Over 29 years of fanhood Posted October 6, 2019 Posted October 6, 2019 Wade Phillips never has been and never will be head coaching material... that is all 1
Alphadawg7 Posted October 6, 2019 Posted October 6, 2019 It wasn’t a forward pass. People need to move on. And I agree with OP, we weren’t winning another game that year even if we won that game. We were not a great football team. I was screaming at the TV to cover the other side of the field as you could totally see it developing, but nope, we lost it because basically most our entire ST ran to one side of the field. That being said, I hope we crush them today.
BuffaloMatt Posted October 6, 2019 Posted October 6, 2019 I vomit every time I think of it. Visceral response.
RevWarRifleman Posted October 6, 2019 Posted October 6, 2019 Bills would have won if Flutie started that game. He had way better pocket-presence than Johnson, and had the ability to make things happen when plays broke down. I believe more points would have been scored if he was in and at the time, Bills had a Super Bowl calibre defense. Bills offense was never explosive with Johnson in because he was slow with his reads when the ball was snapped. It's all water under the bridge now after all these years. But that's my 2 cents.
Sammy Watkins' Rib Posted October 6, 2019 Posted October 6, 2019 3 hours ago, fansince88 said: I was 29 and still had all my hair. My wife was pregnant for the daughter I walked down the isle a couple months ago. I have put this waaaaay behind me and refuse to ever relive that week again. Cool timeline. But how are you only a fan since '88? I'm a fan since about '90 when I was six and must be about 15 years younger than yourself.
Drunken Pygmy Goat Posted October 6, 2019 Posted October 6, 2019 1 hour ago, JMF2006 said: Are Flutie Flakes a cure for ED ? Eat them now, and you may never have a stiffy again. 1
ALLEN1QB Posted October 6, 2019 Posted October 6, 2019 1 hour ago, JMF2006 said: There wasn't a happier person in the universe than me when Titans came up a yard short in the Super Bowl. Not exactly instant karma but that one yard came back to bite them in the butt Are Flutie Flakes a cure for ED ? If anyone eats a box of those old Flutie flakes I guarantee you ED will be the least of their worries. 1
Beast Posted October 6, 2019 Posted October 6, 2019 That day, The Freak was the best player in the field and it wasn't even close. The Bills got jobbed. Nothing more to say.
Drunken Pygmy Goat Posted October 6, 2019 Posted October 6, 2019 19 minutes ago, RevWarRifleman said: Bills would have won if Flutie started that game. He had way better pocket-presence than Johnson, and had the ability to make things happen when plays broke down. I believe more points would have been scored if he was in and at the time, Bills had a Super Bowl calibre defense. Bills offense was never explosive with Johnson in because he was slow with his reads when the ball was snapped. It's all water under the bridge now after all these years. But that's my 2 cents. Hindsight opinion. Flutie likely would have been better, but the Titans have a much different defensive gameplan if Flutie plays. We'll never know the answer...
dlonce Posted October 6, 2019 Posted October 6, 2019 I wasn't t 15 at the time I was an adult with kids. I’ve watched that game over and over and DVRd it last night. The Bills were not the lesser team. We had a much better defense. The issues came from Ralph Wilson forcing Wade to start the human sack machine. If Flutie plays we win that game easily and I am fairly sure we go the the SB that year. The decision to kick short is one that haunts me forever. I have no clue why and the Titans were set up for it. lastly, it was a forward lateral.
Drunken Pygmy Goat Posted October 6, 2019 Posted October 6, 2019 14 minutes ago, Sammy Watkins' Rib said: Cool timeline. But how are you only a fan since '88? I'm a fan since about '90 when I was six and must be about 15 years younger than yourself. I'm not one to ever question a person's famdom, as there are no rules to how or why. My earliest memory was the 51-3 thrashing of the Raiders when I was 6. Been a fan ever since
Sammy Watkins' Rib Posted October 6, 2019 Posted October 6, 2019 2 minutes ago, Drunken Pygmy Goat said: I'm not one to ever question a person's famdom, as there are no rules to how or why. My earliest memory was the 51-3 thrashing of the Raiders when I was 6. Been a fan ever since I agree. Just curious as to how and when we become fans. My becoming a Bills fans was total luck or unluck as I like to mock it sometimes as I have spent all of my life in California with no relations to Buffalo. Dad just casually got into betting on the Bills during the start of the glory years and I've been hooked ever since. And of course Dad now hardly follows the Bills at all but does consider them his team. Just not a die hard fan like my brother and I were sucked into.
Bob in STL Posted October 6, 2019 Posted October 6, 2019 2 hours ago, JohnnyGold said: After 20 years, I can honestly say I have no idea if it was forward or not. As a Bills fan, I can see it moving forward based on where the body positions of the players were when it was thrown and caught. As an objective observer, I can see it moving laterally based on where the ball was released and caught. I think the simplest way to phrase it is, let's say you meet the creator himself and ask him if it was a forward pass: he would say "yes, the ball moved forward an inch, but I would have made Dyson catch a 90 yard hail marry on the next play anyways and I had a famine to mitigate at 4pm that day so I had to move on, make yourself at home, Ralph's at the bar." Yes, that is a simple way to look at it. I am sure "the creator" was very busy fixing football games that day.
TheBrownBear Posted October 6, 2019 Posted October 6, 2019 We out gained them and held them to under 200 total yards of offense. Rob Johnson (who I am no fan of lol) outplayed McNair, who was atrocious and finished with 55 yards passing on 24 attempts. We were terrible in the first half but basically dominated the second half with our ground game and some clutch plays by Johnson (remember the shoeless play to Peerless?). Overall, we played a good hard clutch game for 59:30. 1
Nuncha Posted October 6, 2019 Posted October 6, 2019 (edited) 4 hours ago, Dopey said: Rob Johnson took us on the " game winning" drive but... That team definitely could have reached the SB. They had the number 2 defense in the NFL that year. Had they won that game it is very possible they go to the super bowl. Tennessee went and we had them beat until one stupid play changed it. We could use a WR like Eric Moulds on this roster right now. Hopefully Duke Williams can become similar to Moulds - keeping my fingers crossed. Edited October 6, 2019 by Azucho98
Billsfan1972 Posted October 6, 2019 Posted October 6, 2019 Again Rob Johnson was PATHETIC that game and tired of the Chuck Dickerson contingent who claims "He walked off the field a winner". Johnson was the sole reason Tennessee was in the game. After that first half, there would not have been a single HC in football who wouldn't have put in the QB who started the first 15 games of the season to start that second half. RW was a senile old coot by then & made the decision to start him that game. Can't convince me otherwise. Anyone defending Rob Johnson (and we saw his body of work afterwards too) are probably on here now rationalizing how Barkley gives the Bills the best chance to win.....?? 1
jethro_tull Posted October 6, 2019 Posted October 6, 2019 4 hours ago, JohnnyGold said: Like most Bills fans my age, I've spent the last 2 decades convinced that Buffalo had a Lombardi trophy ripped from their hands that day, with a terrible call on what was clearly a forward lateral. I vividly remember watching that game and being absolutely devastated when they lost--I was 15 at the time, and it was right up there with Jim Kelly's retirement following the Jacksonville loss as my most disappointing sports moment. Re-watching the game in it's entirety last night didn't necessarily change my view on the throwback, but it put the entire contest in a better context. Here are my thoughts from it (in no particular order ) 1) The Tennessee Titans were a VERY GOOD football team. Somehow, 15 year old me didn't understand this at the time. (In fact, it makes me wonder how many posters on here may be 15 years old and also missing this point about last week's Patriots game, but I digress) The Titans went into that game 13-3, which as they stated during the broadcast was the best record for a wildcard team in history. This was also a point in NFL history when the conferences only had 3 divisions, so the division winner ahead of the Titans, the Jaguars, were even better at 14-2. Buffalo has had only two 13 win seasons in their history, and both times made the Super Bowl--the Titans obviously made the Super Bowl that season. The Titans had young talent all over the field: Air McNair at QB, Eddie George at RB, "the Freak" Jeavon Kearse on D. They had stars, they had a great regular season, and they were a yard away from winning the Super Bowl. What's more, this season marked their arrival as a franchise, and they entered a period of dominance for the next 5 years where they would have campaigns of 11, 12, and 13 wins again, making it as far as the conference championship game. Buffalo, on the other hand, went from this loss to one of the longest runs of futility in NFL history, missing the playoffs for 18 straight seasons. 2) The Buffalo Bills were a team in complete disarray. This was the death of their "dynasty", or at least their years of being a contender, and the self destruction was on complete display. Maybe because those guys were my heroes I was oblivious to it at the time. Maybe the lack of social media/24 hour news cycles didn't catastrophize their collapse as it surely would today. Whatever the case, that Bills team had issues, from top to bottom. As we learned years later, it was Ralph who insisted Johnson get the start over Flutie. Knowing that, it was interesting to hear the response of Wade Phillips when asked by Solomon Wilcox at halftime if he would bench Johnson for Flutie: quote "he said something to me that I can't repeat on TV, but it wasn't very nice." That's not a response you hear from McDermott very often, right? Then there was Andre Reed, who had apparently posted on his website a few days earlier that he felt disrespected and wanted to go to a team that appreciated him. Playing with that hanging over his head would be one thing, but he also wasn't on speaking terms with Flutie, who he said had changed as a man over the course of the previous year. Hmmm... I had never heard that--but it puts the benching into a new context. 3) Bruce Smith was the best player on the field, he's the all time sack leader, and the best Bill of all time I wish I was old enough to appreciate that man's career. Seeing highlights of the greats doesn't do them justice, you need to see them on every play dominate a game. And boy, that's what Bruce did. A pure physical freak. At one point spun around the O lineman and got pressure on McNair with a move that would be replayed 10 times today, but was just a typical play for him in that game. Maybe younger me took it for granted that he was a Bill, or didn't realize how good he was compared to the rest of the league, or hadn't watched enough football yet to appreciate it, or all of the above, but wow. If the rest of his career looked like that (and I'd be willing to bet it was better), you could make a case that he's one of the 10 best players to ever play professional football. Am I crazy for saying that? 4) The Buffalo Bills were sloppy that day, the Titans were disciplined. The Titans didn't commit their first penalty until well into the second half, the Bills were jumping off sides with reckless abandon from the opening gun. This isn't a conspiracy theory either, in that the refs weren't calling it both ways. No, the Bills had 2, 3, maybe 4 defensive linemen literally jumping off sides anticipating snap counts. At one point Bruce ran across the LOS, made no attempt to get back and negated an Eddie George fumble. There was an egregious holding call ON THE DEFENSE of a field goal attempt that the Titans missed going into the half--they then made the retry. Obviously, every defender was out of position on the Homerun Throwback. Hey, I can say with confidence from posting here: If a McDermott team showed up to a playoff game like this---it would be a long offseason on here. 5) The Titans were a better team, and played a much (much) better game. First: Rob Johnson was terrible. Absolutely, unequivocally awful. I don't know what his final stats were and it doesn't matter. He didn't throw a single pass with zip, with touch, or with accuracy. He didn't move the ball all day. Both touchdowns were the results of the ground game and field position. Were people open? I have no idea. But it was, maybe, the worst performance from a Bills QB that I have ever seen. Second: McNair didn't do much better, but their ground game was significantly better than ours. They were picking up big chunks with ease. Yes, their drives stalled (often), but they had bursts and "the momentum" for almost the entire game. They didn't protect the football well, and turned it over a bunch (some negated by Bills penalties), but they moved the chains and scored the ball all day. Many here hang on to the notion that that Bills defense was elite--Super Bowl worthy, even, but the Titans D outclassed us that day. 6) The Universe righted itself with that Homerun Throwback--it was almost cosmically right. Not a pox on our house, but fair just dues for the Titans. There's no other way to put it. I don't mean to sound like I believe in Atlantis, but that Homerun Throwback almost had to happen. When the greatest comeback ever took place, Buffalo was the better team than the Oilers, and how would we have felt if they nailed a field goal in overtime to beat us? Terrible right? The same could be said if Christies "game winner" bounced the Titans from the playoffs that year. They were the better team. They played better all day. They dominated us. They deserved to win for all of the above reasons, and that was their season to make the Super Bowl. We can dissect the rest of the conference for the rest of our lives: would the Bills have beaten the Colts the next weekend? The Jaguars? Even the Rams in the Super Bowl? What I finally came to the realization of last night is: it doesn't matter, because they DIDN'T beat the Titans, and didn't deserve to! The Titans were the better team, and beat the Bills all day long up and down the field. Somehow, someway, the Bills took the lead, for about 6 seconds of game time, and then lost it in historic fashion again--but they never should have had the lead to begin with, really. more of So there it is. Sorry if I need to hand in my fan card after this, but I have to admit, it's nice to make peace with that loss. Watching it again, after 20 years of accumulated football knowledge, makes me see it the way the rest of the NFL has seen it. A great play for the Titans in the context of their Super Bowl run. As a Bills fan, I've always viewed it as emblematic of the curse on our franchise, and a day when we were robbed of what may have been a championship season. But it's not that. We were simply a dysfunctional wild card team that got outcoached and outplayed on the road, and lost to a better team in heartbreaking fashion. Oh well. Life goes on. not exactly the kind of summary i was anticipating.. kind of a double downer.
fansince88 Posted October 6, 2019 Posted October 6, 2019 2 hours ago, Sammy Watkins' Rib said: Cool timeline. But how are you only a fan since '88? I'm a fan since about '90 when I was six and must be about 15 years younger than yourself. Because I didnt really choose a team till 88. Originally from Long Island and was more of a Baseball fan growing up. Friend was a Giants fan and would watch football with him every sunday after Church around 81 on. His family was Giants fans and they were from Jersey. Fast foward to 88 I decided I would choose the only NYS team. Of course the rest of the story would be I watched the SB against the Giants with my friend from those years. Clear it up? 1
jethro_tull Posted October 6, 2019 Posted October 6, 2019 just replayed the srewacle on the game. it was so obviously a forward pass i cant believe it there is no making anything right with a wrong call like that.
RevWarRifleman Posted October 6, 2019 Posted October 6, 2019 2 hours ago, Drunken Pygmy Goat said: Hindsight opinion. Flutie likely would have been better, but the Titans have a much different defensive gameplan if Flutie plays. We'll never know the answer... Actually it wasn't hindsight opinion. That's how I felt at the time based on watching all Bills games that season prior to MCM. Watching our offense with Johnson at qb was like watching paint dry. 3 & outs after 3 & outs and only about 14 to 17 points scored by the end of 3 quarters. Moreover, Johnson was getting pummeled in the back- field repeatedly all season long because they knew he was slow reading his progressions.
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