Foxx Posted January 24, 2020 Posted January 24, 2020 all i know is.... the discussion today is no different than that of the past two decades plus. change out the culprit and it is the same. i long for the day when the conversation changes and the argument whether he is good or not, becomes one of just how good he is. oh wait... that's the same argument isn't it? 1
JaCrispy Posted January 24, 2020 Posted January 24, 2020 29 minutes ago, YattaOkasan said: I'm struggling with the point I think @Mango is trying to make. I think we know Allen has a lot of responsibility at the line, and I agree with you we can't really quantify how much of the blame is on Allen because we don't have the information. But I think the things such as setting protections and getting to the right play are where hes gonna need to take the biggest jump. Over the season as information about the McVay communicating with Goff at the LoS and reflecting on Brady/Manning I started thinking you need your true OC to be taking the snaps. I totally think Allen has improved a lot in the mechanics of being a QB and also still has a long way to go. However, the real question I have now will be how does HE game plan week to week? How does he read the defense and audible? We know the Bills gave him the control, but is he exerting that control and correctly. Overall, I'm hopeful because of things like his wonderlic score and his lack of football coaching prior to reaching the NFL. I have actually been pretty impressed with how cerebral he is; so I will be very interested to see his growth in the mental aspect of the game in the next season. Agreed...not long ago I called for Allen to start calling his own plays next season for that very reason...I also feel it would help to speed up his learning curve...
YattaOkasan Posted January 24, 2020 Posted January 24, 2020 5 minutes ago, JaCrispy said: Agreed...not long ago I called for Allen to start calling his own plays next season for that very reason...I also feel it would help to speed up his learning curve... I think he had a lot of power to change plays, but I just dont know how often he did. Then I also don't know how successful he was when he did it. But agree I hope its speeding the curve up and will ultimately make a better end product.
Hapless Bills Fan Posted January 24, 2020 Posted January 24, 2020 25 minutes ago, YattaOkasan said: I'm struggling with the point I think @Mango is trying to make. I think we know Allen has a lot of responsibility at the line, and I agree with you we can't really quantify how much of the blame is on Allen because we don't have the information. But I think the things such as setting protections and getting to the right play are where hes gonna need to take the biggest jump. Over the season as information about the McVay communicating with Goff at the LoS and reflecting on Brady/Manning I started thinking you need your true OC to be taking the snaps. I totally think Allen has improved a lot in the mechanics of being a QB and also still has a long way to go. However, the real question I have now will be how does HE game plan week to week? How does he read the defense and audible? We know the Bills gave him the control, but is he exerting that control and correctly. Overall, I'm hopeful because of things like his wonderlic score and his lack of football coaching prior to reaching the NFL. I have actually been pretty impressed with how cerebral he is; so I will be very interested to see his growth in the mental aspect of the game in the next season. Well, first of all, it's not clear how much control the Bills have really given Josh, if you listen carefully to what Daboll says. For example, when asked after the Ravens game about Josh being responsible for setting the protections, he said "Sometimes he is.....Sometimes we just 'gap it up'" Second, when one assesses some of the spectacularly failed plays, sometimes the blocker is just getting his butt whipped. I think if there's a blocker right there and he's left feeling the breeze of someone charging by him, that's not an Allen problem. Likewise, I'm not sure about the "right play". Again, Daboll has been cagy about what he says - has said things like "he has the ability to get us into most of the things he needs" or words to that effect (this was after the Browns game). There's still an offensive framework. OK, I should put out there - I don't disagree with you that Allen needs to take a jump in terms of identifying the defense, setting protections, and making the right reads. I'm just not at all sure what the boundries being placed on him by our coaching staff are: how much control Allen has and how much freedom of choice he has. I'm sure he has presnap reads see this, this, this, check to a run....but then I'm sure he has limited, specific run plays he's supposed to check to. That's not a knock on Allen, I think that's true of all but a small subset of QBs in the league. 1 1
YattaOkasan Posted January 24, 2020 Posted January 24, 2020 6 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: Well, first of all, it's not clear how much control the Bills have really given Josh, if you listen carefully to what Daboll says. Fair. I really dont know but its what im most interested at this point. I thought I had seen some posts that he was getting a lot of pre snap responsibilities but maybe I misread. I'm really hopeful thats where he takes a leap cause it feels like thats where Brees, Brady, Manning separated from the rest of the league.
BringBackOrton Posted January 24, 2020 Posted January 24, 2020 4 hours ago, thebandit27 said: I think this characterization is a bit off. I think there’s a major difference between pointing out that the guy didn’t get much help around him this year to add context vs shifting blame for areas that he needs to improve. For example, there’s no question that Allen needs to improve his deep throws. You can certainly argue that his timing with his targets is off, and that a few were dropped or mishandled by WRs, but that in no way absolves him from needing to get better. Same with regard to accuracy. It’s more than fair to be critical of those that claim he’s the most inaccurate QB in the game by pointing out that he’s 21st in on-target throw percentage. That is in no way/shape/form a claim that he doesn’t need to continue to improve his accuracy. A good number of people seem to be unable to get away from extremes when it comes to this kid. My observation has been that the detractors are more aggressive in the application of Allen extremism, and I’m not too sure why. Where did Allen “not get much help?” Let’s do a deep dive on his receiver’s stats. His top two targets ranked 47th and 78th in drop rates this season. John Brown’s yards per target was higher than Kelce, Sanders, Julio, Kupp, Landry, Woods, Cooks, Allen, Tate, Adams, Hopkins, Odell. Oh no! Some one is bringing up stats that don’t make Allen look like he’s throwing to Wyoming level receivers! 1
Mango Posted January 24, 2020 Posted January 24, 2020 4 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: I understood your point, I'm saying that I think assigning 50% of that to the QB is totally arbitrary and capricious. It totally is a quantifiable question how much of the blame goes to the QB on each play, but to quantify that requires information none of us have, but the team does. You can stand by your idea all you like, but it's 1) way too simplistic and 2) probably wrong. The point about your characterization of EP offensive system is that it's fairly meaningless whether or not you can run a ton of plays from a single formation, or the same play from a number of formations, with regard to the ability to beat Blitz0. What matters is can you effectively execute THE CORRECT PLAY CHOICES TO BEAT BLITZ ZERO? Can you run screen plays successfully? Do you have more than one guy who can get open quickly on hot reads and are the plays designed to get them open fast? Do you have guys on the OL, TE and RB who can block and hold their blocks effectively while the deep route develops? Can your QB hit that deep post? (Allen is responsible for that last, and this past season the answer was "no" more often than not) If you don't, you're like the Devil's Dictionary definition of Consultant: "Guy who knows 500 ways to Make Love, and doesn't have a Girlfriend" 3 hours ago, YattaOkasan said: I'm struggling with the point I think @Mango is trying to make. I think we know Allen has a lot of responsibility at the line, and I agree with you we can't really quantify how much of the blame is on Allen because we don't have the information. But I think the things such as setting protections and getting to the right play are where hes gonna need to take the biggest jump. Over the season as information about the McVay communicating with Goff at the LoS and reflecting on Brady/Manning I started thinking you need your true OC to be taking the snaps. I totally think Allen has improved a lot in the mechanics of being a QB and also still has a long way to go. However, the real question I have now will be how does HE game plan week to week? How does he read the defense and audible? We know the Bills gave him the control, but is he exerting that control and correctly. Overall, I'm hopeful because of things like his wonderlic score and his lack of football coaching prior to reaching the NFL. I have actually been pretty impressed with how cerebral he is; so I will be very interested to see his growth in the mental aspect of the game in the next season. 2 hours ago, JaCrispy said: Agreed...not long ago I called for Allen to start calling his own plays next season for that very reason...I also feel it would help to speed up his learning curve... 2 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: Well, first of all, it's not clear how much control the Bills have really given Josh, if you listen carefully to what Daboll says. For example, when asked after the Ravens game about Josh being responsible for setting the protections, he said "Sometimes he is.....Sometimes we just 'gap it up'" Second, when one assesses some of the spectacularly failed plays, sometimes the blocker is just getting his butt whipped. I think if there's a blocker right there and he's left feeling the breeze of someone charging by him, that's not an Allen problem. Likewise, I'm not sure about the "right play". Again, Daboll has been cagy about what he says - has said things like "he has the ability to get us into most of the things he needs" or words to that effect (this was after the Browns game). There's still an offensive framework. OK, I should put out there - I don't disagree with you that Allen needs to take a jump in terms of identifying the defense, setting protections, and making the right reads. I'm just not at all sure what the boundries being placed on him by our coaching staff are: how much control Allen has and how much freedom of choice he has. I'm sure he has presnap reads see this, this, this, check to a run....but then I'm sure he has limited, specific run plays he's supposed to check to. That's not a knock on Allen, I think that's true of all but a small subset of QBs in the league. I was originally talking about Allen's clunkers, where he failed to connect on at least 50% of his passes. I was asserting that when that happens, more often than not, most of the blame falls on the QB. Yes there is also blame on things like the OL, Defense, WR, etc. but largely, having a high frequency of games sub 50% is an issue with the passer himself. For reference, I quickly grabbed sub 50% completion games for QB's in their first 2 years/32 games, since 2000 Here are the bottom 20. It is not a great list Granted there are some outliers, but it is not a great list of QB's. Most (not all) of which we would say were not good passers. The search function on PFR is awesome. Name Number of Games Under 50% passing Tim Tebow 10 Eli Manning 9 Joey Harrington 8 Michael Vick 8 Vince Young 8 Josh Allen 7 David Carr 7 Joe Flacco 7 Blaine Gabbert 7 Andrew Luck 7 Mike McMahon 7 Kyle Orton 7 Patrick Ramsey 7 JaMarcus Russell 7 Mark Sanchez 7 DeShone Kizer 6 Colt McCoy 6 Christian Ponder 6 Geno Smith 6 Brandon Weeden 6 1 1
John from Riverside Posted January 24, 2020 Posted January 24, 2020 5 hours ago, thebandit27 said: I think that the team has done just above the minimum when it comes to supporting Allen. They’ve given him nothing beyond serviceable when it comes to OL and WR. Contrast it to the approach that teams like Philly, LAR, Chicago, and Cleveland have taken to surround their young QBs with not only quality, but also quantity of explosive playmakers, and we’re waaaaay behind. And yes, the Lamar criticism is outrageous. I’ve said many times that I like all 5 of the 2018 QBs, and I still think they can all be good. I would like to see them do at the WR spot when they did with the OL/DL spots They drafted players high at those spots (and they were the best available at the time which helps) AND they were aggressive in free agency in getting quality guys. Now look at us....we actually have quality and depth at those spots....make it so the 3rd WR coming into the game is better then most teams number primary starters......get guys that can do multiple things.
YattaOkasan Posted January 24, 2020 Posted January 24, 2020 7 minutes ago, Mango said: I was originally talking about Allen's clunkers, where he failed to connect on at least 50% of his passes. I was asserting that when that happens, more often than not, most of the blame falls on the QB. Yes there is also blame on things like the OL, Defense, WR, etc. but largely, having a high frequency of games sub 50% is an issue with the passer himself. For reference, I quickly grabbed sub 50% completion games for QB's in their first 2 years/32 games, since 2000 Here are the bottom 20. It is not a great list Granted there are some outliers, but it is not a great list of QB's. Most (not all) of which we would say were not good passers. The search function on PFR is awesome. Name Number of Games Under 50% passing Tim Tebow 10 Eli Manning 9 Joey Harrington 8 Michael Vick 8 Vince Young 8 Josh Allen 7 David Carr 7 Joe Flacco 7 Blaine Gabbert 7 Andrew Luck 7 Mike McMahon 7 Kyle Orton 7 Patrick Ramsey 7 JaMarcus Russell 7 Mark Sanchez 7 DeShone Kizer 6 Colt McCoy 6 Christian Ponder 6 Geno Smith 6 Brandon Weeden 6 Yup I was inclined to agree with you that if a QB is sub 50% it is mostly on him. I think it’s because the other parts that fail may still be because of him. But I also agree with Hap that it’s impossible to quantify. I’m so conflicted on this topic of how much his supporting cast let him down (particularly OL) because he has so many responsibilities. Seeing growth in deep ball and this area is what I want. I’m just not sure how to quantify growth in this like I could the other areas like intermediate passing.
Hapless Bills Fan Posted January 24, 2020 Posted January 24, 2020 35 minutes ago, Mango said: I was originally talking about Allen's clunkers, where he failed to connect on at least 50% of his passes. I was asserting that when that happens, more often than not, most of the blame falls on the QB. Yes there is also blame on things like the OL, Defense, WR, etc. but largely, having a high frequency of games sub 50% is an issue with the passer himself. For reference, I quickly grabbed sub 50% completion games for QB's in their first 2 years/32 games, since 2000 Here are the bottom 20. It is not a great list Granted there are some outliers, but it is not a great list of QB's. Most (not all) of which we would say were not good passers. The search function on PFR is awesome. Name Number of Games Under 50% passing Tim Tebow 10 Eli Manning 9 Joey Harrington 8 Michael Vick 8 Vince Young 8 Josh Allen 7 David Carr 7 Joe Flacco 7 Blaine Gabbert 7 Andrew Luck 7 Mike McMahon 7 Kyle Orton 7 Patrick Ramsey 7 JaMarcus Russell 7 Mark Sanchez 7 DeShone Kizer 6 Colt McCoy 6 Christian Ponder 6 Geno Smith 6 Brandon Weeden 6 I was going to go into this bit by bit, but the board dumped my response - probably just as well. Let's just note that 4 of Allen's 7 games you list occurred his rookie season, when he was thrown into it halfway through Game 1 without the benefit of the 1st string reps (that's one of the games). In another, Allen's 4th game against GB, we rushed for 58 freakin' yards (of which 19 were Allen's) and asked him to pass 33 times against GB's confusing coverage and rush. We have the GM openly acknowledging "he didn't do enough" to put an OL and skill weapons around Allen that season. And you want to use that to make a case that it's 50% the QB's fault when he doesn't hit 50% completions, because you assert that it's so? What can I say. We must agree to disagree, and that's That. I note that there are 20 names on that list. 4 of them are QB with Superbowl wins, playoff appearances, probowl appearances, distinguished careers. 1
thebandit27 Posted January 24, 2020 Posted January 24, 2020 1 hour ago, BringBackOrton said: Where did Allen “not get much help?” Let’s do a deep dive on his receiver’s stats. His top two targets ranked 47th and 78th in drop rates this season. John Brown’s yards per target was higher than Kelce, Sanders, Julio, Kupp, Landry, Woods, Cooks, Allen, Tate, Adams, Hopkins, Odell. Oh no! Some one is bringing up stats that don’t make Allen look like he’s throwing to Wyoming level receivers! Holy cripes, for real? You’re casting a brutal aspersion here that I think you’re too smart to believe. I don’t know how it’s possible that folks like yourself can continue to brutally straw man this discussion into “nobody can criticize josh111!1!1!!!!2!2!!” It’s tiresome and silly. How did he not get much help? Really? The team scored 35 total TDs this year. Josh had 29 of them. That’s by far the highest percentage in the NFL. Contrast that with Lamar Jackson (who lead all QBs in total TDs)...he scored 40. I’d tell you how many TDs his team scored apart from him, but it would ruin the shock value when you see just how many it was. Look around the league. Most offenses don’t rely darn-near-solely on their QB to out the ball in the end zone. And yes, it’s nice that John Brown has a career year. It’s also nice that Cole Beasley had a career year. Both did so in an offense that attempted fewer passes than all but 8 teams. No way that had anything to do with the QB though. Once again I find myself astounded that the Allen detractors have to go to silly extremes in order to have a discussion. It’s unfathomable. 1
BringBackOrton Posted January 24, 2020 Posted January 24, 2020 1 minute ago, thebandit27 said: Holy cripes, for real? You’re casting a brutal aspersion here that I think you’re too smart to believe. I don’t know how it’s possible that folks like yourself can continue to brutally straw man this discussion into “nobody can criticize josh111!1!1!!!!2!2!!” It’s tiresome and silly. How did he not get much help? Really? The team scored 35 total TDs this year. Josh had 29 of them. That’s by far the highest percentage in the NFL. Contrast that with Lamar Jackson (who lead all QBs in total TDs)...he scored 40. I’d tell you how many TDs his team scored apart from him, but it would ruin the shock value when you see just how many it was. Look around the league. Most offenses don’t rely darn-near-solely on their QB to out the ball in the end zone. And yes, it’s nice that John Brown has a career year. It’s also nice that Cole Beasley had a career year. Both did so in an offense that attempted fewer passes than all but 8 teams. No way that had anything to do with the QB though. Once again I find myself astounded that the Allen detractors have to go to silly extremes in order to have a discussion. It’s unfathomable. Maybe the team would have scored more TDs if Josh and the O weren’t 26th in yards and plays per drive. It’s that pesky conundrum where the offensive positive stats are all because Josh was dragging those bums, and the negative stats are all because the rest of the offense sans Josh are bums. 1
thebandit27 Posted January 25, 2020 Posted January 25, 2020 41 minutes ago, BringBackOrton said: Maybe the team would have scored more TDs if Josh and the O weren’t 26th in yards and plays per drive. It’s that pesky conundrum where the offensive positive stats are all because Josh was dragging those bums, and the negative stats are all because the rest of the offense sans Josh are bums. Oh come on now. You know that’s not what I’ve said. Ever. I have said that Allen is the only player on the offense that opposing DCs actually have to game plan to stop. I’ve also said that he’s simply not consistent enough for the team to produce offensively if he’s the sole focus of the opposing D’s game plan. The fact of the matter with Allen is that he still misses too many throws, and he still fails to identify the easy (take what they give you) plays. I’ve said since March of 2018 that his missing throws is almost always due to him rushing his delivery, which results from the game moving too quickly. I have every reason to believe that he’ll continue to improve on that regard, but clearly he’s not where he needs to be. Now I shall go snack on a dark chocolate bar as I await the next person to tell me that pointing out an inaccuracy in a take means that nobody can criticize Josh ? 1
BBills88 Posted January 25, 2020 Posted January 25, 2020 Josh Allen will be a 64 - 65 % passer next season
Mango Posted January 25, 2020 Posted January 25, 2020 50 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: I was going to go into this bit by bit, but the board dumped my response - probably just as well. Let's just note that 4 of Allen's 7 games you list occurred his rookie season, when he was thrown into it halfway through Game 1 without the benefit of the 1st string reps (that's one of the games). In another, Allen's 4th game against GB, we rushed for 58 freakin' yards (of which 19 were Allen's) and asked him to pass 33 times against GB's confusing coverage and rush. We have the GM openly acknowledging "he didn't do enough" to put an OL and skill weapons around Allen that season. And you want to use that to make a case that it's 50% the QB's fault when he doesn't hit 50% completions, because you assert that it's so? What can I say. We must agree to disagree, and that's That. I note that there are 20 names on that list. 4 of them are QB with Superbowl wins, playoff appearances, probowl appearances, distinguished careers. These are every bodies rookie years. Yes some guys panned out as very good QB’s and good passers. Most of them did not and had so Monday games in their first two years under 50% because they simply were not proficient passers (yet). I don’t know what to tell you man. If want to asterisk Allen’s games individually, go ahead and do it for everybody. I don’t think Allen is in this terribly bad place where we his situation is so much worse then his current and historical peers.
Hapless Bills Fan Posted January 25, 2020 Posted January 25, 2020 6 minutes ago, thebandit27 said: Now I shall go snack on a dark chocolate bar as I await the next person to tell me that pointing out an inaccuracy in a take means that nobody can criticize Josh ? Please be careful. If that's what you do for each instance, you shall be in danger of becoming pudgy. 2 minutes ago, Mango said: These are every bodies rookie years. You said "For reference, I quickly grabbed sub 50% completion games for QB's in their first 2 years/32 games, since 2000" All those QB came into situations like Josh, devoid of OL and offensive talent? All those QB were not supposed to start/not given 1st team reps during training camp? Baloney. Peace out.
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted January 25, 2020 Posted January 25, 2020 2 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: Please be careful. If that's what you do for each instance, you shall be in danger of becoming pudgy. How do you know he isn't already? 1
thebandit27 Posted January 25, 2020 Posted January 25, 2020 3 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: Please be careful. If that's what you do for each instance, you shall be in danger of becoming pudgy. IIFYM bruh ?? 1 minute ago, Joe in Winslow said: How do you know he isn't already? Maybe Hapless has seen pics of Mrs Bandit and figured that I must be a stud to land that fox ? 1
LSHMEAB Posted January 25, 2020 Posted January 25, 2020 20 hours ago, Mango said: You mean like, when you look at him in shorts, it moves a little bit? That's not the sign. The sign is contact. Not that there's anything wrong with that. 1
LSHMEAB Posted January 25, 2020 Posted January 25, 2020 10 hours ago, pop gun said: Josh is 5th in the league in how far the ball travels in the air towards it's target, he doesn't just settle for dump offs and he is not a checkdown charlie, which I like. Imagine if he did twice a game for 5 more yards his comp % would be well over 60% and the haters would be silent, but whatever. He's trying to get the ball down the field, he's aggressive, good and getting better. He's going to be a stud. Games Passing Rk Player Tm Age Pos G GS Cmp Att Yds IAY IAY/PA▼ CAY CAY/Cmp CAY/PA YAC YAC/Cmp 1 Matthew Stafford DET 31 QB 8 8 187 291 2499 3097 10.6 1609 8.6 5.5 890 4.8 2 Jameis Winston TAM 25 QB 16 16 380 626 5109 6500 10.4 3249 8.6 5.2 1860 4.9 3 Ryan Tannehill TEN 31 QB 12 10 201 286 2742 2715 9.5 1494 7.4 5.2 1248 6.2 4 Russell Wilson* SEA 31 QB 16 16 341 516 4110 4836 9.4 2402 7.0 4.7 1708 5.0 5 Josh Allen BUF 23 QB 16 16 271 461 3089 4271 9.3 1758 6.5 3.8 1331 4.9 6 Dak Prescott DAL 26 QB 16 16 388 596 4902 5510 9.2 2984 7.7 5.0 1918 4.9 7 Deshaun Watson* HOU 24 QB 15 15 333 495 3852 4400 8.9 2170 6.5 4.4 1682 5.1 8 Aaron Rodgers* GNB 36 QB 16 16 353 569 4002 5005 8.8 1993 5.6 3.5 2009 5.7 9 Ryan Fitzpatrick MIA 37 QB 15 13 311 502 3529 4442 8.8 2252 7.2 4.5 1277 4.1 10 Patrick Mahomes* KAN 24 QB 14 14 319 484 4031 4273 8.8 2076 6.5 4.3 1955 6.1 11 Lamar Jackson*+ BAL 22 QB 15 15 265 401 3127 3545 8.8 1767 6.7 4.4 1360 5.1 12 Philip Rivers LAC 38 QB 16 16 390 591 4615 5031 8.5 2430 6.2 4.1 2185 5.6 13 Baker Mayfield CLE 24 QB 16 16 317 534 3827 4471 8.4 1992 6.3 3.7 1835 5.8 14 Sam Darnold NYJ 22 QB 13 13 273 441 3024 3619 8.2 1554 5.7 3.5 1470 5.4 15 Matt Ryan ATL 34 QB 15 15 408 616 4466 5007 8.1 2816 6.9 4.6 1650 4.0 16 Kyle Allen CAR 23 QB 13 12 303 489 3322 3938 8.1 1641 5.4 3.4 1681 5.5 17 Carson Wentz PHI 27 QB 16 16 388 607 4039 4878 8.0 2235 5.8 3.7 1804 4.6 18 Daniel Jones NYG 22 QB 13 12 284 459 3027 3673 8.0 1619 5.7 3.5 1408 5.0 19 Mason Rudolph PIT 24 QB 10 8 176 283 1765 2261 8.0 841 4.8 3.0 924 5.3 20 Mitchell Trubisky CHI 25 QB 15 15 326 516 3138 4102 7.9 1729 5.3 3.4 1409 4.3 21 Jacoby Brissett IND 27 QB 15 15 272 447 2942 3521 7.9 1437 5.3 3.2 1505 5.5 22 Jared Goff LAR 25 QB 16 16 394 626 4638 4825 7.7 2388 6.1 3.8 2250 5.7 23 Tom Brady NWE 42 QB 16 16 373 613 4057 4633 7.6 2233 6.0 3.6 1824 4.9 24 Kirk Cousins MIN 31 QB 15 15 307 444 3603 3395 7.6 1818 5.9 4.1 1785 5.8 25 Andy Dalton CIN 32 QB 13 13 314 528 3494 3969 7.5 1834 5.8 3.5 1660 5.3 26 Kyler Murray ARI 22 QB 16 16 349 542 3722 3987 7.4 1870 5.4 3.5 1852 5.3 27 Gardner Minshew JAX 23 QB 14 12 285 470 3271 3328 7.1 1687 5.9 3.6 1584 5.6 28 Case Keenum WAS 31 QB 10 8 160 247 1707 1700 6.9 907 5.7 3.7 800 5.0 29 Joe Flacco DEN 34 QB 8 8 171 262 1822 1750 6.7 915 5.4 3.5 907 5.3 30 Derek Carr OAK 28 QB 16 16 361 513 4054 3364 6.6 1932 5.4 3.8 2122 5.9 31 Jimmy Garoppolo SFO 28 QB 16 16 329 476 3978 3088 6.5 1806 5.5 3.8 2172 6.6 32 Drew Brees* NOR 40 QB 11 11 281 378 2979 2443 6.5 1495 5.3 4.0 1484 5.3 That's all good and well, but the problem with this stat is that his YPA increased by a mere .1. As much progress as he made, he still only increased that number from 6.6 to 6.7. The key for Allen is not necessarily completion percentage, but yards per attempt. I don't care if his completion percentage remains stagnant if that YPA jumps into the 7.5 range. Air yards only matter if you're completing enough of the shots. 1 1
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