Zay Jones blocking ability - I’m impressed

[Alphadawg7]

1 hour ago, MikeSpeed said:

Allen is the media's bipolar player and Zay is the Bill's fans bipolar player.

Neither will have prayer of winning over the detractors.

 

40 yards or less in 10 of 13 games with Allen in at QB the majority of the game...including 18 yards in week 1 where Allen threw 37 times, the entire first quarter, and went through his progressions a lot.  I think its fair for him to have "detractors".  And he has 22 yards or less 4 times in the 7 games going back to when Allen came back from injury.  Not to mention all the drops in his first 2 years and even this preseason.

 

Between a shaky preseason and minimal week 1, Zay has yet to show any signs or measurable "growth" in his 3rd year.  At some point, the excuses need to stop for a lack of involvement, productions, and consistency in the passing game with a 3rd year WR taken in the 2nd round who set NCAA records for receptions.  

 

Most confusing, is in a game where we threw on every play but one in the first quarter and 37 times total against a weak Jets secondary, why was Zay not on the field a lot for being a starter and only got 3 real targets (2 others were basically throw aways)?  Why did Daboll not feel he needed to be more involved and on the field more in a game we threw so much, and against a team that Zay had a good game against with Barkley last year?

 

Its great he blocked well, important part of being a WR.  But when is he going to start being a dependable receiver too?  

 

All I know, is he most often is not making much of an impact with Allen led Bills games...so why is that?  Is he not beating the defense enough? Does Allen not trust him enough?  Do the coaches not trust him enough?  Is it something else or a combo of all those?  Don't know, but as or right now he has yet to really be a key factor in the majority of Allen led football games both before and after Allens injury.  

 

New week this week...and a Giants defense that should let our offense keep progressing.  Lets hope he does more this week, as someone other than Brown needs to step up as Cole made two bad mistakes last week that almost cost us the game, and Zay, Foster, and McKenzie had little impact as well all for various reasons.  

 

 

Edited September 11, 2019 by Alphadawg7

[MDH]

2 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

PFF gave him an elite grade for his blocking on Sunday. Am I allowed to say that? Or is it PFF hating season still?

 

https://theathletic.com/1200409/2019/09/10/bills-all-22-review-what-stood-out-on-film-from-the-week-1-win-and-grades-for-each-player/?source=dailyemail

 

The Athletic gave Zay an A- for the day as well.

[Alphadawg7]

3 minutes ago, MDH said:

 

https://theathletic.com/1200409/2019/09/10/bills-all-22-review-what-stood-out-on-film-from-the-week-1-win-and-grades-for-each-player/?source=dailyemail

 

The Athletic gave Zay an A- for the day as well.

 

One of the things I have been most impressed by this offseason is...The Athletic.  Big thanks to whoever put that one day big discount for the year thread on here as that got me to buy it, and I am very impressed with the quality and depth of writing on there so far.  Also impressed by the volume of great articles and write ups on not just the Bills, but the other teams I follow and sports in general.  

 

Big fan of the Athletic.  

[Dopey]

58 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

40 yards or less in 10 of 13 games with Allen in at QB the majority of the game...including 18 yards in week 1 where Allen threw 37 times, the entire first quarter, and went through his progressions a lot.  I think its fair for him to have "detractors".  And he has 22 yards or less 4 times in the 7 games going back to when Allen came back from injury.  Not to mention all the drops in his first 2 years and even this preseason.

 

Between a shaky preseason and minimal week 1, Zay has yet to show any signs or measurable "growth" in his 3rd year.  At some point, the excuses need to stop for a lack of involvement, productions, and consistency with a 3rd year WR taken in the 2nd round who set NCAA records for receptions.  

 

Most confusing, is in a game where we threw on every play but one in the first quarter and 37 times total against a weak Jets secondary, why was Zay not on the field a lot for being a starter and only got 3 real targets (2 others were basically throw aways)?  Why did Daboll not feel he needed to be more involved and on the field more in a game we threw so much, and against a team that Zay had a good game against with Barkley last year?

 

Its great he blocked well, important part of being a WR.  But when is he going to start being a dependable receiver too?  

 

All I know, is he most often is not making much of an impact with Allen led Bills games...so why is that?  Is he not beating the defense enough? Does Allen not trust him enough?  Do the coaches not trust him enough?  Is it something else or a combo of all those?  Don't know, but as or right now he has yet to really be a key factor in the majority of Allen led football games both before and after Allens injury.  

 

New week this week...and a Giants defense that should let our offense keep progressing.  Lets hope he does more this week, as someone other than Brown needs to step up as Cole made two bad mistakes last week that almost cost us the game, and Zay, Foster, and McKenzie had little impact as well all for various reasons.  

 

 

We're only into 1 game of year 3 for Zay. Last year was a crap show by the offense as a whole and he still put up ok #'s, considering. It was very premature to say he wouldn't make the team this year and it's very premature to judge him for the 2019 season. We won, he played a part in it and it's all good for Zay.

Nice 20 yd catch on the last scoring drive by Zay to get us into Jets territory.

Edited September 11, 2019 by Dopey

[John from Riverside]

Willing to give him the year to see where he is at.....but I have a feeling he is gonna get pushed out in a strong WR draft next year.

[Alphadawg7]

49 minutes ago, Dopey said:

We're only into 1 game of year 3 for Zay. Last year was a crap show by the offense as a whole and he still put up ok #'s, considering. It was very premature to say he wouldn't make the team this year and it's very premature to judge him for the 2019 season. We won, he played a part in it and it's all good for Zay.

 

Yup, 1 game in, absolutely has a long season to insert himself, and hope he does.  I am not condemning him for the season, and I have been critical of every WR not named Brown week 1.  I do find it weird though in a game where we threw an entire first quarter and 37 times, that Zay was not a big part of the game plan and didn't see a lot of snaps for a starting WR...especially with Foster and McKenzie barely seeing the field.  

 

And its more than fair to claim that thread and prediction was "premature" if you want, I mean I made that bold prediction before even FA began and before Brown, Cole, etc were part of the team.  

 

But, what someone really cant do is disprove the criticisms I provided and others did too that led to the belief he wasn't a lock and was gonna have to compete.  In fact, his preseason was really in line with the criticisms he has faced.  And 18 yards week 1 was just more of the same in terms of his typical production.    

 

Its all good, but before people jump to criticize my thoughts from that thread, then Zay better show it on the field first.  And he hasn't unless you think a shaky preseason highlighted by dropped TD, blown 3rd down catch for first down, and 18 yards in week 1 is somehow him "silencing" the criticisms.

Edited September 11, 2019 by Alphadawg7

[MikeSpeed]

3 hours ago, BillsVet said:

Zay was in on 29 offensive snaps out of 69 and targeted 5 times. 

 

It'll be interesting to see how he is used throughout the season and how that is affected if Foster's toe improves.  Will he remain a downfield blocker with a few targets or featured more in the passing game? 

 

I'd refrain from using the word "Bipolar" if you're not clear what it means.

My apologies to anyone who may have took offense. I think my meaning is clear, but maybe my terminology was in bad taste.

[MikeSpeed]

2 hours ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

40 yards or less in 10 of 13 games with Allen in at QB the majority of the game...including 18 yards in week 1 where Allen threw 37 times, the entire first quarter, and went through his progressions a lot.  I think its fair for him to have "detractors".  And he has 22 yards or less 4 times in the 7 games going back to when Allen came back from injury.  Not to mention all the drops in his first 2 years and even this preseason.

 

Between a shaky preseason and minimal week 1, Zay has yet to show any signs or measurable "growth" in his 3rd year.  At some point, the excuses need to stop for a lack of involvement, productions, and consistency in the passing game with a 3rd year WR taken in the 2nd round who set NCAA records for receptions.  

 

Most confusing, is in a game where we threw on every play but one in the first quarter and 37 times total against a weak Jets secondary, why was Zay not on the field a lot for being a starter and only got 3 real targets (2 others were basically throw aways)?  Why did Daboll not feel he needed to be more involved and on the field more in a game we threw so much, and against a team that Zay had a good game against with Barkley last year?

 

Its great he blocked well, important part of being a WR.  But when is he going to start being a dependable receiver too?  

 

All I know, is he most often is not making much of an impact with Allen led Bills games...so why is that?  Is he not beating the defense enough? Does Allen not trust him enough?  Do the coaches not trust him enough?  Is it something else or a combo of all those?  Don't know, but as or right now he has yet to really be a key factor in the majority of Allen led football games both before and after Allens injury.  

 

New week this week...and a Giants defense that should let our offense keep progressing.  Lets hope he does more this week, as someone other than Brown needs to step up as Cole made two bad mistakes last week that almost cost us the game, and Zay, Foster, and McKenzie had little impact as well all for various reasons.  

 

 

I'm not sure who you're trying to convince? I didn't say anything about either being good or bad. I was just saying that no matter what, people have made their minds up about these 2 players, and it's going to take an act of the almighty to change them.

[3rdand12]

6 hours ago, MJS said:

If Gore would have cut that a little more outside he had nothing but green grass. Maybe he isn't quick enough to get out there in time though.

try to stay focused on the positive post from OP  : )

[JoshAllenHasBigHands]

3 minutes ago, MikeSpeed said:

I'm not sure who you're trying to convince? I didn't say anything about either being good or bad. I was just saying that no matter what, people have made their minds up about these 2 players, and it's going to take an act of the almighty to change them.

 

This is exactly correct. 

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

NICE HANDS ZAY

[JoshAllenHasBigHands]

1 hour ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

Yup, 1 game in, absolutely has a long season to insert himself, and hope he does.  I am not condemning him for the season, and I have been critical of every WR not named Brown week 1.  I do find it weird though in a game where we threw an entire first quarter and 37 times, that Zay was not a big part of the game plan and didn't see a lot of snaps for a starting WR...especially with Foster and McKenzie barely seeing the field.  

 

And its more than fair to claim that thread and prediction was "premature" if you want, I mean I made that bold prediction before even FA began and before Brown, Cole, etc were part of the team.  

 

But, what someone really cant do is disprove the criticisms I provided and others did too that led to the belief he wasn't a lock and was gonna have to compete.  In fact, his preseason was really in line with the criticisms he has faced.  And 18 yards week 1 was just more of the same in terms of his typical production.    

 

Its all good, but before people jump to criticize my thoughts from that thread, then Zay better show it on the field first.  And he hasn't unless you think a shaky preseason highlighted by dropped TD, blown 3rd down catch for first down, and 18 yards in week 1 is somehow him "silencing" the criticisms.

 

You would be taken more seriously if you did not do things like criticize Zay for not catching three of the balls thrown his way on Sunday.  Your arguments, as well laid out as they are, always seem to be littered those gross mis-characterizations.  

[BuffaloHokie13]

1 hour ago, Alphadawg7 said:

I do find it weird though in a game where we threw an entire first quarter and 37 times, that Zay was not a big part of the game plan and didn't see a lot of snaps for a starting WR...especially with Foster and McKenzie barely seeing the field.  

To be fair, 5/37 is still 13.5% of our passes. Also, 5 targets on 29 snaps means he was targeted over 17% of the time he was in the game which is exactly in line with Brown & Beasley (17% & 19% respectively)

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

Anyone see the all 22 and validated the 3 missed balls? 

 

One was overthrown that I saw.  I can’t put my finger on the other 2. 

I’m not blindly defending Zay.  I would just like to know the facts.  

 

 

Are blocking TE’s part of the game plan? 

[BuffaloHokie13]

2 minutes ago, SlimShady'sGhost said:

Anyone see the all 22 and validated the 3 missed balls? 

 

One was overthrown that I saw.  I can’t put my finger on the other 2. 

I’m not blindly defending Zay.  I would just like to know the facts.  

 

I'll be honest, on the 'overthrow' I said in real time that that's why Foster should play instead of Zay (blamed it on Zay not being a good receiver).

[SlimShady'sSpaceForce]

And the other overthrows are the fault of the guys targeted too then ?

 

I know Zay is an easy target (pun intended)

I prefer more facts than speculation. 

 

[Alphadawg7]

42 minutes ago, JoshAllenHasBigHands said:

 

You would be taken more seriously if you did not do things like criticize Zay for not catching three of the balls thrown his way on Sunday.  Your arguments, as well laid out as they are, always seem to be littered those gross mis-characterizations.  

 

Except I did not do that once.  He had 4 legit targets (one which was tipped and picked by defender) and 1 throw away by Allen where Zay got the target for being closest to the ball.  Show me where I criticized his catch rate as if that was the issue.  And I criticized Cole even harder than I did Zay this week.  

 

I literally just said what was interesting was this was a game that we threw 37 times and for the entire first quarter, Zay still saw limited snaps, was not heavily involved in the offense, and was a game where neither Foster or McKenzie saw the field much.  

 

Not one time did I mock him for not catching 3 passes, 2 of which I am well aware were not catchable and were Josh throwing the ball away in his direction.  So sorry, you're wrong in what you say I have criticized.  

Edited September 11, 2019 by Alphadawg7

[Real McClappy]

28 minutes ago, SlimShady'sGhost said:

Anyone see the all 22 and validated the 3 missed balls? 

 

One was overthrown that I saw.  I can’t put my finger on the other 2. 

I’m not blindly defending Zay.  I would just like to know the facts.  

 

 

Are blocking TE’s part of the game plan? 

Overthrown on one

Tip at line for INT on another

Complete throw away for 3

 

This is if memory serves right to last Sunday. 

Edited September 11, 2019 by Real McCoy

[MassHog]

7 hours ago, billsfan1959 said:

Zay Jones is a good blocking WR. He needs to show up more as a pass catching WR. I like Zay and believe he has the talent; however, he has not yet lived up to being the 37th overall pick. Hoping we see it this year.

to be fair... has any WR taken in the first two rounds of that draft class lived up to expectations other than Juju? I'd say Zay has made more of an impact than Corey Davis or John Ross, arguably more than Mike Williams too due to his availability. 

[JoshAllenHasBigHands]

10 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

Except I did not do that once.  He had 4 legit targets (one which was tipped and picked by defender) and 1 throw away by Allen where Zay got the target for being closest to the ball.  Show me where I criticized his catch rate as if that was the issue.  And I criticized Cole even harder than I did Zay this week.  

 

I literally just said what was interesting was this was a game that we threw 37 times and for the entire first quarter, Zay still saw limited snaps, was not heavily involved in the offense, and was a game where neither Foster or McKenzie saw the field much.  

 

Not one time did I mock him for not catching 3 passes, 2 of which I am well aware were not catchable and were Josh throwing the ball away in his direction.  So sorry, you're wrong in what you say I have criticized.  

The mention of 5 targets implies that the 3 non-catches were related to him. If not, why even mention it? You see why that framing taints so much of what you're up to? A person not knowing any better would be led to an incorrect conclusion. 

Edited September 11, 2019 by JoshAllenHasBigHands