IDBillzFan Posted October 16, 2019 Posted October 16, 2019 2 minutes ago, SCBills said: Are we sure those 1st rounders will be "very late". It doesn't matter if they're late picks or not. Two first round picks for Ramsey is ridiculous. He's not going to help Goth throw more than 78 yards in a game like he did vs. SF. 2
PetermansRedemption Posted October 16, 2019 Posted October 16, 2019 8 minutes ago, IDBillzFan said: It doesn't matter if they're late picks or not. Two first round picks for Ramsey is ridiculous. He's not going to help Goth throw more than 78 yards in a game like he did vs. SF. UNLESS Jalen Ramsey is ? The Next McVay
Chicken Boo Posted October 16, 2019 Posted October 16, 2019 1 hour ago, SCBills said: Are we sure those 1st rounders will be "very late". NFC is tough and they're currently 2 games back of San Fran and Seattle in their own division. Nevermind the fact they have a ton of money tied up in two guys with the jury out on their ability... Goff/Gurley. Gurley's ability isn't in question. His availability, however, is. Goff is a very good QB, but falls in line with about 85% of the QBs in the league, in that he needs to be aided by a strong running game. There are currently maybe 4 QBs in the league who can carry a team (Wilson, Mahomes, Rodgers, Watson?)
Rochesterfan Posted October 16, 2019 Posted October 16, 2019 4 hours ago, thenorthremembers said: Not sure the Rams were fleeced. Goff withstanding, of the 5 1st round picks they gave up they have 2 Pro Bowl/All Pro Level players. They used the draft picks, just not on draft night. Depends on how you want to build your team. But I think using 5 1st rounders and getting a starting QB, a #1 wide out, and a All Pro Cornerback in return is kind of a high rate of success. If you look at the Bills last five 1st rounders would you prefer what the Bills have or the Rams: Bills: Ed Oliver, Josh Allen, Tremaine Edmunds, Tre White, and Shaq Lawson Rams: Jalen Ramsey, Brandin Cooks, and Jared Goff I'd still take the Bills but it's not an easy choice. The problem as I see it is not with either the player or the return - it is where in the the contract the player is and how your team is made. Ramsey being in the last year of his contract and wanting (as he has stated) to be the top paid CB puts a ton of pressure on the front office to make that happen. They already have the highest paid DT, RB, and QB for next year and one of the highest paid WRs. Add to that 17-20 million for a CB and you will potentially have 5 guys taking up 112+ million of your salary cap next year. That is close to 60% of your cap space on 5 guys. ? They also have a ton of FAs that they will potentially lose after the season and part of their decline this year (and yes they have declined from last year - some what significantly) was the loss of O-Line and D-Line talent due to paying their other top players. I think realistically they have this year and they are good enough to make a run, but with their recent struggles and losing 2 division games and a 3rd NFC game - it looks like a long road to get into and win again this year. Then they lose more quality players and depth and even with top end talent they will begin to decline faster and faster. I get the sentiment of the Rams got talent in the trades, but the NFL is about the team and team is about more than 5-6 guys taking up most of your cap. 1
thenorthremembers Posted October 16, 2019 Posted October 16, 2019 25 minutes ago, Rochesterfan said: The problem as I see it is not with either the player or the return - it is where in the the contract the player is and how your team is made. Ramsey being in the last year of his contract and wanting (as he has stated) to be the top paid CB puts a ton of pressure on the front office to make that happen. They already have the highest paid DT, RB, and QB for next year and one of the highest paid WRs. Add to that 17-20 million for a CB and you will potentially have 5 guys taking up 112+ million of your salary cap next year. That is close to 60% of your cap space on 5 guys. ? They also have a ton of FAs that they will potentially lose after the season and part of their decline this year (and yes they have declined from last year - some what significantly) was the loss of O-Line and D-Line talent due to paying their other top players. I think realistically they have this year and they are good enough to make a run, but with their recent struggles and losing 2 division games and a 3rd NFC game - it looks like a long road to get into and win again this year. Then they lose more quality players and depth and even with top end talent they will begin to decline faster and faster. I get the sentiment of the Rams got talent in the trades, but the NFL is about the team and team is about more than 5-6 guys taking up most of your cap. I took this on a few pages back. With the cap going up next year they can afford it. They have Ramsey's 5th year option for next year. If they dont like what Goff and Gurley are doing by 2021, they can get out of both contracts cheap and save close to 80 million or so against the cap over the next three years. Ramsey wont need a new contract until 2021.
Rochesterfan Posted October 16, 2019 Posted October 16, 2019 1 minute ago, thenorthremembers said: I took this on a few pages back. With the cap going up next year they can afford it. They have Ramsey's 5th year option for next year. If they dont like what Goff and Gurley are doing by 2021, they can get out of both contracts cheap and save close to 80 million or so against the cap over the next three years. Ramsey wont need a new contract until 2021. You honestly believe that Ramsey- who has made it clear (see Brinks truck) - will play on the 5th year option? I do not see anyway when he just forced his way out of Jacksonville by skipping games with a “bad back” that he suddenly is ok with the option year. So that really leaves the Rams paying him or trading him ala Bell. I could easily see him waiting to sign his option - then claiming bad back issues and sitting out the year to force a new contract. He has already shown himself to be a me first player. Yes they can get out of Gurley and Goff’s contracts in 2021 with still dead cap hits and no 1st RD picks in 2020 or 1st and 4th in 2021 - meaning they have no way to replace them. The Rams are stuck in a win this year window because even as the cap goes up - so does the cost of retaining and bringing in players and you have traded away the cheapest way of replacing them. 1 1
Rochesterfan Posted October 16, 2019 Posted October 16, 2019 16 minutes ago, thenorthremembers said: I took this on a few pages back. With the cap going up next year they can afford it. They have Ramsey's 5th year option for next year. If they dont like what Goff and Gurley are doing by 2021, they can get out of both contracts cheap and save close to 80 million or so against the cap over the next three years. Ramsey wont need a new contract until 2021. In reality with dead cap hit - only Cooks is a potential out in 2021. Gurley and Donald are really locked in until 2022 and Goff is 2023 before the dead cap is really acceptable. This is the team for the next couple of years and if Ramsey isn’t gong to get paid then I will be shocked because that is all he talked about before the season began. Even if he does play on the option those 5 players still account for 109 million of a 200 million cap - they are going to lose a lot of good depth after this year.
ColoradoBills Posted October 16, 2019 Posted October 16, 2019 10 minutes ago, Rochesterfan said: You honestly believe that Ramsey- who has made it clear (see Brinks truck) - will play on the 5th year option? I do not see anyway when he just forced his way out of Jacksonville by skipping games with a “bad back” that he suddenly is ok with the option year. So that really leaves the Rams paying him or trading him ala Bell. I could easily see him waiting to sign his option - then claiming bad back issues and sitting out the year to force a new contract. He has already shown himself to be a me first player. Yes they can get out of Gurley and Goff’s contracts in 2021 with still dead cap hits and no 1st RD picks in 2020 or 1st and 4th in 2021 - meaning they have no way to replace them. The Rams are stuck in a win this year window because even as the cap goes up - so does the cost of retaining and bringing in players and you have traded away the cheapest way of replacing them. Excellent points. I also want to let people know that the 20 million cap # includes a 10 million in a cap raise. Rams have a number of players in FA to re-sign/replace next year too. This whole debate is about how teams (GMs and HCs) want to build a team. Buying "proven" players and shelling out big money on a handful of players has been tried many times before with varying degrees of success. Will it work out for the Rams now one knows yet. It could and then it could cause future problems. For my money I believe that a more methodical approach along with an occasional big name trade/signing is the way to go. I doubt Beane and company believe the Rams method is correct for their situation.
plenzmd1 Posted October 16, 2019 Posted October 16, 2019 Sorry if this has been mentioned before, but i really think this trade came down to Marrone or Ramsey..and man I am sure ole Tommy not happy with this answer
Gugny Posted October 16, 2019 Posted October 16, 2019 Coughlin is a dinosaur and the Jags are idiots for continuing to employ him.
london_bills Posted October 16, 2019 Posted October 16, 2019 21 hours ago, KingBoots8 said: Wayyyyyyyyy too much. Sorry, but I just could not justify that heavy a price. He’s good but he’s a distraction and he’s beatable. You spend that on a QB, or a Left Tackle to protect your QB. Thank God he isn’t coming here. 1st and a 4th max! 1
OldTimeAFLGuy Posted October 16, 2019 Posted October 16, 2019 ...pretty BIG tariff for a potential one year rental...didn't someone post Rams may not have a 1st round pick for FIVE years?......
TheFunPolice Posted October 16, 2019 Posted October 16, 2019 Rams are going to crash and burn, and I am going to laugh. McVay is overrated. Someone has to say it. His vaunted offense was a total no-show in the Super Bowl. Yet he's still a "genius." Everyone loves to bash and mock Andy Reid, but his offense scored 31 points in the AFC Title Game vs NE and Belichick, all in the 2nd half showing he made adjustments. McVay just stood there like a zombie and watched his offense get curb stomped. At least show up and take a swing. No shame in losing to NE and BB, but at least do something. 1
PetermansRedemption Posted October 16, 2019 Posted October 16, 2019 The important question, is Ramsey’s back injury career ending?
CommonCents Posted October 16, 2019 Posted October 16, 2019 7 minutes ago, PetermansRedemption said: The important question, is Ramsey’s back injury career ending? I’d guess he plays Sunday.
CommonCents Posted October 16, 2019 Posted October 16, 2019 I’m not sure in what depth this has been discussed but the trade isn’t about the Rams or Ramsey. This is another situation where the player decided he wanted to play elsewhere and was granted his wish. I can deal with terrible officials, the pussification of the game and Tom Brady. I can’t deal with the NFL mirroring the NBA and letting the players control the league. I’m a Redskins fan, let big Trent sit there and rot.
PetermansRedemption Posted October 17, 2019 Posted October 17, 2019 1 hour ago, CommonCents said: I’d guess he plays Sunday. Oh for sure. His “injury” was magically cured when he was traded. Better doctors in LA I guess ? 1
Orlando Buffalo Posted October 17, 2019 Posted October 17, 2019 1 hour ago, TheFunPolice said: Rams are going to crash and burn, and I am going to laugh. McVay is overrated. Someone has to say it. His vaunted offense was a total no-show in the Super Bowl. Yet he's still a "genius." Everyone loves to bash and mock Andy Reid, but his offense scored 31 points in the AFC Title Game vs NE and Belichick, all in the 2nd half showing he made adjustments. McVay just stood there like a zombie and watched his offense get curb stomped. At least show up and take a swing. No shame in losing to NE and BB, but at least do something. I actually think Mcvay is a good coach with a bottom 5 starting QB who he coached up. But no coach in the NFL can win with a QB who throws 78 yards so he either hides the defects of his QB again or he will be done.
Recommended Posts