expect that now that he has (arguably) gone too far towards playing conservatively, they will try to nudge him back towards playing more aggressively. In short, I am suggesting that Beane, McDermott and Daboll are all on the same page here--a long game strategy of developing an elite NFL QB . The wins and losses this season are secondary. Part of me has doubts about this perspective, because so many careers depend upon winning and losing right now--both players and coaches. It is hard for me to believe that they are not doing whatever they can to win right now. But when I see what they are doing with Allen and the running game etc., I can't help but think I am right. Edited November 14, 2019 by Tolstoy 2 2
elijah Posted November 13, 2019 Posted November 13, 2019 The theories not too far off, however the wording and title is going to get you eaten alive by some of the members on the board
BringBackOrton Posted November 13, 2019 Posted November 13, 2019 If that’s the case, they are doing it exactly right. 2
Dablitzkrieg Posted November 13, 2019 Posted November 13, 2019 8 minutes ago, Tolstoy said: My apologies if this is in another thread somewhere, but it occurred to me that Daboll may have a mandate to develop Josh Allen as a QB at virtually all costs, even if it means possibly risking wins this season. The reasoning would be that we are very unlikely to win without more talent and experience anyhow, and we will need a top flight QB to win in future years. We are better off developing an elite QB, instead of squeaking out every victory we can, only to never with the big prize because we lack the QB we need. This would explain why we opened the season with 18 straight passes, as if Daboll was intentionally trying to get Allen into a rhythm regardless of what might be more likely to succeed. It explains why the Bills are so reluctant to become a running team, even though it seems like running the ball more might lead to more wins. It even explains why Allen has played more conservatively of late--because not playing hero-ball and becoming more turnover free is essential to a top flight QB. I expect that now that he has (arguably) gone too far towards playing conservatively, they will try to nudge him back towards playing more aggressively. In short, I am suggesting that Beane, McDermott and Daboll are all on the same page here--a long game strategy of developing an elite NFL QB . The wins and losses this season are secondary. Part of me has doubts about this perspective, because so many careers depend upon winning and losing right now--both players and coaches. It is hard for me to believe that they are not doing whatever they can to win right now. But when I see what they are doing with Allen and the running game etc., I can't help but think I am right. Absolutely not what is happening 3 2
sven233 Posted November 13, 2019 Posted November 13, 2019 (edited) It's a passing league. You pass to score points. I have no problem with them passing the ball a lot and trying to win that way. It's time for the Buffalo Bills to step out of the dark ages and try and compete in a league that is passing them by......literally. Now, does that mean they are using all these throws correctly? NO!!!! Most every pass is being designed for WRs to hook up, square in or square out to the sidelines, and come back to the ball. They are hardly running enough plays that are designed to get run after the catch which is how a lot of offenses put up big passing numbers. Now, I don't know if this is because they have determined Allen can't throw slants, crossers, etc. effectively enough on a regular basis or if this is just the general scheme of our offense in general. But whatever. We have a long way to go on offense whichever way you want to put it. But, I have absolutely no problem with trying to light up the scoreboard throwing the ball all over the place. We've had 20 years of ground and pound and it has gotten us nothing. But, with the offense the way it is designed, and the lack of overall talent on the offensive side of the ball outside a few guys, I'm not sure our version of this passing offense will work. But, I have no problems with them trying to build an offense around the passing game in general. Edited November 13, 2019 by sven233 1
Chaos Posted November 13, 2019 Posted November 13, 2019 Another equally likely theory is that Daboll is just not very good as an OC. Again, only a theory. 1 3
Bangarang Posted November 13, 2019 Posted November 13, 2019 You should call WGR and float this theory by Schopp 7
Tolstoy Posted November 14, 2019 Author Posted November 14, 2019 34 minutes ago, sven233 said: It's a passing league. You pass to score points. I have no problem with them passing the ball a lot and trying to win that way. It's time for the Buffalo Bills to step out of the dark ages and try and compete in a league that is passing them by......literally. Now, does that mean they are using all these throws correctly? NO!!!! Most every pass is being designed for WRs to hook up, square in or square out to the sidelines, and come back to the ball. They are hardly running enough plays that are designed to get run after the catch which is how a lot of offenses put up big passing numbers. Now, I don't know if this is because they have determined Allen can't throw slants, crossers, etc. effectively enough on a regular basis or if this is just the general scheme of our offense in general. But whatever. We have a long way to go on offense whichever way you want to put it. But, I have absolutely no problem with trying to light up the scoreboard throwing the ball all over the place. We've had 20 years of ground and pound and it has gotten us nothing. But, with the offense the way it is designed, and the lack of overall talent on the offensive side of the ball outside a few guys, I'm not sure our version of this passing offense will work. But, I have no problems with them trying to build an offense around the passing game in general. I agree with this. But Allen may not be good enough yet to win with this approach. I think they know that but want to develop him anyhow.
Ramza86 Posted November 14, 2019 Posted November 14, 2019 Honestly I thought that was the plan since preseason. Once i saw how much the short pass was emphasized...it looked like getting Allen better was the reason for the season. We just happened to go on a roll.
Big Turk Posted November 14, 2019 Posted November 14, 2019 44 minutes ago, Dablitzkrieg said: Absolutely not what is happening These conspiracy theories get more and more interesting every day... 1
Steptide Posted November 14, 2019 Posted November 14, 2019 May be true, but I don't think you have to be so conservative on offense. If you're playing to develop Allen, open it up a little
Augie Posted November 14, 2019 Posted November 14, 2019 7 minutes ago, Steptide said: May be true, but I don't think you have to be so conservative on offense. If you're playing to develop Allen, open it up a little What do you mean by “open it up”? He passed 41 times, and handed off 14 times. What do you want? I really don’t understand, not trying to be a jerk. 1
Tolstoy Posted November 14, 2019 Author Posted November 14, 2019 3 minutes ago, Augie said: What do you mean by “open it up”? He passed 41 times, and handed off 14 times. What do you want? I really don’t understand, not trying to be a jerk. It is strange, but despite throwing 41 passes the offense still seems a bit conservative. I am no expert, but the majority of the passes are short or mid-range, and many of them seem to wait until the receiver shows himself open. There are very few high risk throws. The long balls (as pointed out in another thread) seem to be too long as if to prevent against possible underthrown and intercepted balls.
Augie Posted November 14, 2019 Posted November 14, 2019 1 minute ago, Tolstoy said: It is strange, but despite throwing 41 passes the offense still seems a bit conservative. I am no expert, but the majority of the passes are short or mid-range, and many of them seem to wait until the receiver shows himself open. There are very few high risk throws. The long balls (as pointed out in another thread) seem to be too long as if to prevent against possible underthrown and intercepted balls. Yes, I think that perception is indeed very strange. They throw short, intermediate and far too often, far too long (like 5-10 yards too long!). A balanced attack playing like a real NFL QB would, IMO, be the best thing to develop Allen.
Steptide Posted November 14, 2019 Posted November 14, 2019 17 minutes ago, Augie said: What do you mean by “open it up”? He passed 41 times, and handed off 14 times. What do you want? I really don’t understand, not trying to be a jerk. More play action maybe. More screens maybe. The passing game seems to be pretty one dimensional. I'm just thinking if you're trying to develop Allen, let him learn how to do everything. Maybe take more deep shots, more than 1 or 2 times a game anyway
HOUSE Posted November 14, 2019 Posted November 14, 2019 (edited) 2 hours ago, matter2003 said: These conspiracy theories get more and more interesting every day... Somebody was stealing an extra dish of strawberrys and I can prove it.. 4 Edited November 14, 2019 by HOUSE 2 2
Tolstoy Posted November 14, 2019 Author Posted November 14, 2019 10 minutes ago, Augie said: Yes, I think that perception is indeed very strange. They throw short, intermediate and far too often, far too long (like 5-10 yards too long!). A balanced attack playing like a real NFL QB would, IMO, be the best thing to develop Allen. Ha! I get your sarcasm. But you have to agree that our offense is not anywhere near explosive. Would you blame that simply on execution?
Augie Posted November 14, 2019 Posted November 14, 2019 3 minutes ago, Steptide said: More play action maybe. More screens maybe. The passing game seems to be pretty one dimensional. I'm just thinking if you're trying to develop Allen, let him learn how to do everything. Maybe take more deep shots, more than 1 or 2 times a game anyway I agree on more play action, but that works better if you actually run the ball. I’d love more screens, not sure why that is so hard for us. But it’s great when it works. I don’t need any greater frequency on the deep shots until we get the rest worked out.
Mr. WEO Posted November 14, 2019 Posted November 14, 2019 1 hour ago, Tolstoy said: My apologies if this is in another thread somewhere, but it occurred to me that Daboll may have a mandate to develop Josh Allen as a QB at virtually all costs, even if it means possibly risking wins this season. The reasoning would be that we are very unlikely to win without more talent and experience anyhow, and we will need a top flight QB to win in future years. We are better off developing an elite QB, instead of squeaking out every victory we can, only to never win the big prize because we lack the QB we need. This would explain why we opened the season with 18 straight passes, as if Daboll was intentionally trying to get Allen into a rhythm regardless of what might be more likely to succeed. It explains why the Bills are so reluctant to become a running team, even though it seems like running the ball more might lead to more wins. It even explains why Allen has played more conservatively of late--because not playing hero-ball and becoming more turnover free is essential to a top flight QB. I expect that now that he has (arguably) gone too far towards playing conservatively, they will try to nudge him back towards playing more aggressively. In short, I am suggesting that Beane, McDermott and Daboll are all on the same page here--a long game strategy of developing an elite NFL QB . The wins and losses this season are secondary. Part of me has doubts about this perspective, because so many careers depend upon winning and losing right now--both players and coaches. It is hard for me to believe that they are not doing whatever they can to win right now. But when I see what they are doing with Allen and the running game etc., I can't help but think I am right. So the Bills catching staff has developed a new way to "develop an elite QB" that doesn't need or consider winning games? Anyway, the Bills are 21st in pass attempts and 11th in rushing attempts. Wouldn't it be better to surround the developing QB with adequate Offensive skill position players? This thread is mess.
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