Good Night / Bad Night - Pre-Season Game 1

[AllenLongBall]

2 minutes ago, zonabb said:

Love the endless excuses for Allen. Love the kid's mentality, love his poise, seems to be better at game management and reading the defense and therefore operating in the offense. But he is and always will be maddeningly inaccurate and I keep reading these homer excuses like he's "knocking the rust off" or "it's preseason" or any of the myriad of excuses that avoid seeing him for what he is.... inaccurate. Nothing has changed on this regard. I watched Kyler Murray's first drive last night, didn't look like he was "knocking any rust off." In fact, the kid looks pretty awesome and wickedly accurate. The kid from the Giants was 5/5 or Mayfield was 5/6. They knocking the rust off too. Rosen was 13/20 and is roundly hated here. That's 65%. He knocking it off too? Or are there excuses why he did that well on that garbage team?

 

I think we should hope that with some better receivers and less drops that he can approach 58% or a little over. The problem is, the homerism here just can't let anyone criticize the kids accuracy. Face it, this team has possibly the most inaccurate starting QB in the league. If they can find a way to get him into the right throws all the time, limit the route tree to passes he can be accurate with and get a decent run game, they an win with him and what looks like a really good defense. But I refuse to give this kid excuses for the inaccuracy.

 

You said it much better than I could, congrats!  The inaccuracy is a MAJOR concern and something I thought he was supposed to be working on.  I see no improvement, yet.

Edited August 9, 2019 by AllenLongBall

[Stank_Nasty]

1 minute ago, zonabb said:

Love the endless excuses for Allen. Love the kid's mentality, love his poise, seems to be better at game management and reading the defense and therefore operating in the offense. But he is and always will be maddeningly inaccurate and I keep reading these homer excuses like he's "knocking the rust off" or "it's preseason" or any of the myriad of excuses that avoid seeing him for what he is.... inaccurate. Nothing has changed on this regard. I watched Kyler Murray's first drive last night, didn't look like he was "knocking any rust off." In fact, the kid looks pretty awesome and wickedly accurate. The kid from the Giants was 5/5 or Mayfield was 5/6. They knocking the rust off too. Rosen was 13/20 and is roundly hated here. That's 65%. He knocking it off too? Or are there excuses why he did that well on that garbage team?

 

I think we should hope that with some better receivers and less drops that he can approach 58% or a little over. The problem is, the homerism here just can't let anyone criticize the kids accuracy. Face it, this team has possibly the most inaccurate starting QB in the league. If they can find a way to get him into the right throws all the time, limit the route tree to passes he can be accurate with and get a decent run game, they an win with him and what looks like a really good defense. But I refuse to give this kid excuses for the inaccuracy.

should jones have caught the one right in his hands or not?

 

if he catches that allen ends with over 60%.

 

but nice novel there, buddy.

[Royale with Cheese]

6 minutes ago, Ittakestime said:

The Allen pass to Zay should have been in the numbers not above his head.

 

If Allen does that to a vet WR, he will literally get his butt beat on the bench.  You don't set your WR to get exposed like that in the middle of the field.

 

This is where the ball should have been:

 

 

 

Geezus dude....this isn't the same play or the same route.

This is a 25 yard ball over the middle.

 

Yesterday was 7-10 yard pass in the air from within the redzone, quick strike over the middle at the 2 yard line.  Everything is tighter in the redzone.....

 

Over his head????? So you're saying if he doesn't get his hands on it, it's sailing over the endzone??

How are you arguing smoking gun evidence?  This still shot shows it's going to hit him in the face.

Edited August 9, 2019 by Royale with Cheese

[oldmanfan]

3 minutes ago, AllenLongBall said:

 

I mean, he finished 54%.  I know it's the first preseason game, so surely hope that improves.  

How many times do people have to be told the completion percentage has nothing to do with accuracy?  

[Stank_Nasty]

I cannot believe people are actually trying to put that throw to jones on allen in the least..... its frightening to me that there are people like that on this planet.

[Putin]

4 minutes ago, AllenLongBall said:

 

Have to be skeptical of guys who only show up during a contract year.

Yes I’m sure there’s extra motivation BUT he’s been getting better for the past couple of seasons , He’s not a great pass rusher and may never have a double digit #’s in sacks BUT he sets the edge / play’s the run very well , 

I do expect him to have a great season and Oliver will have a lot to do with that !!!

[GunnerBill]

8 minutes ago, Juice_32 said:

Anyone with Gamepass, check out 13:36 in the first quarter, 3rd and 9. Oliver has a hell of a sequence vs Q. Nelson. 

 

Ed drives him back into the QB and then jumps to attempt a deflection. You can tell Nelson was hell bent on driving him into the ground once he left his feet. Nelson tries to, but some how Oliver stays on his feet, throws Nelson to the side and almost gets to the QB. I've watched the play 10 times and I still cant believe how impressive it was.

 

Yep. That was the particular sequence that blew me away too. And this is not some practice squad scrub. This is Quenton Nelson. Ed Oliver.... man teams will wonder how that guy ever made it to #9 in years to come. 

[GG]

6 minutes ago, zonabb said:

Love the endless excuses for Allen. Love the kid's mentality, love his poise, seems to be better at game management and reading the defense and therefore operating in the offense. But he is and always will be maddeningly inaccurate and I keep reading these homer excuses like he's "knocking the rust off" or "it's preseason" or any of the myriad of excuses that avoid seeing him for what he is.... inaccurate. Nothing has changed on this regard. I watched Kyler Murray's first drive last night, didn't look like he was "knocking any rust off." In fact, the kid looks pretty awesome and wickedly accurate. The kid from the Giants was 5/5 or Mayfield was 5/6. They knocking the rust off too. Rosen was 13/20 and is roundly hated here. That's 65%. He knocking it off too? Or are there excuses why he did that well on that garbage team?

 

I think we should hope that with some better receivers and less drops that he can approach 58% or a little over. The problem is, the homerism here just can't let anyone criticize the kids accuracy. Face it, this team has possibly the most inaccurate starting QB in the league. If they can find a way to get him into the right throws all the time, limit the route tree to passes he can be accurate with and get a decent run game, they an win with him and what looks like a really good defense. But I refuse to give this kid excuses for the inaccuracy.

 

Did you watch Rosen throw last night, or are just going by stats?

[DCOrange]

Oliver looked okay against Nelson, which is a huge compliment. He was always my realistic hope at #9; definitely excited to see him in the regular season because most teams don't have a Nelson.

 

Having said that, definitely some signs of a lack of counter moves in this game; Nelson completely stonewalled him multiple times and Oliver pretty much just accepted it or just tried to continue pushing rather than countering at all.

[AllenLongBall]

4 minutes ago, oldmanfan said:

How many times do people have to be told the completion percentage has nothing to do with accuracy?  

 

Consistent accuracy is a component of completion percentage.  Of course so are many other things like play calling and dropped balls.  However, to say Allen is an accurate passer is not being truthful. It's more like wishful thinking...

Edited August 9, 2019 by AllenLongBall

[Ittakestime]

6 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

Geezus dude....this isn't the same play or the same route.

This is a 25 yard ball over the middle.

 

Yesterday was 7-10 yard pass in the air from within the redzone, quick strike over the middle at the 2 yard line.  Everything is tighter in the redzone.....

 

Over his head????? So you're saying if he doesn't get his hands on it, it's sailing over the endzone??

How are you arguing smoking gun evidence?  This still shot shows it's going to hit him in the face.

 

Allen threw the ball from the 24 yard line and it landed at the 4.

 

It was not 7-10 yards.

 

Allen exposed Jones' ribcage in the middle of the field.  YOU DON"T DO THAT!!!!

 

It's pretty common knowledge even in HS.

Edited August 9, 2019 by Ittakestime

[Royale with Cheese]

9 minutes ago, AllenLongBall said:

 

I mean, he finished 54%.  I know it's the first preseason game, so surely hope that improves.  

 

Allen...

 

Literally, and I mean literally....if Zay catches that, Allen's completion % jumps out to 63%.  11 attempts is not enough of a sample size.

Then he would have been 63% and a TD.  Would you have been that much happier?

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

9 minutes ago, AllenLongBall said:

 

You said it much better than I could, congrats!  The inaccuracy is a MAJOR concern and something I thought he was supposed to be working on.  I see no improvement, yet.

 

You people are mathematically challenged. Zay jones holds on to a ball THAT HITS HIM IN THE HANDS, it's a 63% completion percentage.

 

 

[teef]

This is strange. Allen did exactly what he had to do on that pass the Zay. It was encouraging. Perfect or not, zay dropped it. The failure of that play was due to the failures of zay jones. This is coming from a guy that still strongly pulling for Jones. 

[Stank_Nasty]

3 minutes ago, Ittakestime said:

 

Allen threw the ball from the 24 yard line and it landed at the 4.

 

It was not 7-10 yards.

 

Allen exposed Jones' ribcage in the middle of the field.  YOU DON"T DO THAT!!!!

 

It's pretty common knowledge even in HS.

watch the damn replay dude. if jones doesn't bobble he's set up just fine to secure it or maybe even lunge to the EZ..... the bobble is exactly what laid jones out to dry. you cant be this simple.

Edited August 9, 2019 by Stank_Nasty

[teef]

3 minutes ago, Ittakestime said:

 

Allen threw the ball from the 24 yard line and it landed at the 4.

 

It was not 7-10 yards.

 

Allen exposed Jones' ribcage in the middle of the field.  YOU DON"T DO THAT!!!!

 

It's pretty common knowledge even in HS.

What is going on here?

[GunnerBill]

7 minutes ago, zonabb said:

Love the endless excuses for Allen. Love the kid's mentality, love his poise, seems to be better at game management and reading the defense and therefore operating in the offense. But he is and always will be maddeningly inaccurate and I keep reading these homer excuses like he's "knocking the rust off" or "it's preseason" or any of the myriad of excuses that avoid seeing him for what he is.... inaccurate. Nothing has changed on this regard. I watched Kyler Murray's first drive last night, didn't look like he was "knocking any rust off." In fact, the kid looks pretty awesome and wickedly accurate. The kid from the Giants was 5/5 or Mayfield was 5/6. They knocking the rust off too. Rosen was 13/20 and is roundly hated here. That's 65%. He knocking it off too? Or are there excuses why he did that well on that garbage team?

 

I think we should hope that with some better receivers and less drops that he can approach 58% or a little over. The problem is, the homerism here just can't let anyone criticize the kids accuracy. Face it, this team has possibly the most inaccurate starting QB in the league. If they can find a way to get him into the right throws all the time, limit the route tree to passes he can be accurate with and get a decent run game, they an win with him and what looks like a really good defense. But I refuse to give this kid excuses for the inaccuracy.

 

Whoa, whoa, whoa...... hang on to your horses. I was the person who called this a "knocking off the rust" performance and I have been a critic of Josh Allen's accuracy since way before we drafted him. I am the last person you can accuse of "homerism" when it comes to Josh Allen. I thought there were two inaccurate passes last night. One was the overthrow the other was the ball in the dirt at Zay's feet. There were another couple that came down to micommunication and then there was Zay's drop. I don't think he will ever be a precision passer and have said that multiple times. The question is can he be accurate enough. The "knock the rust off" was not an excuse for inaccuracy it was a comment on the general impression of the way he played. 

[Stank_Nasty]

1 minute ago, teef said:

What is going on here?

he doesn't friggin know.

[Johnny Hammersticks]

Anyone hear why Harrison Phillips was playing deep in 4th quarter?  I thought that was unusual.  

[oldmanfan]

8 minutes ago, AllenLongBall said:

 

Consistent accuracy is a component of completion percentage.  Of course so are many other things like play calling and dropped balls.  However, to say Allen is an accurate passer is not being truthful. It's more like wishful thinking...

Bull crap.  Plain and simple.  Several folks here broke down every single pass he threw last year and showed you're wrong.  Your problem is you do not understand what the term accuracy means.

 

I have said repeatedly around here that he needs to be more precise with his placement, and some get on me for that.  But this asinine argument about one throw last night shows my point.  When you hit a guy right in the hands, right in the hands, that is very accurate.  But if you want to talk about, maybe, moving the ball about six inches one way or the other, then you are talking about precision.  And he was both highly accurate and precise with that throw, he put it right where he needed to put it, so the safety coming up couldn't get to it.  Allen needs to be more consistent, I've said that all through the off season, and a lot of that will be him taking the short pass, having more time in the pocket, and so on.  All of which we saw last night.

 

If this is going to be what we have to put up with this year, nitpicking every single throw by the guy, ignoring when he makes a good throw and just making up issues with other good throws, it's going to be a long season around here. 

Edited August 9, 2019 by oldmanfan