10 decision coins: Josh Allen

[jletha]

20 minutes ago, dave mcbride said:

Excellent point, but to succeed as an NFL QB, you simply have to be able to complete long balls more than once every 16 games or so.

Absolutely agree. My post was regarding the point made by OP that his "strengths are actually weaknesses" and cited his arm strength.

[Hebert19]

4 hours ago, Mango said:

 

 

We have a choice. I would take a run at Dalton for 2 years 25M-ish total contract. Put some resources into better OT play and a WR too. If Josh looks the same next year as he does this year I pull the trigger sometime between week 4-6. Dalton starts for 1.5 years. You take a QB 2021 to sit. The regime cannot afford to whiff without an immediate replacement plan in 2020/2021.

Dalton who has win 0 games this year and generally looks terrible.  Ya.  Good call.  You dump allen for a franchise QB...brees brady Roger's Matt Ryan etc.  Not another mediocre QB with no upside.  Allen is far better than any of those bozos because he at least still has upside.  Ylu know what you have in guys like dalton.  Not much. 

[Rock-A-Bye Beasley]

4 hours ago, H2o said:

Wow............. A new and creative way to discuss moving on from Josh Allen before the end of his 2nd year when he has shown improvement , that he is a clutch performer, and the team is 6-3. Awesome. 

 

Yep. It’s because he is bad. It’s not awesome though. 

[london_bills]

3 minutes ago, Joe in Winslow said:

This reeks of a crappy corporate motivation exercise.

 

I don't like you for posting this.

 

Just play along. Dont be a grouch. ?

Edited November 12, 2019 by london_bills

[leonbus23]

Ten coins on Allen for one more full season (2020). If he still is average at best, find someone else (not an easy find). He really looks like Tannehill or Mariota or one of those very average guys who can win with a lot of help. But he doesn't look like Big Ben or Rivers did in first two seasons. A third season will confirm if he's going to be any better than frighteningly average. 

Edited November 12, 2019 by leonbus23

[H2o]

2 minutes ago, leonbus23 said:

Ten coins on Allen for one more full season (2020). If he still is average at best, find someone else (not an easy find). He really looks like Tannehill or Mariota or one of those very average guys who can win with a lot of help. But he doesn't look like Big Ben or Rivers did in first two seasons. A third season will confirm if he's going to be any better than frighteningly average. 

Roethlisberger's 3rd was his worst year of his career completing less than 60% of his passes and throwing 18 TD's to 23 INT's. Year 5 he was less than 60% as well with 17 TD's to 15 INT's. Rivers sat for 2 years behind Drew Brees before he even got his shot. 

[Ridgewaycynic2013]

Screw the coins.  Magic 8 Ball!

[london_bills]

59 minutes ago, leonbus23 said:

Ten coins on Allen for one more full season (2020). If he still is average at best, find someone else (not an easy find). He really looks like Tannehill or Mariota or one of those very average guys who can win with a lot of help. But he doesn't look like Big Ben or Rivers did in first two seasons. A third season will confirm if he's going to be any better than frighteningly average. 

Should there not be someone here waiting in the wings should he not show it?

 

Are you saying he doesn't look as good as big Ben or rivers in their first two seasons? 

 

I agree in regards mariota/ tannehill etc 

[CincyBillsFan]

2 hours ago, peterpan said:

We need to bring in another QB this off-season. I'm not saying a guy to start, but I guy "just in case". Drafted rounds 3-6 Hopefully we ends up great in case Allen falters.  Like Minshew or something.  Other option is a better veteran backup.  Someone who should be starting in the league, like Bridgwater or something.  

 

I'd love to be in the situation the Jags are in next year.  Where Allen is the starter but our Rookie we took Is a great option too

 

If we bring in a Minshew like QB can we also bring in a Leonard Fourenett like RB?  You see a dominating RB has something to do with the success of a Minshew type QB.

 

As an aside, did you actually watch Minshew his last couple of games?  If Allen had a game as bad as Minshew had in London this season 2BD would be in meltdown mode!

 

 

6 hours ago, Mango said:

 

 

We have a choice. I would take a run at Dalton for 2 years 25M-ish total contract. Put some resources into better OT play and a WR too. If Josh looks the same next year as he does this year I pull the trigger sometime between week 4-6. Dalton starts for 1.5 years. You take a QB 2021 to sit. The regime cannot afford to whiff without an immediate replacement plan in 2020/2021.

 

I live in Cincinnati and have seen Dalton up close.  If you want to guarantee 5 more years of EXTREME mediocrity do what you suggest here.

 

And we DON'T have the cap room to spend $25,000,000 on Dalton if we also want a new Tackle and a stud Pass Rusher and either a game breaking WR or RB.

 

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

4 hours ago, jletha said:

I wish I could scream from the rooftops for this entire board to hear that his arm strength is NOT ABOUT THE LONG BALL! HE HAS NEVER BEEN GOOD AT THE LONG BALL, EVEN IN COLLEGE. HIS ARM STRENGTH ALLOWS HIM TO THROW IT ON ROPES ALL OVER THE FIELD.

 

So many here seems to think arm strength is solely for deep go-routes and therefore Josh's arm strength is worthless.

THIS! I’m giving you all of my coins. 

[Ridgewaycynic2013]

400 quatloos for your 10 coins.  What they are in meadcoins, I have no idea.

[Tesla03]

bring a smart OC in that knows how to work with Allen's talent. if Allen doesn't improve after that then we can move on. 

 

realistically Daboll should be fired after this season if we flame out. McD keeps him on and the whole staff will be gone by the end of next season. 

[ILBillsfan]

This is really a discussion for this time next year.  As I see right now I think he has shown improvement and still needs a bit more work but nothing is showing me the trajectory is fizzling flat or sliding down 

 

[Scott7975]

8 hours ago, Bangarang said:

You keep investing in the offense. If Allen can’t take advantage of the added talent then hopefully the next guy we draft will. 
 

Allen is the starter this year and likely heading into next. If things stay just as they are with him then we can say it’s time to move on. Come next year the leash should be shorter.

 

Pretty much my answer right here.  You build for this kid to succeed.  If the kid don't succeed then its already built for the next guy.

[LSHMEAB]

10 hours ago, CincyBillsFan said:

I'll bite:  I would put all ten coins on Allen.  We really have no choice do we?  Doing anything other then that AT THIS POINT is the sign of a dysfunctional organization and a guarantee that the Bills will remain on the outside looking in for the next decade at playoff time.

 

And for the record Allen has shown more then enough to justify a continued investment.  And in today's NFL and when dealing with a QB that means you have to be ALL IN.

 

 

Serious question. Are you a Bills fan or a Josh Allen fan? Because what we've seen isn't good enough. I want to see the Bills win whether it's Allen or not.

[Doogie]

Let’s face it. Daboll is not very good. But 20 games in, Allen is definitely not the QB of the future. 

[ILBillsfan]

4 minutes ago, LSHMEAB said:

Serious question. Are you a Bills fan or a Josh Allen fan? Because what we've seen isn't good enough. I want to see the Bills win whether it's Allen or not.

If your a Bills fan you invest and give to develop on the rookie deal like every other team in the NFL does unless you have a seriously bad egg like Russell

 

Allen has improved and you give him continued pieces and next year. 
 

Pretty simple for this warm chair GM’s that don’t get this I’d ask for some facts to show where a NFL team varied from this

[rayray808]

5 minutes ago, Doogie said:

Let’s face it. Daboll is not very good. But 20 games in, Allen is definitely not the QB of the future. 

 

what makes it definite that he is not the QB of the future?

[LSHMEAB]

Just now, ILBillsfan said:

If your a Bills fan you invest and give to develop on the rookie deal like every other team in the NFL does unless you have a seriously bad egg like Russell

 

Allen has improved and you give him continued pieces and next year. 
 

Pretty simple for this warm chair GM’s that don’t get this I’d ask for some facts to show where a NFL team varied from this

Where has he improved? His best game was against Miami as a rookie. The Giants game was really encouraging. Since then, nada.

 

It would be IDEAL if Josh steps it up and becomes the answer because anything else leaves us behind the 8 ball. But this idea that it's Allen or nothing is crazy and I'm kind of tired of being labeled as an anti fan because I have questions. Last Bills PLAY I missed was against the Chargers when there was a power outage. Next to last was when they cut into a game against the Jets for some Clinton impeachment nonsense.

 

At this point, Josh has proven very little and I feel no personal attachment. WHEN I see more, that will come. 

 

I want the BILLS to start WINNING. Don't really care about who makes that happen.

[Nextmanup]

10 hours ago, rayray808 said:

You are in a room with the owners, GM, and head coach. Each of you have 10 coins in your hand, and must place them in one of two places on the table.

 

LEFT SIDE: We continue to put energy and resources towards Josh Allen. Win or lose this year, he is our starter this year and next. We are confident he can be the guy.

RIGHT SIDE: It is time to start planning for another QB. It has been 20 games, and his perceived strengths (strong arm to cut through weather, long ball for the HR, can run the ball) are actually his weaknesses.

 

How are you spreading out your 10 coins?

 

 

 

**for me: 8 coins left, 2 coins right

I like where you're coming from with this one.

 

Good thread.

 

I am very similar to you.  Maybe 7 left, 3 right for me.

 

I'd be drafting a QB next year for sure, and seriously looking into acquiring one of the big names that is going to be without a contract at the end of this season if things go as most predict.

 

 

 

 

1 hour ago, Tesla03 said:

bring a smart OC in that knows how to work with Allen's talent. if Allen doesn't improve after that then we can move on. 

 

realistically Daboll should be fired after this season if we flame out. McD keeps him on and the whole staff will be gone by the end of next season. 

Funny how the fanbase has shifted into a "we need a new OC" mantra of late.

 

Historically, that means the QB is not getting the job done.