Trogdor Posted September 30, 2019 Posted September 30, 2019 4 minutes ago, Juice_32 said: Project is your word, not mine. Project QB's are taken in the late rounds. Raw but talented? How about Mahomes? Show me the scouting report that called him a finished product...I'll wait. Mahomes was a far superior QB in college. He isn't a finished product either, but he still looks miles ahead at this point. Allen, while more talented, was the third best QB in his conference at Wyoming. Ironically they also had a top defense and struggled.
Mark80 Posted September 30, 2019 Posted September 30, 2019 Guy has a bad game against the best defense in football...or at least top 3 with us and the Bears. Yeah, lets bring out the pitchforks. Brilliant. 1
jrober38 Posted September 30, 2019 Posted September 30, 2019 Allen's biggest problem is that he's so inefficient. His career QB rating is currently 68.4. This year, he's the 33rd ranked QB in the NFL among qualified passers. We're 3-1, but it's really hard to win when you have bottom of the barrel QB play like that.
auburnbillsbacker Posted September 30, 2019 Posted September 30, 2019 I really wish he had the opportunity to finish the game. He has been clutch late.
Trogdor Posted September 30, 2019 Posted September 30, 2019 3 minutes ago, Pirate Angel said: He just needs to take a sack, throw, it away, or throw it in the dirt instead of gambling and throwing picks. Also Everytime we pass he is in shotgun formation, now that does help a young QB see the field but it also telegraphs that your passing. Recall all the reverse and flips to TEs and Wrs that were effective against Cinci...runs out of the shotgun against a team that was in pass defense. Now belicheck with much better safety's bring players closer to the line and retreat into pass protection which allows for more speed closer to the line nullyfying those types of plays. The first pick Josh locked on to John brown assuming he had him 1 on 1 and didn't see the safety playing deep. The sacks have been just as bad. He ruined field position a couple times by taking sacks after back peddling for a while. It was something like 35 yards lost just off of sacks. Is there time to turn things around? Absolutely, but this whole board is in apologist mode. He looked bad all on his own enough that it's not just team struggles. He has 5 fumbles 6 interceptions and he needs to clean that up.
oldmanfan Posted September 30, 2019 Posted September 30, 2019 3 minutes ago, jrober38 said: Allen's biggest problem is that he's so inefficient. His career QB rating is currently 68.4. This year, he's the 33rd ranked QB in the NFL among qualified passers. We're 3-1, but it's really hard to win when you have bottom of the barrel QB play like that. Says the supposed QB expert who wanted to trade an entire draft for Winston.
McBean Posted September 30, 2019 Posted September 30, 2019 Yes, the Josh Allen stock went down significantly in my eyes yesterday. Still holding it though but with less optimism.
oldmanfan Posted September 30, 2019 Posted September 30, 2019 1 minute ago, Trogdor said: The sacks have been just as bad. He ruined field position a couple times by taking sacks after back peddling for a while. It was something like 35 yards lost just off of sacks. Is there time to turn things around? Absolutely, but this whole board is in apologist mode. He looked bad all on his own enough that it's not just team struggles. He has 5 fumbles 6 interceptions and he needs to clean that up. This entire board is not in apologist mode and to say so is beyond absurd. Many here, including myself, have pointed out that he played bad yesterday, and that he has got to start playing smarter and not make the same mistake over and over.
jrober38 Posted September 30, 2019 Posted September 30, 2019 2 minutes ago, oldmanfan said: Says the supposed QB expert who wanted to trade an entire draft for Winston. I'm just posting the facts. Sorry they upset you so much.
JoshAllenHasBigHands Posted September 30, 2019 Posted September 30, 2019 Fans are so stupid. The Pats defense has done this to every QB they have played in the last 10 games, and BB's specialty is doing exactly this against young QBs. If it were the Jets or the Giants that did this to JA, I would be worried. This is a giant nothingburger. Josh has shown progression. Unfortunately, everyone takes steps back. That doesn't change the career arc. 1 2
prissythecat Posted September 30, 2019 Posted September 30, 2019 So basically its time to Tank for Tua? 1
Ridgewaycynic2013 Posted September 30, 2019 Posted September 30, 2019 27 minutes ago, SoTier said: Here are the first round QBs since 2001 so you don't miss some first round "project QB" who actually developed into a good/great QB... 2010 - Sam Bradford, Tim Tebow... 2018 - Baker Mayfield, Sam Darnold, Josh Allen, Josh Allen, Lamar Jackson 2018: Allen twice, but no Rosen?! Hate crimes! 2010: Tim Tebow: For many, the equivalent of saying ‘Randolph Scott’ in ‘Blazing Saddles’.
oldmanfan Posted September 30, 2019 Posted September 30, 2019 4 minutes ago, jrober38 said: I'm just posting the facts. Sorry they upset you so much. Sorrry you think you're some QB expert that only shows his face around here when there's a loss. 1
Ridgewaycynic2013 Posted September 30, 2019 Posted September 30, 2019 Just now, prissythecat said: So basically its time to Tank for Tua? Around here it might be ‘Trade for Tua’.
Drunken Pygmy Goat Posted September 30, 2019 Posted September 30, 2019 1 hour ago, Nihilarian said: Now look what happened in the 2nd half, Allen went 6-6 while scoring a TD on a defense that hadn't allowed an offensive TD this season previously! If Allen doesn't get injured my take is he takes the team to a comeback win! It truly is embarrassing how quickly some Bills fans jump off the bandwagon and complain endlessly about a young QB with not even a full season under his belt. The Bills offense just went against the very best defense in the NFL, the SB champs who beat the Chiefs in last years AFC Champ game. The opening drive in the 2nd half was also high tempo, no-huddle. It was a good strategy that seemed to catch the **Pats off guard. But the key was that Allen started taking what the defense gave him, as opposed to forcing the ball downfield on low percentage throws. It was similar to how the Bills started the game in week 1 against the Jets. But after that, he seemed to revert back a bit to what was killing the team in the 1st half. It's ok to criticize if it's warranted. After yesterday's game it is warranted. BUT putting Allen is so many positions for mistakes to possibly happen was also part of the problem...really, the root of it. So it wasn't all on Allen, IMO, yet from most fans, he gets all the blame. Yeah, he does need to learn from and correct those mistakes, but as fans, we also need to understand where this team is in it's development, and allow them the time to do it. It's not just about this year, its about the next 10+. Most people have the right idea though: if we're seeing these issues in about 9 or 10 weeks, then we'll be concerned, because it's the long term ramifications that they're looking at. I feel confident in saying that if Allen doesn't get taken out, the Bills win the game, but we just don't know. We've seen it in a couple games already this year, but not against that team and that defense. Barkley nearly did what we think Allen would have done, but fell just short. And once again, that's despite multiple turnovers (and a special teams TD), nearly won the game against that team. Some Bills fans can be extremely annoying...
skibum Posted September 30, 2019 Posted September 30, 2019 I never established a lot of faith in him to begin with. The inaccuracy problem is real. He rarely throws with anticipation, he misses open guys on long and short throws, and he rarely gives receivers an opportunity to run after the catch. He has not shown that he can "make all the throws", not by a long shot. His performance yesterday made me wonder if he even has the capacity to learn from his mistakes. All week long he was talking about cleaning up those bad decisions, the up-for-grabs throws off the back foot under pressure. And he went and did it even more this week. At 16 games in, I don't question his will, his leadership, etc. But his throwing ability and decision making have not improved at all. 1
Trogdor Posted September 30, 2019 Posted September 30, 2019 15 minutes ago, oldmanfan said: This entire board is not in apologist mode and to say so is beyond absurd. Many here, including myself, have pointed out that he played bad yesterday, and that he has got to start playing smarter and not make the same mistake over and over. I definitely exaggerated and I appreciate being called on it. There just seems to be an overwhelming push to absolve him here. There is even a group who thinks BB took a hit out on Allen because he was somehow worried about him. When Tyrod looked like this there wasn't nearly as many conspiracy theories, or maybe there were and I don't remember.
HappyDays Posted September 30, 2019 Posted September 30, 2019 9 minutes ago, JoshAllenHasBigHands said: Fans are so stupid. The Pats defense has done this to every QB they have played in the last 10 games, and BB's specialty is doing exactly this against young QBs. If it were the Jets or the Giants that did this to JA, I would be worried. This is a giant nothingburger. Josh has shown progression. Unfortunately, everyone takes steps back. That doesn't change the career arc. I don't think the Pat's defense caused Allen to lose his mechanics and throw ducks all over the field. The first two passes of the game he didn't set his feet right and missed easy short completions. His 2nd pick of the game should have been a TD. He badly underthrown a wide open Zay Jones. There was that pass where the broadcast showed John Brown wide open over the middle. I don't mind that Allen threw to Beasley there - he was the first progression and he was in single coverage with a step on his defender. The problem is Allen, again, overthrew the pass. He was off all day long. What happened to checking the ball down? I don't remember Allen doing that once yesterday. The Pats begged him to run backwards every time they crashed the pocket and he obliged every time. There's so much from this game he did wrong. 3
oldmanfan Posted September 30, 2019 Posted September 30, 2019 Just now, Trogdor said: I definitely exaggerated and I appreciate being called on it. There just seems to be an overwhelming push to absolve him here. There is even a group who thinks BB took a hit out on Allen because he was somehow worried about him. When Tyrod looked like this there wasn't nearly as many conspiracy theories, or maybe there were and I don't remember. I don't think BB put out a hit on Allen. It was a dirty hit and the guy should have gotten thrown out, but some folks around here take things to an absurd extreme at times. Allen had a bad game yesterday. There is no logical way to deny that. I think the kid will be the guy for years to come, but he has to get it through his head that he doesn't have to win every game by himself, that he has to make a big play to win. At times you see him get that, like in the first three games where he brought them back, and yesterday in the TD drive where he took what the defense gave him. But he also tries to do too much, as we saw in the first half yesterday. If I were Daboll I would have him do nothing but watch Brady films to get when to throw it away, when to check down, etc.
CodeMonkey Posted September 30, 2019 Posted September 30, 2019 (edited) I have not lost faith. He is the same now as he was in college. Same strengths, and same weaknesses. Early this season he showed signs he was "getting it" and not making the stupid plays. That came crashing down yesterday. Some say that's how he was in college, how he is now, and how he will always be. If those people are correct, his career as a starter will be short lived. If he turns it around somehow, he could be something special. Edited September 30, 2019 by CodeMonkey 1
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