Casey D Posted November 9, 2019 Posted November 9, 2019 1 hour ago, uticaclub said: The reason guy A gets paid more then guy B is usually because guy A makes less mistakes, it's implied. Not in free agency. Most guys who hit free agency have flaws, that's why their teams chose not to hang onto them. But FAs get big money due to the market. The only way to get a DT better than Star is to draft, develop and keep. The grade A players rarely hit free agency, so what FAs get paid does not translate directly to the talent level.
White Linen Posted November 9, 2019 Posted November 9, 2019 Is this an example of him doing so much we don't know about? This must be him taking on multiple offensive lineman so everyone else can make the play and get the glory.
Thurman#1 Posted November 9, 2019 Author Posted November 9, 2019 (edited) Remind me, when referring to his having bad plays, did I say, " A play here and there? Yes. But few and far between." Oh, yeah, yes I did. So I'm aware there are a few bad plays on film out there. Star takes responsibility for two last game right in ther article. And you can find two bad plays on absolutely any player in the league, from Aaron Donald and the Bosas on down. Can you produce 20 or 30? You could for Peko. Edited November 9, 2019 by Thurman#1
CommonCents Posted November 9, 2019 Posted November 9, 2019 41 minutes ago, Thurman#1 said: That may be what YOU want from someone with his paycheck. But not so much McDermott and Beane. There are several big space eaters up that high in the average salary rankings. So several teams that value that skill set enough to pay a guy enough to very clearly show they disagree with you. And McDermott is one. They knew what they were getting with Star. McDermott had coached him for several years and obviously wanted him here and didn't have a problem with the salary. So yeah, the whipping boy problem does indeed have to do with fans having different priorities than the coaching staff does. Same way they knew all about KB and decided to trade a 2nd rounder for him?
Thurman#1 Posted November 9, 2019 Author Posted November 9, 2019 21 minutes ago, NoSaint said: unfortunately star is compensated in a way that as a gap filler you shouldn’t be starting many comparisons with “even though he was a better player than star....” Generally speaking the guys paid more are the disruptive penetrating players. there must be at least some concern that the center of our defense had one of the top paid pluggers and a top 10 pick at DT and a very high pick at MLB and run stuffing is considered a weak point at the moment. Hopefully the kids keep growing and elevating their play Again, when you look at what DLs are paid, it's plain that's wrong. Several gap pluggers are paid what he is and more. Are guys who can do it all paid more? Yeah, and for good reason. Aaron Donald is paid more than twice what Star is paid and he's worth it. But there are several space eaters paid similarly to Star. As for run stuffing being a weakness, if it continues to be so, I'll worry more. It appears to be two or three specific games where we had problems.
Dopey Posted November 9, 2019 Posted November 9, 2019 1 hour ago, Don Otreply said: This means that there are some folk here, who it appears do not know as much as they would pretend they do, some have back peddled a bit already, which is always entertaining. Those that bring up his wages make themselves sound the fool, especially being it has zero effect on the teams ability to spend.. No player wins every single snap, thinking fans know this. Star like all our guys owns his mistakes, and has at it again. Maybe if if we are lucky the vitriol will be reduced for, what, A day maybe... ya can lead a horse to water, but ya can’t make it drink, as the saying goes Now let’s watch these board members spin spin spin ?. Go Bills!!! I don't know how many time I wanted to say no player wins them all. We're 6-2 because of the defense. I think most will agree. In the skins game, if the db doesn't screw up and not tackle AP, twice, we're not mentioning this. AP doesn't have over 100yds all game, much less the 1st half if those 2 tackles are made. That was 40 yds on 2 plays where the dline did its job. 1 player missing an assignment can make the whole defense look like crap and that's what happened. AP had like 8 yds the whole 2nd half. Why? Gap responsibility and tackling. The only issues with the dline has been Phillip's injury and Peko wasn't good. Let's hope Taylor and Liuget play as well as Star, Phillips and Oliver have most of the season. 1
Thurman#1 Posted November 9, 2019 Author Posted November 9, 2019 1 minute ago, CommonCents said: Same way they knew all about KB and decided to trade a 2nd rounder for him? It was a 3rd, not a 2nd. And a 7th was thrown in.
Logic Posted November 9, 2019 Posted November 9, 2019 The thing that bugs me with the Star talk is that everyone on the Bills -- coaches, players (young and old), everyone -- says he does his job and does it well. Meanwhile, fans -- not even analysts, really, just regular fans -- swear up and down that he stinks. So who should I believe? The coaches and players? Guys like Leslie Frazier and Lorenzo Alexander? Or armchair quarterbacks and message board "experts"? The big disconnect, in my opinion, likely comes down to what the guy is paid. If he had an average contract, no one would talk about him much. Because he gets paid a lot, Bills fans like to scapegoat him and whine endlessly about him. Maybe, just maybe, there's more to the Bills' recent run defense problems than just one player's performance? Maybe, just maybe, fans don't always know what the hell they're talking about? 2 1
Thurman#1 Posted November 9, 2019 Author Posted November 9, 2019 (edited) I should say I'm not a huge fanboy or anything. If they can replace his play cheaper in the next year or two, they should do it. Wouldn't be any skin off my nose. But the hate here from a group of fans and the love from the Bills, shown in contract terms, quotes, interviews and every way they can, really, shows that someone is missing something. And it's probably not the folks who know his assignments on every play. Outta here for the evening. Edited November 9, 2019 by Thurman#1
OldTimeAFLGuy Posted November 9, 2019 Posted November 9, 2019 1 hour ago, Buffalo Junction said: The issue is that fans expect Star to perform in a manner similar to other NTs in that salary range; many of whom make more splash plays. Unfortunately, that comes with neglecting several details... most notably when Star was signed he was one of the best NTs on the market, and they needed a plug and play NT. Beane & Co can definitely upgrade the position, but it will likely be a phase out as they develop younger players to take over the role. ....very fair assessment IMO.....hate to use " stop gap" because it connotes desperation......"plug and play" sounds far better and McBeane knew what he was getting.....cap hit(s) say he may be here for awhile...... 1
Green Lightning Posted November 9, 2019 Posted November 9, 2019 3 hours ago, Joe in Winslow said: I don't think star is the problem at our DT position. To me he's the Maginot line of DTs. Holds his ground and watches the play go around him for big yards. How about some occasional lateral pursuit or perchance a penetration & tackle every now and again? Huge dollars for a traffic cone to me. 1 1
OldTimeAFLGuy Posted November 9, 2019 Posted November 9, 2019 1 minute ago, Green Lightning said: To me he's the Maginot line of DTs. Holds his ground and watches the play go around him for big yards. How about some occasional lateral pursuit or perchance a penetration & tackle every now and again? Huge dollars for a traffic cone to me. ...was he like that before just coming to OBD?......would seem to be a pretty rapid decline if he was not......perhaps lack of motivation in that his contract has a pretty hefty cap hit if released...thoughts?...
ALF Posted November 9, 2019 Posted November 9, 2019 It would be nice to find a motivated space eater like Vince Wilfork , liked his attitude and BBQ
Buffalo Junction Posted November 9, 2019 Posted November 9, 2019 32 minutes ago, OldTimeAFLGuy said: ....very fair assessment IMO.....hate to use " stop gap" because it connotes desperation......"plug and play" sounds far better and McBeane knew what he was getting.....cap hit(s) say he may be here for awhile...... IMO, Star is better than a simple “stop gap”. Beane has shown that he’s not handing out long term contracts to stop gap players. Star’s role was/is vital to the defense functioning properly. He fit a need, knew the defense, etc. He may be overpaid for that role, but I don’t care how they spend Peg’s money as long as they have the cap space to resign critical players. I think a lot of folks aren’t being honest with how long it can take to develop defensive tackles, especially NTs that don’t have blue chip physical traits... It’s strength and technique which take time to build. They will put guys in the pipeline and Star likely won’t be retained for the same salary once his contract is up. If they end up finding a gem like Pat Williams he might be released. Not having a replacement for Horrible Harry is a much bigger problem than Star’s ability. 2
OldTimeAFLGuy Posted November 9, 2019 Posted November 9, 2019 1 minute ago, ALF said: It would be nice to find a motivated space eater like Vince Wilfork , liked his attitude and BBQ ...knees, right??.......... Just now, Buffalo Junction said: IMO, Star is better than a simple “stop gap”. Beane has shown that he’s not handing out long term contracts to stop gap players. Star’s role was/is vital to the defense functioning properly. He fit a need, knew the defense, etc. He may be overpaid for that role, but I don’t care how they spend Peg’s money as long as they have the cap space to resign critical players. I think a lot of folks aren’t being honest with how long it can take to develop defensive tackles, especially NTs that don’t have blue chip physical traits... It’s strength and technique which take time to build. They will put guys in the pipeline and Star likely won’t be retained for the same salary once his contract is up. If they end up finding a gem like Pat Williams he might be released. Not having a replacement for Horrible Harry is a much bigger problem than Star’s ability. ...agree....nicely done bud......now put on the kevlar and take cover from the "TBD Star Fan Club (COUGH)"....... 1
Rocket94 Posted November 9, 2019 Posted November 9, 2019 (edited) 41 minutes ago, Green Lightning said: To me he's the Maginot line of DTs. Holds his ground and watches the play go around him for big yards. How about some occasional lateral pursuit or perchance a penetration & tackle every now and again? Huge dollars for a traffic cone to me. Excellent description! Maginot Line! All you have to do is go around! Hey...it has been proven to work! Edited November 9, 2019 by Rocket94
Logic Posted November 9, 2019 Posted November 9, 2019 1 hour ago, ScottLaw said: Apparently everyone's doing a good job as teams run wild on us week in and week out. Fans just don't know what they are seeing....? Yeah. I'm sure YOUR take is right. I'm sure it's just one guy's fault ?
ROCBillsBeliever Posted November 9, 2019 Posted November 9, 2019 2 hours ago, BUFFALOKIE said: I like saying "Star La-too-lay-lay". It's fun. So does Tasker, on One Bills Live. He sounds hilarious, struggling through it, and you know they have it printed out, phonetically, for him, by the way he reads it, on air. Don't get me wrong, I love Tasker, but he kills me, sometimes.
Hapless Bills Fan Posted November 9, 2019 Posted November 9, 2019 6 hours ago, Locomark said: Star’s whipping boy problem has to do with his paycheck. Space eaters still need to make the occasional splash play in the backfield, push the pile back, get the ugly turnover. Think old players of Adams or Washington eating space BUT making plays too. That is what we want for a highly compensated guy. Otherwise let’s just get some sumo guy if the expectation is to hold 2 guys up and never make any plays. Errrrr.....I think you might need to re-read what you wrote there. For a space eater, to wrote "if the expectation is to hold 2 guys up and never make any plays" is an implicit contradiction. Space eaters need to hold 2 guys up. That's literally the expectation of how they make plays.
TheFunPolice Posted November 9, 2019 Posted November 9, 2019 Star has been doing a fine job He's never hurt and he never complains... Just eats up blocks and lets teammates have the glory 1
Recommended Posts