Singletary finishes with EIGHT rushing attempts

[T master]

22 hours ago, wiseman3 said:

8 rushing attempts against the 30th ranked D against the run, and 41 pass attempts against the 4th ranked D against the pass. Daboll needs to go

 

 

https://www.buffalorumblings.com/2019/11/11/20959111/snap-count-notes-buffalo-bills-at-cleveland-browns

[Dr.Mantis_Toboggan]

22 hours ago, wiseman3 said:

8 rushing attempts against the 30th ranked D against the run, and 41 pass attempts against the 4th ranked D against the pass. Daboll needs to go

I agree, McDermott needs to nut up and make a change before it’s too late.

They might even have the right guy in house in Ken Dorsey.  Daboll has overstayed his welcome in this league, you only get so many chances to fail miserably as an OC, back to college for him, give the reigns to Ken and pray for the best. Daboll isn’t going to magically turn into a good playcaller, he never has been, never will be, a year in Bama didn’t change that fact.

[dakrider]

3 hours ago, Nextmanup said:

Folks need a scapegoat b/c their blind faith in Josh Allen will not allow them to target him as the true source of our problems on offense.  

 

Daboll can't force Josh into making the right reads or throwing the ball more accurately or with timing and anticipation.

 

This fanbase is like a diner who goes to a restaurant with horrible food and terrible service, and then concludes the real problem is the choice of wallpaper in the main dining room is just all wrong, making it impossible to enjoy a good meal there.

 

 

You can blame Allen but he's being forced into making something happen every play.  There were not playmakers yesterday making anything happen not to mention some poor dropped passes.  Its either Josh has to make a great throw or a great run or its nothing.  Josh had some misses, he threw a few balls away due to pressure.  He missed a big pass play he should have hit, no excuse on that one.  But Josh Allen is also not Aaron Rodgers and he's not going to make a perfect play every snap.  

[Lurker]

Why do I get the feeling that if Motor gets 25 rushing attempts against the Fins and the Bills struggle/lose, many of the same posters will say they should have passed more...

[RoyBatty is alive]

22 hours ago, Guest said:

Run Run Pass Punt

They gave up early. Browns were playing for the jobs, like the Eagles earlier. Bills were still sleeping on the bus until the second to last drive, then D was spent.

On D, Levi Wallace needs help. Coaches bought the week one hype, and when you move Poyer out for support they just destroy the run because Star is always on the ground and Edmunds can't shed.

this is pretty spot on accurate and yet the Browns were playing for their jobs and respect.

 

And when Edmunds can shed he is in the wrong gap or headed in the worng direction.

[Nitro]

The coach and the WGR apologists say they had eight men in the box. So?  Attack them.  Make them try to stop the run.  This fear that they show is a trait Danilo has shown in other stops.  This is not modern NFL offensive mindset.  Be aggressive or you will be left behind.  Bottom third offense is not acceptable either is being timid.

[Lurker]

22 hours ago, Guest said:

Run Run Pass Punt

 

The Bills had 20 first downs yesterday--the second most they've had this year.

 

Check-out time is 11:00 am.    I'll e-mail you your receipt...

[ngbills]

I know this has been talked about in general terms. But wanted to look at Devin Singletary vs Browns in closer detail. I find it absurd that he was not used more. I find it more absurd given how he performed the week prior. It is maddening to hear the logic and excuses from this coaching staff as to why he was not used more. I am losing any trust in them more each day.

 

All of his runs below.

 

He had 1 carry the entire 1st quarter and it went for 4 yards. Granted Bills only had two drives and both short ones. Maybe he is given rock that is different.

 

He had 2 carries in the second quarter. One went for 9 and the other for 8. Not able to run the ball? 

 

He had 5 carries in the 3rd quarter. This included a 10, 6 and 4 yd plus two for 1 and 0. Again, not bad for not being able to run. But 5 carries over 3 drives in a close game in the 3rd quarter and this was his heaviest workload? 

 

Zero carries in the 4th quarter. Bills have 3 possessions and he gets zero carries with Bills down 3 in all of these drives and plenty of clock. Even the last drive you have almost two minutes in prevent defense mode. 

 

Then we get the lame excuses. The box was stacked. We need to continue to evaluate. Blah blah blah. 

 

1	11:19	2	8	CLE 43	Devin Singletary right guard for 4 yards (tackle by Morgan Burnett and Damarious Randall)
2	14:48	1	10	BUF 24	Devin Singletary right guard for 9 yards (tackle by Damarious Randall)
2	12:58	2	10	BUF 48	Devin Singletary left tackle for 8 yards (tackle by Greedy Williams)
3	14:54	1	10	BUF 23	Devin Singletary right tackle for 1 yard (tackle by Larry Ogunjobi)
3	13:32	2	10	BUF 40	Devin Singletary right tackle for 10 yards (tackle by T.J. Carrie)
3	12:58	1	10	BUF 50	Devin Singletary right guard for 4 yards (tackle by Chad Thomas)
3	10:22	1	25	BUF 16	Devin Singletary right guard for 6 yards (tackle by Larry Ogunjobi and Damarious Randall)
3	1:35	2	4	CLE 36	Devin Singletary left guard for no gain (tackle by Sheldon Richardson)

Edited November 12, 2019 by ngbills

[Logic]

On Sunday, during and after the game, I was absolutely furious that Singletary didn't get more carries.

HOWEVER...reading through Daboll's presser comments and watching All-22 footage that seems to back them up, what he says rings true: The Browns basically packed the box all game long and dared the Bills to beat them through the air. You can make the argument that the Bills should have just run the ball anyway and tried to impose their will on the Browns, but I'm not sure how much success they would have had against all the 8 and 9 man boxes the Browns were presenting. What the Bills did instead was to try to force the Browns to back off by beating them through the air. The only problem was that the Bills couldn't/didn't beat them through the air, so the boxes kept getting stacked and the pressure kept coming. You'd like to think in these types of situations that the QB you selected in the 1st round would have the ability to make the opposing defense pay for over-committing to the run by punishing them through the air -- he could not. He did not. 

Less of my irritation and concern is directed toward Brian Daboll now, and more of it is directed at Josh Allen. He NEEDS to be able to make defenses pay when they do this, and he couldn't. He needs to step up. He needs to get better. If he doesn't, teams will just keep on doing this.

[BarleyNY]

Cleveland was in Cover 1 a ton. Single high safety with a stacked box.  They didn’t even bother to disguise it.  Singletary was not getting much against that.  They dared Allen to beat them with one safety over the top and he couldn’t.  What’s supposed to happen is that the offense is supposed to take advantage of the single coverage and beat the largely man coverage which then would force the defense to back off.  They could not do that because Allen was not accurate enough often enough.  I’ll give him this though - he was good against zone where receivers could find seams to sit down or slow their route.  The problem was that the Browns mostly stayed with that base Cover 1 defense.

 

Running Singletary into that defense would not have helped the Bills win this game.

 

A further worry is that the Browns looked to be in regular zones.  I didn’t see them use zone pattern matching like the better defenses do.

Edited November 12, 2019 by BarleyNY

[Houston's #1 Bills Fan]

6 minutes ago, Logic said:

On Sunday, during and after the game, I was absolutely furious that Singletary didn't get more carries.

HOWEVER...reading through Daboll's presser comments and watching All-22 footage that seems to back them up, what he says rings true: The Browns basically packed the box all game long and dared the Bills to beat them through the air. You can make the argument that the Bills should have just run the ball anyway and tried to impose their will on the Browns, but I'm not sure how much success they would have had against all the 8 and 9 man boxes the Browns were presenting. What the Bills did instead was to try to force the Browns to back off by beating them through the air. The only problem was that the Bills couldn't/didn't beat them through the air, so the boxes kept getting stacked and the pressure kept coming. You'd like to think in these types of situations that the QB you selected in the 1st round would have the ability to make the opposing defense pay for over-committing to the run by punishing them through the air -- he could not. He did not. 

Less of my irritation and concern is directed toward Brian Daboll now, and more of it is directed at Josh Allen. He NEEDS to be able to make defenses pay when they do this, and he couldn't. He needs to step up. He needs to get better. If he doesn't, teams will just keep on doing this.

Very good point.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

19 minutes ago, ngbills said:

I know this has been talked about in general terms. But wanted to look at Devin Singletary vs Browns in closer detail. I find it absured that he was not used more. I find it more absurd given how he performed the week prior. It is maddening to hear the logic and excuses from this coaching staff as to why he was not used more. I am losing any trust in them more each day.

 

All of his runs below.

 

He had 1 carry the entire 1st quarter and it went for 4 yards. Granted Bills only had two drives and both short ones. Maybe he is giving rock that is different.

 

He had 2 carries in the second quarter. One went for 9 and the other for 8. Not able to run the ball? 

 

He had 5 carries in the 3rd quarter. This included a 10, 6 and 4 yd plus two for 1 and 0. Again, not bad for not being able to run. But 5 carries over 3 drives in a close game in the 3rd quarter and this was his heaviest workload? 

 

Zero carries in the 4th quarter. Bills have 3 possessions and he gets zero quarters with Bills down 3 in all of these drives and plenty of clock. Even the last drive you have almost two minutes in prevent defense mode. 

 

Then we get the lame excuses. The box was stacked. We need to continue to evaluate. Blah blah blah. 

 

1	11:19	2	8	CLE 43	Devin Singletary right guard for 4 yards (tackle by Morgan Burnett and Damarious Randall)
2	14:48	1	10	BUF 24	Devin Singletary right guard for 9 yards (tackle by Damarious Randall)
2	12:58	2	10	BUF 48	Devin Singletary left tackle for 8 yards (tackle by Greedy Williams)
3	14:54	1	10	BUF 23	Devin Singletary right tackle for 1 yard (tackle by Larry Ogunjobi)
3	13:32	2	10	BUF 40	Devin Singletary right tackle for 10 yards (tackle by T.J. Carrie)
3	12:58	1	10	BUF 50	Devin Singletary right guard for 4 yards (tackle by Chad Thomas)
3	10:22	1	25	BUF 16	Devin Singletary right guard for 6 yards (tackle by Larry Ogunjobi and Damarious Randall)
3	1:35	2	4	CLE 36	Devin Singletary left guard for no gain (tackle by Sheldon Richardson)

 

So McDermott, before the game, called Browns DC Steve Wilks (who used to work for him) a "Damn good coach"

 

Wilks basically wagered that the Bills wouldn't figure out a way to run against 8 or 9 in the box.  And he was right.

But of course, globally one can, even with a line that is not great power-rushing. 

Daboll actually did some clever things to help us run last year with a worse OL.

 

The thing is, it's a bit of a Zebra and I don't mean a ref.  The straightforward way to beat that is with passing, and the point to remember is, while "almost only counts in horseshoes and handgrenades", we were only a couple of offensive and ST plays away from making the Browns fall on that thing.  And while sure, we all want Allen to be better because, Bottom Line, that's the job of the Franchise Man, there were other places those "couple of plays" could have come from:

-better play choice in some key situations playing to our strengths

-some drops or failures to haul in a contested ball

-some uncalled penalties

 

[Rigotz]

The next time you start a post with "I know this has been discussed before" just realize that this has been discussed before and don't start a thread.

 

They didn't run because the defense was daring Josh Allen to pass. He didn't deliver. End of story.

[Logic]

Every response so far in this thread is pretty much on the money. Passing game needed to beat the Browns' cover 1 looks and couldn't. The Bills need two things: a stud #1 receiver and for their quarterback to play better.

[colin]

some zone runs, rpo's, or screens (not a run, but close enough) could have punished the browns for being so aggressive pre snap and made things easier for allen.

 

daboll sucks, he's in love with his goofy play book so much that he runs plays that the team can't successfully execute.  

 

an OC that can't figure out a way to run the ball vs a bad run D is not a good one, especially when you have a line that can't block the pass rush and a raw qb on some shakey footing.

[Tesla03]

Singletary probably should have been used in the screen game. 

 

but Allen couldn't deliver yesterday. Cleveland's secondary is decent, 4th ranked in the pass. we had plenty of opportunities to score, including right after the safety where we went 3 and out 

[John from Riverside]

So all any team has to do in Dabol's mind to stop running DS is for the other team to start stacking the line?

 

Good OC's FIND WAYS to STILL make it work.......and Devin makes people miss.

[NewEra]

So basically, Josh Allen was pretty bad as he couldn’t do jack vs a stacked box.  

6 minutes ago, John from Riverside said:

So all any team has to do in Dabol's mind to stop running DS is for the other team to start stacking the line?

 

Good OC's FIND WAYS to STILL make it work.......and Devin makes people miss.

When teams stack the box it makes it easier to hit home runs.  Yet we haven’t hit a home run all season.  That lies the true problem IMO.

 

i love JA and I’m all in on him, but if we can’t pass vs a stacked box ALL GAME long, that’s a serious problem.  Mostly a QB play problem 

[starrymessenger]

I get the point that Browns were staking the box. 5+ ypc isn't bad against a loaded front. Guess Devin is pretty good. 

[ganesh]

31 minutes ago, BarleyNY said:

Cleveland was in Cover 1 a ton. Single high safety with a stacked box.  They didn’t even bother to disguise it.  Singletary was not getting much against that.  They dared Allen to beat them with one safety over the top and he couldn’t.  What’s supposed to happen is that the offense is supposed to take advantage of the single coverage and beat the largely man coverage which then would force the defense to back off.  They could not do that because Allen was not accurate enough often enough.  I’ll give him this though - he was good against zone where receivers could find seams to sit down or slow their route.  The problem was that the Browns mostly stayed with that base Cover 1 defense.

 

Running Singletary into that defense would not have helped the Bills win this game.

 

A further worry is that the Browns looked to be in regular zones.  I didn’t see them use zone pattern matching like the better defenses do.

The stats presented by the OP Disproves that theory. Every time Singletary touched the ball, he got positive yards....