Hated the turnovers....but man...Josh Allen's short game

[Hapless Bills Fan]

29 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

I honestly see a nice pocket that Josh can step up into

 

Something we haven't had consistently for a long time

 

True, although I think Allen may lack total faith that (?Cody Ford?) will hold.  But it's there for the moment.  And if he did step up?

[HappyDays]

24 minutes ago, colin said:

they need to mix it up and have him take bigger shots more often (which we did late, and it resulted in a win). 

 

I think it was just our specific game plan against the Jets, Adams and Maye are the centerpiece of their defense. We were attacking their CBs and LBs who aren't great at coverage. If not for the 4 turnovers it was actually working very well. We had 23 1st downs. Moving forward I expect they'll sprinkle in more deep shots. Especially if they can get Singletary going consistently, the deep game will open up.

[Buffalo716]

4 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

True, although I think Allen may lack total faith that (?Cody Ford?) will hold.  But it's there for the moment.  And if he did step up?

Are you talking about the seam route developing?  Without watching the all 22 I can't tell if he will run open behind the LBr or if the backer will drop with him

[mrags]

1 hour ago, jletha said:

The way I see it the fumbles and the batted ball are things you want to avoid as a QB so yes, they are at least partially on him and because of them he didnt have a steller day overall. But...these types of turnovers are NOT the same type of turnovers people expected. When people talk about "Bad Josh" they mean wildly inaccurate throws, holding the ball too long, poor decision making, scrambling too quickly. If I were to tell you Josh had 4 turnovers in the first half before the game you would assume that one of them would have been because of those things but in fact none of them were. These turnovers, while annoying, are much much more easily corrected and avoided. That is why I am more optimistic.

 

The typical traits of "Bad Josh" were only seen sparingly and THAT is progress people.

I’ve been pretty critical of Josh and the offense about yesterday. But this is 100% true. 

[NewEra]

1 hour ago, billsfan1959 said:

Its the NFL and these are professional receivers. IMO, I really didn't see any short throws that a receiver should have had trouble catching because of velocity, including the one that deflected off Beasley for an interception.

I feel he would’ve caught the somewhat low throw if it had lest hear on its. You feel different.  It’s cool

59 minutes ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said:

No, but he was throwing to possession receiver Cole Beasley, not his sister Mary Hart Elvira Beasley. Cole needs to catch that ball. 

 

Consider the Bell td, a reception down near the cleats that he pulls in.  

 

It was just one of those things that happens as $#!^ gets off the rails. 

 

 

Yes.  He needs to catch that somewhat off target pass.  I agree.  But I also feel that if the ball wasn’t coming in so hot (or completely on target), he would’ve caught the ball.  

[Ralonzo]

1 hour ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said:

No, but he was throwing to possession receiver Cole Beasley, not his sister Mary Hart Elvira Beasley.

 

I can't tell them apart from the hairdos. When Cole pulls his helmet off he looks like the Jack Of Spades.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

5 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

Are you talking about the seam route developing?  Without watching the all 22 I can't tell if he will run open behind the LBr or if the backer will drop with him

 

Yeah, need all 22.  There's the seam, but also looks to me like they're giving Motor a whole lot of field to himself over there. 

Could be wrong.

[skibum]

He still tends to throw directly at the receiver's chest, instead of leading him. The receiver has to either adjust or simply stop running to make the catch. Even the TD to Brown was like that. The announcer put a nice spin on it, as if Allen put it there so Brown could duck under the DB, but really it was just a mediocre placement. Good enough for a completion, but usually not enough to turn a big play. 

[Say When...]

1 hour ago, Jauronimo said:

Most of the time a pass that low is a safe play.  He put it in a spot where only Beasley could get it.   It was off target but i would guess 90% of the time or more that play is a 7 yard gain or an incomplete pass.

 

this -  and after watching the network footage and pausing through release, trajectory and it hits Beasley's forearm i believe he intentionally threw that ball exactly as it happened, and 95% of the time that's a safe play.  if he tries to hit beasley in the numbers with Mosley closing as he did it's a potential tip and int/pick6.

 

damned if you do and damned if you don't, but i think he shouldn't be afraid to do it again.

 

weird thing is Gannon went on how that was Josh's fault and threw it behind Cole and it bounced off his hip; it did no such thing, it was ahead of Cole and he tried to scoop it up in an attempt to run with it and it deflected off his forearm, hence he had his hands too far ahead of the ball.

 

if Cole had just reserved himself to a catch and secure on the ground it's be 2nd down and 4.

Edited September 9, 2019 by Say When...

[Ralonzo]

1 hour ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

You're right that Beasley has found a soft spot, but tell me what you see (besides the fact that the RT is about to get pwned)

 

RB in the right flat and Trumaine dreaming about his own pick-6?

Edited September 9, 2019 by Ralonzo

[Buffalo716]

4 minutes ago, Hapless Bills Fan said:

 

Yeah, need all 22.  There's the seam, but also looks to me like they're giving Motor a whole lot of field to himself over there. 

Could be wrong.

Singletary could've been hot right as the play started ... A quick swing to a playmaker had always been a solid decision... Brady's lived off it for years

 

But I'd have to see it all live again to see how it develops..  if Josh was gonna throw that it should be quick to get him in space 1v1 vs 22. A late throw on a swing route can turn bad quick... But it looked like some space

[Ralonzo]

9 minutes ago, skibum said:

He still tends to throw directly at the receiver's chest, instead of leading him. The receiver has to either adjust or simply stop running to make the catch. Even the TD to Brown was like that. The announcer put a nice spin on it, as if Allen put it there so Brown could duck under the DB, but really it was just a mediocre placement. Good enough for a completion, but usually not enough to turn a big play. 

 

Ehh, I'm gonna have to go ahead and disagree. Brown got the one-on-one matchup and Allen determined to take that shot. He held the safety with his eyes, and came back to Brown. At that point the CB's leverage determines the throw. If he's trailing, throw goes over the top. Inside, throw goes outside. And so forth.

 

Corner had inside leverage and deep. Throw has to go outside and short. And it was, and it worked, and that's why.

[SomeDudeAtHome]

On the same topic of Josh's progression, how about all the changes at the line? I don't know as much about formations and things as guys around here so hopefully he was changing to better plays but if he was truly recognizing something and putting the offense in a better position than that is huge. Maybe some of those audibles were out of running plays which is why there were so many pass attempts to start? I don't know but if we didn't have 3 somewhat fluky, strange, out-of-the-ordinary turnovers this game never would have been as close as it was with how well the offense was moving.

[colin]

36 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

 

I think it was just our specific game plan against the Jets, Adams and Maye are the centerpiece of their defense. We were attacking their CBs and LBs who aren't great at coverage. If not for the 4 turnovers it was actually working very well. We had 23 1st downs. Moving forward I expect they'll sprinkle in more deep shots. Especially if they can get Singletary going consistently, the deep game will open up.

 

shut your measured mouth!  i want electric 30 yard bombs and long runs ripped every drive!  pish posh to your "game plan".

 

how dare you

[NickelCity]

This game convinced me that we found our quarterback. 

[Chicken Boo]

2 hours ago, ndirish1978 said:

Josh needs to eliminate the hero balls and he'll be just fine.

 

Nothing irritates me more than attempting to redefine bad football.  It isn't "hero ball", it's ***** QB play.  Call it what it is.

 

And yes, I agree.

[jletha]

14 minutes ago, skibum said:

He still tends to throw directly at the receiver's chest, instead of leading him. The receiver has to either adjust or simply stop running to make the catch. Even the TD to Brown was like that. The announcer put a nice spin on it, as if Allen put it there so Brown could duck under the DB, but really it was just a mediocre placement. Good enough for a completion, but usually not enough to turn a big play. 

The reason the announcers put that spin on it is because they were right. Throws to the sideline always involve placing it so the DB cant get to it but your WR can make a play. Not sure where else you would want the ball thrown so Brown has a better chance at catching it. Just because a WR needs to make an adjustment doesnt mean its inaccurate.

[Buffalo716]

Just now, SomeDudeAtHome said:

On the same topic of Josh's progression, how about all the changes at the line? I don't know as much about formations and things as guys around here so hopefully he was changing to better plays but if he was truly recognizing something and putting the offense in a better position than that is huge. Maybe some of those audibles were out of running plays which is why there were so many pass attempts to start? I don't know but if we didn't have 3 somewhat fluky, strange, out-of-the-ordinary turnovers this game never would have been as close as it was with how well the offense was moving.

Dabolls offense is all about putting different personnel on the field. It makes it harder to game plan for and gives you more variety

 

Dabol will come out in 21 personnel ( 2 backs 1 TE) IForm, but then switch formations to a 5 wide look with 21 personnel. Defenses get confused when they see a FB line up out wide and other different formations

[Ralonzo]

3 minutes ago, jletha said:

The reason the announcers put that spin on it is because they were right. Throws to the sideline always involve placing it so the DB cant get to it but your WR can make a play. Not sure where else you would want the ball thrown so Brown has a better chance at catching it. Just because a WR needs to make an adjustment doesnt mean its inaccurate.

 

More to the point, accuracy means placing the ball where your receiver is between it and the defender. The defender's option at that point is, go through the receiver to the ball i.e. PI penalty *. Bad outcomes are minimized. If your QB is putting up passes where the announcer talks about the receiver having to make the defensive play on the ball (i.e. defender is between the receiver and the ball), that's always going to be the result of an inaccurate pass. Can you recall a pass Allen threw yesterday that fits that description? I'm thinking hard but I really can't.

 

* Except for the Patriots

[ddaryl]

2 hours ago, Nextmanup said:

 

Yeah but he made quite a few glaring errors that should have been erased from his game by now, if he were to improve with each week.  No?

 

 

  which errors are those that should be eliminated by now ?