Dopey Posted September 19, 2019 Posted September 19, 2019 7 hours ago, transplantbillsfan said: I'm a Foster over Zay type. I actually think this Sunday Foster is going to have at least a couple big catches. Watching those plays Joe B highlighted where Foster was clearly the target and got open but the ball just never got to him tells me Daboll has plans for him. Zay has been a waste of space. I know Gunner points to his run blocking, but ya know who proved to be a pretty damn good run blocker in preseason? Da Duke thus... I am also a Duke over Zay type of guy. But seems this coaching staff is trying to allow time for the light to go on for Zay. So be it. Duke's still on our team. I suspect if another team poaches him we call him up. If this is what the coaching staff is doing, not good. Not good at all. That's training camp stuff. These games are too valuable to wait for a light to come on. Either you earned your spot on the 53 or not. I trust the coaching staff sees Zay as a better option for this team right now. If Duke finally comes aboard, he would have earned it in the eyes of the coaching staff and that's good enough for me. You know, it's really a 180 degrees turn from last year, where we had no talent and any warm body would do at WR. Love that we can have a lively discussion over talented player and not table scraps. 1
billsfan1959 Posted September 19, 2019 Posted September 19, 2019 6 hours ago, formerlyofCtown said: You mean when you cant catch a bad pass. He cant throw himself the ball. I remember all the experts on this board saying how much Robert Woods sucked. Yes I know you are confused Alpha. You were confused when you said he wouldnt be on the roster week one. Brown and Beasley are the now. Zay, Foster and Williams are the future. Zay is in his 3rd year. His future is now. He had a catch rate of 35% his rookie year, 55% last year, and 42% so far this year - for a career rate of 47%. His 42% this year is on the 3rd most targets behind Brown and Beasley. For some reason, Brown has a 78% catch rate and Beasley has a 69% catch rate. I like Zay. I think he is a good blocking WR and I do think he has the talent to be a good receiver. Yet, for some reason he doesn't show up as a reciever very often - and certainly not consistently. I honestly do not know why there seems to be such a disconnect between Allen and Jones, particularly since they have been together for over a year, but, there is. It is really puzzling when you consider Allen doesn't seem to have that same disconnect with Brown and Beasley, who Allen has been throwing to for a little over 3 months. 1
Patrick Duffy Posted September 19, 2019 Posted September 19, 2019 1 minute ago, Dopey said: If this is what the coaching staff is doing, not good. Not good at all. That's training camp stuff. These games are too valuable to wait for a light to come on. Either you earned your spot on the 53 or not. I trust the coaching staff sees Zay as a better option for this team right now. If Duke finally comes aboard, he would have earned it in the eyes of the coaching staff and that's good enough for me. You know, it's really a 180 degrees turn from last year, where we had no talent and any warm body would do at WR. Love that we can have a lively discussion over talented player and not table scraps. I definitely agree. It is nice to finally have some weapons compared to last season. I know Josh Allen has to been pretty happy as well. 1
Dopey Posted September 19, 2019 Posted September 19, 2019 1 hour ago, pop gun said: IMO, they have to activate Duke for fear of losing him to another team. The Giants are thin at WR.
GunnerBill Posted September 19, 2019 Posted September 19, 2019 1 hour ago, pop gun said: IMO, they have to activate Duke for fear of losing him to another team. But that only becomes a thing when another team tries to poach him. If that happens then it forces the Bills into a decision. But barring that or an injury to one of our 6 WRs I don't see the Bills bringing him up any time soon.
SoCal Deek Posted September 19, 2019 Posted September 19, 2019 Or we could dump the useless Fullback and activate Duke. Just saying!
CA OC Bills Fan Posted September 19, 2019 Posted September 19, 2019 31 minutes ago, Roch-A-Bill said: I've been wondering, if a team claims a player off of the practice squad, does the initial team, i.e. the Bills with Duke, have the option of moving him up to preserve him? The Bills can make an offer, it's then up to Duke which one he takes.
formerlyofCtown Posted September 19, 2019 Posted September 19, 2019 1 hour ago, Patrick_Duffy said: Yeah, he could catch well then, but for some reason he has trouble now, which is the time that matters. That's why what he did in college doesn't mean a thing at this point in terms of what he is having trouble with in the NFL. It's psychological and hopefully it passes. He got passed it last year he will get passed it again. For some reason the kid seems to have confidence issues. 1 hour ago, Don Otreply said: It’s going on three full years of zay trying to get it together, what college did he go to, was it a top school or top competition??? He has been forced to play teams, good WRs don’t play teams, Look, we would all prefer that Zay kicks azs, would be good for Zay, and good for the Bills, but now in his third year it’s not looking like that’s gonna happen. He is out of sync with Allen an awful lot, Allen was trying to get him to run his routes differently during camp so they would work better during games, that seemingly has not helped him. How much time do we give him?? Go Bills!!! Um, we are two games in. I would say thats closer to two than 3. I remember having arguments with idiots on this board over Robert Woods. I think we know who was right now. You people act like he has a 10mil a year contract or something. Probably would have cut Drew Brees. After all it took him 4 or 5 years to get it together. 1 hour ago, billsfan1959 said: Zay is in his 3rd year. His future is now. He had a catch rate of 35% his rookie year, 55% last year, and 42% so far this year - for a career rate of 47%. His 42% this year is on the 3rd most targets behind Brown and Beasley. For some reason, Brown has a 78% catch rate and Beasley has a 69% catch rate. I like Zay. I think he is a good blocking WR and I do think he has the talent to be a good receiver. Yet, for some reason he doesn't show up as a reciever very often - and certainly not consistently. I honestly do not know why there seems to be such a disconnect between Allen and Jones, particularly since they have been together for over a year, but, there is. It is really puzzling when you consider Allen doesn't seem to have that same disconnect with Brown and Beasley, who Allen has been throwing to for a little over 3 months. You tell that to the coaching staff and front office who went out and got two veterans for these young guys to learn from.
MrSarcasm Posted September 19, 2019 Posted September 19, 2019 We need to activate Duke!! The man is practicing super good, just like Peterman did last year. We also really need him for those 7 WR sets. ?
billsfan1959 Posted September 19, 2019 Posted September 19, 2019 5 minutes ago, formerlyofCtown said: You tell that to the coaching staff and front office who went out and got two veterans for these young guys to learn from. They went out and got two veterans to improve the WR position on the team, which tells you what they thought of the position last year. Again, this is Jone's third year in the NFL and his second with Allen. If he is going to be a wide receiver of the future for this team, then his future needs to start now. I like Zay and hope he turns into what we want him to be. However, to say Brown and Beasley are the now and Zay is the future - as if he is some rookie that shouldn't be held to the standard of a what you might expect from a starting NFL wide receiver in his 3rd year is nonsensical. 1
LABILLBACKER Posted September 19, 2019 Posted September 19, 2019 14 hours ago, billspro said: It was. Zay Jones better start playing better or this guy is going to take his spot. I agree, if Z doesn't step it up soon the coaches will have no choice but to call up Duke. As far as I'm concerned he should be on the team now rather than DiMarco?
badassgixxer05 Posted September 19, 2019 Posted September 19, 2019 3 hours ago, pop gun said: IMO, they have to activate Duke for fear of losing him to another team. Cant they match the offer and put him on our active roster if a team tries to sign him?
PetermansRedemption Posted September 19, 2019 Posted September 19, 2019 21 minutes ago, badassgixxer05 said: Cant they match the offer and put him on our active roster if a team tries to sign him? I believe Duke would have the option at that point of who to sign with.
White Linen Posted September 19, 2019 Posted September 19, 2019 8 hours ago, transplantbillsfan said: No, look at what you said. You said he looked absolutely pooped. You didn't say it was a wild guess he was absolutely pooped. Backtracking is fine in this case, though. There ya go. At least you quickly realized the stupidity of your previous statement. We've all done it Reading comprehension is a weak point for you.
Don Otreply Posted September 19, 2019 Posted September 19, 2019 Ctown, two years are past, it’s the third year. Brown & Beasley were brought in because, first and foremost the guys we had were not getting it done, and still aren’t getting it done, learning from the Vets? Sure but that’s a side effect if it happens, no guarantee on that. Brown & Beasley were not brought in to teach, they were brought in to win, it really is that simple. And no, I don’t care who gets paid what, never have. You are less objective than I am, and frankly like everyone I stray. Go Bills!!!
MR8 Posted September 19, 2019 Posted September 19, 2019 6 minutes ago, Bills2ref said: I believe Duke would have the option at that point of who to sign with. https://nflpaweb.blob.core.windows.net/media/Default/PDFs/2011 CBA Updated with Side Letters thru 1-5-15.pdf I honestly can't find a clear answer to this in the CBA...
MAJBobby Posted September 19, 2019 Posted September 19, 2019 Call him Up. Here are a List of Guys that can be cut to make that happen. Before you ever get to talking about Zay Jones. Conor McDermott Lee Smith Jaquan Johnson 1
Alphadawg7 Posted September 19, 2019 Author Posted September 19, 2019 4 hours ago, formerlyofCtown said: It does in the case of wether he can catch. But it didn’t really for the vast majority of the other WRs on the list.
GunnerBill Posted September 19, 2019 Posted September 19, 2019 30 minutes ago, MAJBobby said: Call him Up. Here are a List of Guys that can be cut to make that happen. Before you ever get to talking about Zay Jones. Conor McDermott Lee Smith Jaquan Johnson I wouldn't cut Smith or Johnson for Duke. McDermott still being on the team is a myster. 2
MR8 Posted September 19, 2019 Posted September 19, 2019 27 minutes ago, MAJBobby said: Call him Up. Here are a List of Guys that can be cut to make that happen. Before you ever get to talking about Zay Jones. Conor McDermott Lee Smith Jaquan Johnson If you cut Connor McDermott you only have 3 OTs, Dawkins, Ford, and Ty.... most people want to move Ty over to OG, so you want to only have 2 OTs on the roster? Lee Smith is the best blocker we have and he has been healthy, something neither Kroft nor Knox have been this off-season, cutting him opens you up to being short handed if Kroft can't stay healthy WHEN he actually is able to play. Johnson is playing a key role in special teams, and rotation at Safety. I agree, Duke keeps impressing... but who do you cut to get him on the active roster? If Singletary isn't 100% they're going to need to consider adding a RB as it is, and they're already dangerously thin at CB. My thought is the Bills are looking to get the O-Line sorted out and either cut or trade the odd man out to a team needy of O-Line help. Once they do that they will open up a spot they can use for RB, CB, or WR. My thought is their first call for the 53 for each: RB: Marcus Murphy (FA still) or Byron Marshall (PS) CB: Cam Lewis (PS) WR: Duke Williams (PS) They have other more pressing needs right now than WR, and while I think Duke should be on the 53 ... who do you cut? Right now, IMHO the lowest of the low on the totem pole for the 53 are: Kurt Coleman (S) & Ike Boettger (OG)... While he's buried on the depth chart I think Coleman is a team favorite because of his familiarity with the system, and Boettger is a rotational depth guy on the line's interior, but maybe is becoming expendable with Morse, Spain, Feliciano being the starters and Long and Bates playing as well as they have in reserve roles. Plus Ford looking better at OG changes that interior as well, but it makes us VERY thin at OT where we only have 4 including Ford. If Ford is permanently moved to OG, they can trade Long and/or cut Boettger because it would move Feliciano to a reserve role. But we end up with just 3 OTs in Dawkins, Ty, and Connor McDermott. That's far less than Ideal. It's a VERY difficult numbers game right now, so just adding Duke means losing something else. They are a bit banged up on the back end so you don't want them to cut a Safety unless they're adding a CB to fill in for Johnson. You just don't want to thin the herd right now with NE on the horizon. I would keep an eye on Andre Robert's health and the kick return game. If they guys handling it now keep doing the good job they're doing, I could see them move Roberts to IR and release him with an injury settlement which could open the door for Duke Williams to come on to the 53 man roster. But that's really the only avenue at this juncture I see which would get Duke Promoted... until the O-Line is more settled and we have a clearer picture of who we want to keep and who can go.
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