Joe B Observations on Bills win over Phins

[SCBills]

4 hours ago, BillsMafia13 said:

Gotta disagree, not to be that guy but I am concerned and the picture is bigger than just 5-1.  2 games were definitley aided by the other teams kickers, we should have lost the jets and titans games but got lucky.  The giants game we barely pulled that out too, yesterday we just squeaked by possibly the worst team in history.  

    Its like the bills play to the level of thier competition for 3.5 quarters then turn it on if thier losing. They seem too reactionary and not in control enough. 

 

I don’t think our record is masking the big picture. 

 

We have a top 3 defense.  I think that’s pretty well recognized.  

 

On offense, our points are the flukey stat as they don’t seem at all in line with our yardage per game or red zone efficiency.  

 

Sure, other teams made mistakes against us to help aid victories, but we lost to New England due to a blocked punt and our QB getting knocked out of the game.  It’s the NFL... most games aren’t blowouts, but the better team usually wins. 

 

Edited October 21, 2019 by SCBills

[BillsMafia13]

19 minutes ago, SCBills said:

 

I don’t think our record is masking the big picture. 

 

We have a top 3 defense.  I think that’s pretty well recognized.  

 

On offense, our points are the flukey stat as they don’t seem at all in line with our yardage per game or red zone efficiency.  

 

Sure, other teams made mistakes against us to help aid victories, but we lost to New England due to a blocked punt and our QB getting knocked out of the game.  It’s the NFL... most games aren’t blowouts, but the better team usually wins. 

 

Agreed, and idk what it means but that just shows we play to the level of our competition. Not that we dont have an identity but it just seems like they havent figured it out yet. 

   Also, im pretty sure all the boo'ing before half time was becasue we were losing and they called a draw play on like 3 & 18 after a couple other bad plays.  If we are legit like our 5-1 record, coming off a bye we should have demolished them

[Formerly Allan in MD]

As mentioned, Allen needs to learn to check down and look for his running backs.

[CincyBillsFan]

15 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

True Dat.  Our lone victory over NE in a meaningful game QB'd by Brady.  September 25, 2011.  34-31 Bills win.

Who was the QB?  Ryan Fitzpatrick.  And he was on fire.  369 passing yards all caught by those all time greats Donald Jones, Stevie Johnson, and David Nelson. 2 TD, no sacks.

 

He did throw 2 picks though ?  but it didn't matter 'cuz Brady threw 4.

 

And I was there the next week when the 3 - 0 Bills lost to the 0 - 3 Bengals and Fitz played poorly. 

 

They should have a special place in the HOF for Fitz.  I mean has any QB played as well and as poorly as Fitz has for such a long time?  It's freakish IMO.  But woe to any team that plays against Fitz when he's channeling that magic. 

 

 

[Hapless Bills Fan]

3 minutes ago, CincyBillsFan said:

And I was there the next week when the 3 - 0 Bills lost to the 0 - 3 Bengals and Fitz played poorly. 

 

They should have a special place in the HOF for Fitz.  I mean has any QB played as well and as poorly as Fitz has for such a long time?  It's freakish IMO.  But woe to any team that plays against Fitz when he's channeling that magic.

 

Indeed  Fitzmagic/Fitztragic.  Sometimes in the next week, sometimes in the next game.

[CincyBillsFan]

And while we're on the topic of Fitzmagic only last year we had:

 

In weeks 1 & 2 playing for Tampa Fitz went 48 - 61 for 819 yards, 8 TD's & no INT's!  The next week the magic began to wear off as Fitz threw for 411 yards & 3 TD's but also had 3 INT's and Tampa lost the game.  The following week Fitztragic was back as he only threw for 126 yards! 

 

I mean no one would believe you if you created Fitz as a fictional character in a novel or movie.  I mean Uncle Rico might be more believable!

 

 

Edited October 21, 2019 by CincyBillsFan

[GoBills808]

5 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Indeed  Fitzmagic/Fitztragic.  Sometimes in the next week, sometimes in the next game.

Sometimes in the next half

[Hapless Bills Fan]

8 hours ago, JoshAllenHasBigHands said:

1. Shame on anyone who boo'd the team at halftime. So embarrassing. I know on the national radio show I listen to, it was very poorly received. 

2. I bet on Miami with the points. I knew we would win, but anyone that thought it would be by 17 points was fooling themselves. This is not a year to year process. We are on a steady incline, and its great, but if you get greedy and expect too much, you are going to walk away disappointed. 

 

5 hours ago, corta765 said:

Sorry but no I booed and they deserved it. Against one of the two worst teams in football the entire team was a tire fire that took until the 4th quarter to get fixed. Expectations are higher and if you play better it isn’t a problem. But their first half play was straight up embarrassing especially considering the opponent. No one was asking for 55-10 but the game should’ve been over at halftime not trailing to freakin Miami

 

I can see both POV. 

 

In his presser, Allen was asked how he felt about the fans booing the team at halftime.  I thought he had a good perspective in his answer.  He said "we knew we weren't playing up to our standard....our fans, they deserve better, they deserve for us to come out and play like we're supposed to play".  He gave props to Miami's D, but took responsibility.  He had no criticism for the fans.  (it's in his postgame presser, about 1:43 in)

[Buffalo716]

6 hours ago, JoshAllenHasBigHands said:

 

Maybe, but I do know Billsmafia looks like a joke to the outside world. That may not matter to you, and that would be fair, but I find it super embarrassing. 

Boo birds have been around for 100 years. Philly boos santa clause and the eagles

 

If anybody including talking heads took offense to that , their idiots and don't understand the sport because it comes with the territory

 

No football historian would take offense to what happened

 

Just PC talking heads who already shouldn't be listened too

 

 

 

 

[Solomon Grundy]

Hapless, I'm glad I'm not the only one who thinks that Josh be too amped early in the game. I thought he was the same against the Pats. Home games especially 

[Saxum]

17 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

True Dat.  Our lone victory over NE in a meaningful game QB'd by Brady.  September 25, 2011.  34-31 Bills win.

Who was the QB?  Ryan Fitzpatrick.  And he was on fire.  369 passing yards all caught by those all time greats Donald Jones, Stevie Johnson, and David Nelson. 2 TD, no sacks.

 

He did throw 2 picks though ?  but it didn't matter 'cuz Brady threw 4.

 

I've heard Br*dy talk about that game and his pants were yellow!

[NoSaint]

17 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

Joe B Article in the Athletic, paywall

 

It is mostly observations of what went down, some insight on why these things happened

 

- "the Bills offered up a sobering result. It ....raised awareness of problems that a better team would have exploited — areas of concern the team will have to improve by the time their next opponent comes to town "

- "The Bills put together three scoring drives in the first half, but all resulted in field goals and allowed the Dolphins to hang around. Throughout that first half, Allen missed on some throws and looked timid in some decisions. Allen’s first half wound up with an inefficient 6-of-15 passing performance for just 90 yards while taking two sacks. They moved the ball yet sputtered when it mattered most"
- "Like the rest of the team, Allen woke up in the second half and helped the Bills capture the victory. He looked much more poised and finally began to take advantage of the mismatches that littered the field. Allen went 10-of-11 the rest of the way for 112 yards and two touchdowns, an electrifying performance to secure a victory when given the opportunity."

- "Allen had (...) a glorious opportunity [for a deep throw] in the fourth quarter as Andre Roberts got behind the corner and safety with plenty of separation. Allen correctly spotted the win, fired the ball down the field and wound up missing the mark by at least 5 yards. ...In the first half, John Brown burned past Miami cornerback Ryan Lewis in a one-on-one opportunity, and Allen overthrew him. Brown didn’t have a chance to make a play on the ball. It’s an infuriating facet to the 2019 season because Allen, based on his big-armed skill set, should flourish on those low-percentage throws. However, he hasn’t been able to hit on any of them this year"
-Miami exploited Milano's absence by pushing Buffalo into its base defense with Maurice Alexander: "One of the primary players the Dolphins tried to attack was Maurice Alexander. From the Dolphins’ first touchdown drive through their initial possession of the second half, they kept Alexander on the field for 24 of 39 snaps. Alexander was in the wrong place ahead of the snap a couple of times, which signals a small piece of what the Bills lose when they don’t have Milano. Once the play starts, they were without an extremely instinctive off-ball linebacker with supreme reaction time. Alexander had his moments, but Miami mostly took advantage of him until the Bills made their second-half adjustment"

-Buffalo's D significant adjustment in the second half per 'Zo: “One thing I liked that we went to in the second half — we put me off the ball instead of me being on the ball in the first half, so I could at least flow over the top. Because when you’re playing the back edge and I’m on, like, the line of scrimmage, I’m really just a C-gap player sitting there, just kind of being pointless, because they were running a lot of balls away from me. I like that (defensive coordinator Leslie) Frazier took me off and went back to our base-over fronts, where I’m a stacked linebacker. I think that helped as well because then maybe you get an extra guy over the top, and if somebody does misfit it, then we can at least get the guy down before it becomes an explosion play.”

-According to Joe B, Levi Wallace's Bad Day was a result of man coverage: " As the Bills were attempting to find the cure against the run in the first half, part of their early strategy was to sell out and trust their cornerbacks in man-to-man coverage. While it hasn’t been a problem to begin the season, second-year cornerback Levi Wallace struggled with the responsibility against Miami. Wallace is better suited to the Bills’ usual zone coverage, though he’s occasionally flashed as a man defender. The Dolphins started to pick on Wallace a bit, and the cornerback kept allowing the opposition to gain first downs and stay on the field."
 

Joe ends by pointing out that instead of dominating, the Bills provided questions about how other teams could exploit them.

 

My take, having not quite finished a Gamepass review of the first half:

-I think that Miami managed to suss out coverages and techniques that New England used to keep Allen off balance.  I think he was struggling to read the coverage at times and it made him slow to progress and sometimes reluctant to throw.

-TAKE THE FREAKIN' INVISIBILITY CLOAK OFF MOTOR!  On a good handful of plays where either everyone was covered, or Allen seemed uncertain about the coverage, there was Singletary, open and available.  Sure, it's a check-down, but WTF Allen?  He's got speed, he's got moves, and he's paid to run the football.  Hello, would Singletary be a better choice for a checkdown than Lee Smith? 

-However, when I saw this, usually Singletary was on the L side of the field.  Is this somewhere Allen just won't throw?

-There was at least one play where Allen had time and Beasley was open, but the ball practically clocked him.  I think Allen started the game a bit too amped up.

-There were several plays where I think the protections were wrong for the blitz.  I saw this in the Titans game and NE game.  Whoever is responsible for calling the protection (Allen?  Morse?) the Bills have GOT to get this sorted out.

 

And last: Frankly, I wonder if the team overdid a bit the "respect for our opponent" thing with regard to Fitz.  It was obvious that Lee Smith had a man-crush on Fitz.  In his post-game pressure it sounded like Allen had a lot of respect for Fitz.  It was almost as though they took him too seriously, instead of being "Yeah, we'll all pressure him and get in his face and sack him and get him to press and feast on his picks" 

 

I don't know.  Maybe Joe B is correct and they just didn't play with urgency:  " The faster they learn that and play with more urgency at the start of games, the better it is for the remainder of the season. "

I’ll add coming out of a bye week can have erratic results until you have a good pulse on what your team needs. Some rest. Some practice. 

it’s kind of like week 1

 

all that said - it’s always easier to stomach a slow return to the field if you looked sharp before leaving it 

[Saxum]

11 hours ago, wvbillsfan said:

I don’t get the Levi Wallace blurb. I wouldn’t call it a bad game. He gave up a deep ball but on every other pass he was in the WRs hip pocket. Those Miami wrs just used their size. 
 

I’ not sure how good Zach Brown is anymore but he’s got to be better than Mo Alexander. Alexander looked lost. Lost in a way that he didn’t even know where to line up or what his responsibility was. Hard to play that way. 
 

My biggest takeaway from this game....get well soon Matt

Well he was let go by Eagles partially due to his mouth.  Bringing him onto roster would certainly stir up some Eagle players.

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/eagles-release-zach-brown-whos-expected-to-draw-interest-here-are-four-landing-spots/

[Saxum]

7 hours ago, corta765 said:

We look like a joke for the antics we do not booing a crappy first half 

 

No, total joke.

[Big C]

11 hours ago, wvbillsfan said:

I don’t get the Levi Wallace blurb. I wouldn’t call it a bad game. He gave up a deep ball but on every other pass he was in the WRs hip pocket. Those Miami wrs just used their size. 
 

I’ not sure how good Zach Brown is anymore but he’s got to be better than Mo Alexander. Alexander looked lost. Lost in a way that he didn’t even know where to line up or what his responsibility was. Hard to play that way. 
 

My biggest takeaway from this game....get well soon Matt

 

I have not been paying attention to Zach Brown for a while... thought he was still with Washington. I do remember his skill set being pretty close to Milano's, mostly in terms of coverage ability. Maurice Alexander, I thought, was purely a special teams guy. We do need to find a depth player however we can. 

[Saxum]

1 hour ago, Buffalo716 said:

Boo birds have been around for 100 years. Philly boos santa clause and the eagles

 

Yes the Eagle boo birds are what are fans should emulate.  There is a big Eagles fan at work and he said the Eagles won the Superbowl because they were tired of hearing the boos.  He forgot that there were fans booing them returning from Superbowl.  Philadelphia, City of Tough Love.

3 minutes ago, Big C said:

 

I have not been paying attention to Zach Brown for a while... thought he was still with Washington. I do remember his skill set being pretty close to Milano's, mostly in terms of coverage ability. Maurice Alexander, I thought, was purely a special teams guy. We do need to find a depth player however we can. 

 

Zach Brown was signed by Washington for 3 year contract (big mistake), let go after year 2, signed by Eagles and released.

 

					Games		Off. Snaps		Def. Snaps		ST Snaps
Year	Age	Tm	Pos	No.	G	GS	Num	Pct	Num	Pct	Num	Pct
2012	23	TEN	LB	55	16	14	0	0%	742	66%	68	14%
2013	24	TEN	LB	55	16	13	0	0%	757	71%	99	21%
2014	25	TEN	lb	55	1	1	0	0%	4	0%	0	0%
2015	26	TEN	lb	55	16	5	0	0%	490	47%	87	19%
2016*	27	BUF	LB	53	16	16	0	0%	977	91%	127	27%
2017	28	WAS	MLB	53	13	13	0	0%	834	76%	32	7%
2018	29	WAS	MLB	53	16	12	0	0%	703	68%	3	1%
2019	30	PHI	LB	52	6	6	0	0%	270	68%	36	22%

[Big Turk]

12 hours ago, wvbillsfan said:

I don’t get the Levi Wallace blurb. I wouldn’t call it a bad game. He gave up a deep ball but on every other pass he was in the WRs hip pocket. Those Miami wrs just used their size. 
 

I’ not sure how good Zach Brown is anymore but he’s got to be better than Mo Alexander. Alexander looked lost. Lost in a way that he didn’t even know where to line up or what his responsibility was. Hard to play that way. 
 

My biggest takeaway from this game....get well soon Matt

 

He is the 3rd string LB...how much can you really expect from him?

[Dan]

12 hours ago, BillsVet said:

 

It comes down to seeing whether one sees these games as individual events or predictive of the future.  Given how teams employ film study and look to exploit weaknesses, the individual event perspective remains myopic and incapable of looking down the road. 

 

No one can say whether this winning is sustainable.  On one hand, the remaining schedule features teams winning less than 40% of their games.  On the other, Buffalo has, during the past 20 years, had a hard time beating quality teams late in the season.  I'm interested to see how they fare against Philadelphia next week to address that. 

 

 

12 hours ago, BillsMafia13 said:

Gotta disagree, not to be that guy but I am concerned and the picture is bigger than just 5-1.  2 games were definitley aided by the other teams kickers, we should have lost the jets and titans games but got lucky.  The giants game we barely pulled that out too, yesterday we just squeaked by possibly the worst team in history.  

    Its like the bills play to the level of thier competition for 3.5 quarters then turn it on if thier losing. They seem too reactionary and not in control enough. 

I think the issue now is for a seemingly large number of posters here is this team is in a no win situation.   It they win.. as they've done all but once this seasons..  they didn't win by enough, Allen didn't throw for 300 yds, something. But the win just wasn't good enough.  If they lose to the likes of Philly/NE; then it's a a see they're not good enough to compete with the top teams.  If they lose to the Dolphins/Redskins, well they just suck.

 

I guess my point is the Bills, although not perfect, are finding ways to win. They're learning, getting better.  And there's a tone of room for upside.   I'm not saying they'll be the class of the league for the next decade.  But they are doing way better than we've seen in nearly 2 decades. 

[BillsVet]

1 hour ago, Dan said:

 

I think the issue now is for a seemingly large number of posters here is this team is in a no win situation.   It they win.. as they've done all but once this seasons..  they didn't win by enough, Allen didn't throw for 300 yds, something. But the win just wasn't good enough.  If they lose to the likes of Philly/NE; then it's a a see they're not good enough to compete with the top teams.  If they lose to the Dolphins/Redskins, well they just suck.

 

I guess my point is the Bills, although not perfect, are finding ways to win. They're learning, getting better.  And there's a tone of room for upside.   I'm not saying they'll be the class of the league for the next decade.  But they are doing way better than we've seen in nearly 2 decades. 

 

It's not a "no-win situation" in any way.  The matter being discussed is whether the Bills have graduated to the level of being a solid playoff team and one should expect that after 3 off-seasons of adding players with consistency at the coaching level.  

 

This deep into a rebuild, you have to believe a veteran-laden team like Buffalo operating with those same coaches can rip up the bad teams and be competitive against the good ones.  You don't expect them to barely get by against the bottom-feeders and lose close games to the better clubs as frequently as they have.  

 

I think many fans just want to see decisive victories against good teams and are tired of the nail-biters.  Looking through McD's 20 wins as a HC, I see one game where Buffalo dominated from beginning to end and that's last year's Minnesota game.  Sure, they're not getting blown out, but they haven't demonstrated a signature victory save for the one I just mentioned.  

[Dan]

5 hours ago, BillsVet said:

 

It's not a "no-win situation" in any way.  The matter being discussed is whether the Bills have graduated to the level of being a solid playoff team and one should expect that after 3 off-seasons of adding players with consistency at the coaching level.  

 

This deep into a rebuild, you have to believe a veteran-laden team like Buffalo operating with those same coaches can rip up the bad teams and be competitive against the good ones.  You don't expect them to barely get by against the bottom-feeders and lose close games to the better clubs as frequently as they have.  

 

I think many fans just want to see decisive victories against good teams and are tired of the nail-biters.  Looking through McD's 20 wins as a HC, I see one game where Buffalo dominated from beginning to end and that's last year's Minnesota game.  Sure, they're not getting blown out, but they haven't demonstrated a signature victory save for the one I just mentioned.  

I don't completely disagree. It would definitely be nice to see them win more convincingly against certain teams.   I'm not convinced McD has that killer instinct, but I do think we have to acknowledge that the offensive side of the ball is really in year 1 of the rebuild.  

 

They very clearly focused on the defense, allowing the offense to languish for a couple years.  This past offseason they finally addressed it with a complete makeover of players.  That's why I tend to be a bit forgiving  with their mistakes and miscues through the first 6 games playing together. 

 

I dont think we really know how serious of a playoff team they're going to be yet.  It does appear that we'll get our chance this year.  Hopefully, the coaches and players will learn quite a bit between now and then.  At that point I'll feel more comfortable talking about them as a playoff team. At this point, I think they're still learning how to win in the regular season. Fortunately they're figuring that out, the blowout losses at least appear to be gone.  Next, perhaps they start to blow teams out in wins.