bills_fan Posted April 5, 2005 Posted April 5, 2005 Wow, Mike Mamula! As I recall, he was slated to go in the 2nd or even 3rd round. Then, he went to the combines and was SO great at everything, he wound up being selected 9th overall. The thing is, everyone at the combines was so giddy over his numbers, the fact that he was unable to play football slipped right by them. I dont know enough about Jones to put him in this class, but Mamula is the poster boy for placing too much emphasis on times and numbers in the combines and not enough on the football field. He was undersized for a DE, and unable to keep the speed he had when he added a ton of weight. He would have been a decent situational pass rusher. Is it his fault the folks at the combine made him the #9 overall pick?? Unable to play football? Now thats a bit much. He almost singlehandedly destroyed Notre Dame in consecutive years for BC, including once when ND was ranked #1. In the 2 ND games he had 6 sacks and over a dozen tackles with a forced fumble. He was unblockable. Great college player, miscast as a pro DE, might have been a decent 3rd down pass rusher in the right system.
billrooter Posted April 7, 2005 Posted April 7, 2005 The draft is a crapshoot but in my opinion, using your first pick on a player that has never played the position he is being drafted at is crazy, it's a boom or bust pick. The bills could really use a contributor at that spot and i think it would be too big a gamble,but like i said he is very intriguing!
Alaska Darin Posted April 7, 2005 Posted April 7, 2005 I'm a little confused as to where we're going with all this, "Safety pegs Jones" talk. You should have seen the kid in the Senior Bowl. Take a look at the tapes from the link above. If you're going to make that argument with him, you can make it with everyone else too. I'd even go as far as saying that if it looks like he won't be around, trade up! There's gotta be a team out there who will take say our 2nd (AZ's 44th), 4th, and maybe a later round pick in next years draft to move up to an earlier spot in the 2nd or even one of the last 5 in the 1st. 296846[/snapback] I really don't care about what players do in college all star games or how high they can jump or run the shuttle. Chris Spielman probably couldn't beat me in a foot race but he was a FOOTBALL player. The NFL is a totally different animal and right now this guy is nothing more than a gimmick project without a position. There have been a ton of very talented WRs drafted who got to the NFL and couldn't hang despite playing the position their entire lives with outstanding coaching. Renaldo Nehemiah was a world class athlete and the first time he got drilled in the NFL he was pretty much done forever. IT'S A DIFFERENT GAME. It won't bother me if we pick the guy but I'm not at all convinced he's going to make it because so many don't.
NorCal Aaron Posted April 7, 2005 Posted April 7, 2005 Renaldo Nehemiah was a world class athlete and the first time he got drilled in the NFL he was pretty much done forever. 298031[/snapback] Nehemiah weighed a buck seventy wet, and anyone with junior high football experience could have driven him into retirement.
Tipster19 Posted April 7, 2005 Posted April 7, 2005 I'm pro-Jones, at ANY pick. The point is he is a extraordinary athlete. He has size, speed, and ability. It's up to whoever drafts him to utilize his talents and for that reason that's why i think Buffalo and Mularkey would be an ideal fit. People have been clamoring for us to draft a O-lineman with our 1st pick. I don't think we will, especially if the TH for LJ trade goes thru. Even if it doesn't I wouldn't be surprise if there is other alternatives in free agency. I do agree and would like if we were to address the need(s) to the secondary (CB & S), LB'er, and back-up RB/WR positions with our 1st pick. But make no mistake about it, this Jones is a special type of athlete. People wonder about his toughness? Not knowing too much about him but just knowing that he's a QB should answer that worry. Did you see the post that nodnarb put up on the highlights of the Jones and other draftees? Jones passed, ran and caught TDs. This is not a one dimensional player. I've posted earlier that this game, athlete, league, strategies, schemes and any other darn thing that has to do with the future evolution of this sport will change. People like Kordel Stewart and Michael Vick have already started this process. Now there's Jones, Adrian Mcpherson and who knows who else is out there that's multi talented. No, I'm a slow learner but I'm starting to realize that when it comes to Donahoe, expect the unexpected. If TD finds a way to trade up and then selects Jones, I won't be upset. I was totally blown away (very upset) when he picked MaGahee, but we see how masterful that truly was. If Jones is our 1st pick, I'll TD the benefit of the doubt this time. He deserves and earned it.
MadBuffaloDisease Posted April 7, 2005 Posted April 7, 2005 I really don't care about what players do in college all star games or how high they can jump or run the shuttle. Chris Spielman probably couldn't beat me in a foot race but he was a FOOTBALL player. The NFL is a totally different animal and right now this guy is nothing more than a gimmick project without a position. There have been a ton of very talented WRs drafted who got to the NFL and couldn't hang despite playing the position their entire lives with outstanding coaching. Renaldo Nehemiah was a world class athlete and the first time he got drilled in the NFL he was pretty much done forever. IT'S A DIFFERENT GAME. Jones is 6'6" and 242# currently. Why a safety would be able to "drill" him and make him want to think of retirement versus a guy who is 5-6" shorter and 35-40# lighter is anyone's guess?! Jones has been a QB for the past 4 years in college and knows a thing or two about getting drilled, by guys MUCH bigger than an NFL strong safety. It won't bother me if we pick the guy but I'm not at all convinced he's going to make it because so many don't. Jones has freakish skills in terms of size and speed and agility. He also is supposed to have good-to-great hands. He also has a college QB's understanding of the game, like Riemersma did. What he doesn't have is experience at the college or pro level to play WR. However if he could play QB in college, I'm sure he can handle learning how to play WR in the NFL. There is no guarantee, just like there was no guarantee on guys like Terrell, Stokes, and Howard, but sometimes you gotta take the chance.
Alaska Darin Posted April 7, 2005 Posted April 7, 2005 If TD finds a way to trade up and then selects Jones, I won't be upset. I was totally blown away (very upset) when he picked MaGahee, but we see how masterful that truly was. If Jones is our 1st pick, I'll TD the benefit of the doubt this time. He deserves and earned it. 298063[/snapback] If that's the plan then put me on the wagon. I trust Tom Donahoe's judgement over anyone on this board or any predraft media hype. Rarely do we see a highlight video that shows player's weaknesses or interviews with their competitors that aren't totally laudatory. That's the nature of the business and it's up to the braintrust to seperate the wheat from the chaff. Until then, consider me a skeptic of Mr. Jones. I grew up in an era where the best WR in the game was a slow white guy who couldn't jump over the Anchorage phone book and likely couldn't bench press his body weight.
Alaska Darin Posted April 7, 2005 Posted April 7, 2005 Jones is 6'6" and 242# currently. Why a safety would be able to "drill" him and make him want to think of retirement versus a guy who is 5-6" shorter and 35-40# lighter is anyone's guess?! Jones has been a QB for the past 4 years in college and knows a thing or two about getting drilled, by guys MUCH bigger than an NFL strong safety. Jones has freakish skills in terms of size and speed and agility. He also is supposed to have good-to-great hands. He also has a college QB's understanding of the game, like Riemersma did. What he doesn't have is experience at the college or pro level to play WR. However if he could play QB in college, I'm sure he can handle learning how to play WR in the NFL. There is no guarantee, just like there was no guarantee on guys like Terrell, Stokes, and Howard, but sometimes you gotta take the chance. 298070[/snapback] If you think college defenders hit anywhere near like the NFL, there's little reason to continue this discussion. As far as having a "college QBs understanding of the game," who are you kidding? How many great college QBs have completely flopped in the NFL playing the position they've been at their entire life? JR actually played the TE position IN COLLEGE. He didn't have to spend his days learning nuances like ripping his arm through to assist him in his break. There's alot more to being a wide receiver than running fast in a straight line and catching the rock when it comes your way.
Simon Posted April 7, 2005 Posted April 7, 2005 I really don't care about what players do in college all star games or how high they can jump or run the shuttle. You're hired.....
MadBuffaloDisease Posted April 7, 2005 Posted April 7, 2005 If you think college defenders hit anywhere near like the NFL, there's little reason to continue this discussion. Would you say a college DE hits about as hard as an NFL SS? And again why would a guy who is 6'6" and 240+# have more trouble than a guy who is smaller and who ALSO didn't experience NFL-style hitting? As far as having a "college QBs understanding of the game," who are you kidding? How many great college QBs have completely flopped in the NFL playing the position they've been at their entire life? JR actually played the TE position IN COLLEGE. He didn't have to spend his days learning nuances like ripping his arm through to assist him in his break. There's alot more to being a wide receiver than running fast in a straight line and catching the rock when it comes your way. Obviously there is. But having played QB will help him, just like JR said it helped HIM. And again if Jones was able to handle playing QB in college, he could be taught how to play WR. It's not like they're going to let him loose on the field without any instruction, and although it might not produce immediate results, it would be worth the gamble. More than a few athletic college QB's have had success in the NFL as WR's, and at least early-on I can see the Bills using Jones like the Jags used Wilford last year.
Alaska Darin Posted April 7, 2005 Posted April 7, 2005 Would you say a college DE hits about as hard as an NFL SS? Depends on the scenario. And again why would a guy who is 6'6" and 240+# have more trouble than a guy who is smaller and who ALSO didn't experience NFL-style hitting? You see the video of Mouth Winslow getting his clock cleaned on special teams in preseason? Another freakish athlete brought to reality VERY quickly. Bigger guys are bigger targets, regardless of what the predraft workout says. Obviously there is. But having played QB will help him, just like JR said it helped HIM. And again if Jones was able to handle playing QB in college, he could be taught how to play WR. It's not like they're going to let him loose on the field without any instruction, and although it might not produce immediate results, it would be worth the gamble. More than a few athletic college QB's have had success in the NFL as WR's, and at least early-on I can see the Bills using Jones like the Jags used Wilford last year. 298121[/snapback] I guess we'll see.
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