Orlando Buffalo Posted October 1, 2019 Posted October 1, 2019 I still full hope in him but no faith beyond he is a gamer and has the cojones to go for big plays when needed. Anyone who has faith in a QB like him is crazy- I hope to have faith in 2 more years. 1
LSHMEAB Posted October 1, 2019 Posted October 1, 2019 5 hours ago, C.Biscuit97 said: Are people really trying to pretend Mahomes just isn’t awesome? His LT is out too. Great qbs raise up the level of the players around them. Qbs who aren’t good enough get bailed out by excuses like they don’t have enough playmakers around them. Yeah, I think it's time to drop the Mahomes is a product of the system thing. The guy is amazing.
reddogblitz Posted October 1, 2019 Posted October 1, 2019 24 minutes ago, Buffalo Timmy said: I still full hope in him but no faith beyond he is a gamer and has the cojones to go for big plays when needed. Anyone who has faith in a QB like him is crazy- I hope to have faith in 2 more years. Pretty much my take. Josh has the leadership and will to win at all costs. Just not sure he is a good enough passer to pull it off. He did appear somewhat accurate in the 1st 3 games. Hopefully that returns. 3 minutes ago, LSHMEAB said: Yeah, I think it's time to drop the Mahomes is a product of the system thing. The guy is amazing. I think it's both. 1
LSHMEAB Posted October 2, 2019 Posted October 2, 2019 4 hours ago, Nihilarian said: This entire comparison to Patrick Mahomes is ridiculous. Allen doesn't have Andy Reid coaching, developing him. Instead he has a guy who thought that Nathan Peterman should be the 2018 starter... I should stop right here because the coaching issue is supreme! Then consider Mahomes actually sat for an entire season learning behind Alex Smith...a former #1 overall QB who led the Chiefs to a 10-6 record. Mahomes also had pro bowl/all pro WR Tyreek Hill, pro bowl/all pro TE Travis Kelce. Pro bowl Tackle Eric Fisher, all pro tackle Mitchel Schwartz, Center Mitch Morse. RB Kareem Hunt. Allen didn't and still doesn't have talent around him like Mahomes has and he was thrown to the proverbial wolves behind the worst O line in the NFL with a crappy receiving corps and virtually no running game besides himself! Just giving Allen a coach like Andy Reid with this current surrounding cast and the Bills offense would be totally different. So fire Daboll? The most TD passes any QB had thrown under HC Andy Reid was 28 prior to Mahomes arrival. That was like a 20 year stretch. Andy Reid has a really solid offensive mind, but it seems like he retroactively became a "QB whisperer" and offensive genius when that kid from TT showed up. 1 minute ago, reddogblitz said: Pretty much my take. Josh has the leadership and will to win at all costs. Just not sure he is a good enough passer to pull it off. He did appear somewhat accurate in the 1st 3 games. Hopefully that returns. I think it's both. Fair enough, but it's ridiculous to think Mahomes wouldn't be a star QB regardless of where he ended up. That seems to be the insinuation(not by you).
Mango Posted October 2, 2019 Posted October 2, 2019 2 hours ago, John from Riverside said: Interesting point....he also didnt lose the pats game along. If ST's doesnt give up a TD we win? JA is responsible for 10 points of turn overs. If this were a game where both teams scored 28+, I’d be Temped to agree. But it’s not. It’s a game lost 16-10 where we had bad QB play, from a QB with a number of games with bad QB-ing.
One Buffalo Posted October 2, 2019 Posted October 2, 2019 Interesting stats... he was looking much better after the half and I know many have said they believe he would have won the game if not taken out- 1
Mango Posted October 2, 2019 Posted October 2, 2019 30 minutes ago, Buffalo Timmy said: I still full hope in him but no faith beyond he is a gamer and has the cojones to go for big plays when needed. Anyone who has faith in a QB like him is crazy- I hope to have faith in 2 more years. The more Allen plays, the more he almost looks like a replica of Favre. He’s missing connecting on some of those deep post and seem patterns. If he can start to connect on more of those and elevate his WR’s on this plays, we have a baller!
Mango Posted October 2, 2019 Posted October 2, 2019 Just now, One Buffalo said: Interesting stats... he was looking much better after the half and I know many have said they believe he would have won the game if not taken out- I hate playing what-ifs. You are what you perform. My last national championship, I had a terrible start, I still won; but just missed fastest time of the entire race by about a second. I thought for a moment, “if only”. But the result is, if the were better I would have set the record. But I wasn’t beater, so I didn’t. You either own in and live with it, or think what-if’s and never become good enough. I think JA holds himself to the same standard, and it’s in the franchises best interest to do the same. Judge by production, not “what-ifs” or “shoulda-couldas” 1
Phil The Thrill Posted October 2, 2019 Author Posted October 2, 2019 3 hours ago, The Real Buffalo Joe said: He's showing improvement in every game, save this one. Countless times this year, the pass to Knox right at the edge of the field comes to mind, where I said to anybody who would listen "A year ago, he runs that ball and maybe gains five yards." It seems to me that ever since the intentional grounding call against Cincinnati, he's been afraid to throw it away which I hope he works on. He had a bad game against an elite D. You know who else didn't have a spectacular outing? Tom Brady, the alleged GOAT. This was a very good game between two top notch defenses. The difference is, Brady was not reckless with the ball. He didn’t throw 3 INT or take sacks to put them out of FG range. The Bills lost because of Josh Allen....no way around it 1
oldmanfan Posted October 2, 2019 Posted October 2, 2019 7 minutes ago, Phil The Thrill said: The difference is, Brady was not reckless with the ball. He didn’t throw 3 INT or take sacks to put them out of FG range. The Bills lost because of Josh Allen....no way around it He had a bad game no question. Could have done a lot more to win it. But basic math tells you if the punt isn’t blocked the score was 10-9. 1
Phil The Thrill Posted October 2, 2019 Author Posted October 2, 2019 Just now, oldmanfan said: He had a bad game no question. Could have done a lot more to win it. But basic math tells you if the punt isn’t blocked the score was 10-9. If we are playing that game, you can argue that the two Allen sacks on 3rd down that knocked the Bills out of FG range, cost 6 points. So even with the blocked punt that puts the game at 16-16. This would allow the Bills to kick the FG and win 19-16. This is a ridiculous game to play but Allen our the Bills defense is terrible positions. He was awful. This was a game the Bills should win
oldmanfan Posted October 2, 2019 Posted October 2, 2019 Just now, Phil The Thrill said: If we are playing that game, you can argue that the two Allen sacks on 3rd down that knocked the Bills out of FG range, cost 6 points. So even with the blocked punt that puts the game at 16-16. This would allow the Bills to kick the FG and win 19-16. This is a ridiculous game to play but Allen our the Bills defense is terrible positions. He was awful. This was a game the Bills should win The game you play is you have a built in bias against Allen. You say you’re a fan but pretty much every comment to make about the guy is negative. He stunk the first half last week. He was a lot better the second half before he got his bell rung. He has to realize games are not won or lost just on his arm. He has to take shorter throws, throw it away, etc. He got a very good lesson from Prof Belichick Sunday, let’s see how much he absorbs.
london_bills Posted October 2, 2019 Posted October 2, 2019 Mahomes and Allen don't belong in the same sentence. 1 1
jrober38 Posted October 2, 2019 Posted October 2, 2019 1 minute ago, london_bills said: Mahomes and Allen don't belong in the same sentence. This. One guy is the best QB in the NFL, and the other guy is one of the worst starters. Our starting QB struggles to throw a 5 yard out. He routinely skips check downs so he can throw it into double coverage. I can't think of a single other QB who struggled so badly with the basics who ever succeeded in becoming a franchise QB. 1
DC Tom Posted October 2, 2019 Posted October 2, 2019 I never had faith in Allen, mostly because he's a quarterback and not, y'know, some sort of divine entity/messiah figure. You people need a sense of perspective. 2 1
Orlando Buffalo Posted October 2, 2019 Posted October 2, 2019 1 hour ago, Mango said: The more Allen plays, the more he almost looks like a replica of Favre. He’s missing connecting on some of those deep post and seem patterns. If he can start to connect on more of those and elevate his WR’s on this plays, we have a baller! I agree- I am waiting for a reciever he trusts in all versions of the passing game like Fitzpatrick had Stevie- but with talent.
GottaRun Posted October 2, 2019 Posted October 2, 2019 56 minutes ago, oldmanfan said: He had a bad game no question. Could have done a lot more to win it. But basic math tells you if the punt isn’t blocked the score was 10-9. And not being able to run the ball in from the 2 near the end. Not on Barkley, not on Allen as he wasn't in. Allen had a stinker of a game but there were other spots where the Bills could have pulled this out and didn't. Hopefully they hate the taste of that loss and come out gunning for bear in the rematch. 2
LSHMEAB Posted October 2, 2019 Posted October 2, 2019 47 minutes ago, oldmanfan said: The game you play is you have a built in bias against Allen. You say you’re a fan but pretty much every comment to make about the guy is negative. Built in bias that he's not the ultimate answer does not= hope that the "bias" is correct. It's entirely possible for one to have not liked the pick, be a die hard Bills fan, and hope that the initial opinion is proven wrong. I'm quite sure there have been Bills quarterbacks you weren't sold on, didn't fully believe in, yet wanted to succeed. 2
Phil The Thrill Posted October 2, 2019 Author Posted October 2, 2019 1 hour ago, oldmanfan said: The game you play is you have a built in bias against Allen. You say you’re a fan but pretty much every comment to make about the guy is negative. He stunk the first half last week. He was a lot better the second half before he got his bell rung. He has to realize games are not won or lost just on his arm. He has to take shorter throws, throw it away, etc. He got a very good lesson from Prof Belichick Sunday, let’s see how much he absorbs. There’s a difference between being biased and being honest with what you are seeing - even when it’s not what the result you want. Many Bills fans seem to have an issue with the latter. There are all kinds of excuses and bogus rationalizations (like you saying the blocked punt was the difference) for Josh’s performance but the bottom line is - he stunk. He hurt the team very badly and had it not been for excellent defense, his mistakes could have sunk the team. Everyone who watches the game said it. I just read Joe Buscaglia’s All 22 report and Josh got a D+.....a D+! The jury is still very much out on Allen. While his game winning drives given us hope, performances like Cincinnati and New England make you second guess whether he’ll actually fix his game. That’s the whole point of this thread.
WideNine Posted October 2, 2019 Posted October 2, 2019 (edited) 15 hours ago, GunnerBill said: I fundamentally disagree with with you Nihilarian. If you wanted a run heavy gameplan and then ask the QB to make the key chain movers on 3rd downs that is not the guy Josh Allen is and I 100% believe he would look worse in that type of offense. If that is what you wanted to run the guy you should have drafted is playing for the Steelers. Josh Allen is at his best when he is in rhythm, up tempo, spread concepts and the ball is in his hands. The way that the Seahawks developed Russell Wilson or the way the Ravens developed Joe Flacco is not the way I believe you have to do it in the modern NFL. You have to run some, absolutely, but you have to get your Quarterback involved. And Josh Allen in particular, more than any QB I can ever remember seeing, is a rhythm guy. When he is in rhythm with the ball in his hands he plays his best. When he is out of rhythm and being asked to just hand it off and make the odd throw those throws are invariably off target. I would have liked to see more runs this game. Not to hide Allen, rather I think run blocking is the current strength of this o-line and their pass pro not-so-much. Dawkins and Ford were giving up plenty of pressure off the edges....especially Ford. If it protected Allen a bit then that would have been fine too. NE's defense is very good at shutting down the passing game. I don't feel they are as good against the run, but few teams hang with them long enough so that running the ball is an option. Look at all the positive yards grandpa Gore was getting. Not sure if he could have taken more touches, but when we do have the RB depth there is no reason not to run the ball if it is an effective strategy to move the chains. Really not sure if that is hiding Josh, I just think it is a better way to play that NE defense this year with our personnel. I do agree that Josh works better with the hurry up as he does not have the time to over think his options. Edited October 2, 2019 by WideNine 2
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