JohnC Posted August 5, 2019 Posted August 5, 2019 20 hours ago, Augie said: Yeah, this level in both men’s and women’s will get you plenty of people you’ll recognize at The Open, Wimbledon, etc. I went to the BB&T Open in Atlanta recently. We saw plenty of names you’d recognize if you follow the game at all, and plenty of strangers. I remember seeing Nishikori at the Sarasota Open years ago and he was a stranger who stood out. I see he’s #7 right now. Side note: The women want equality in pay. I am ALL FOR equality. So play five set matches....or be quiet. Sorry, just a pet peeve, maybe because Serena pushes the topic. I respectfully disagree that a condition for women to garner more money is to play five set instead of three set matches. The issue of increasing pay outs on the women side has little to do with the number of sets they play as it does with the income their side of the business generates. The three set matches are a good fit for women matches. Players such as Billy Jean King, Martina, Evert, Steffi Graf, Monica Seles and Serena received proportionally less than they should have relative to the income they generated. Historically, Wimbledon significantly under compensated the women side of their tournament even when there was more public interest in their matches compared to the men's side. Serena is a current advocate but she is simply a recent extension of her predecessors fighting to get more money. The only reason why the women now get more is because they fought for it.
Irv Posted August 5, 2019 Posted August 5, 2019 (edited) The mens champion at the same tournament got $384K. That's a pretty wide gap. Edited August 5, 2019 by Irv
Augie Posted August 5, 2019 Posted August 5, 2019 1 hour ago, JohnC said: I respectfully disagree that a condition for women to garner more money is to play five set instead of three set matches. The issue of increasing pay outs on the women side has little to do with the number of sets they play as it does with the income their side of the business generates. The three set matches are a good fit for women matches. Players such as Billy Jean King, Martina, Evert, Steffi Graf, Monica Seles and Serena received proportionally less than they should have relative to the income they generated. Historically, Wimbledon significantly under compensated the women side of their tournament even when there was more public interest in their matches compared to the men's side. Serena is a current advocate but she is simply a recent extension of her predecessors fighting to get more money. The only reason why the women now get more is because they fought for it. That’s fine. I admit I am largely swayed by my dislike of Serena after some up close experience in Key Biscayne. But I still feel the disparity in match play is a real factor. I fully understand it’s more complicated than that. All you have to do is look at US soccer, men vs women, and realize that analyzing the actual revenue generated has to be considered in compensation. But I do think there is some reality to equal work for equal pay. Life is complicated, and it’s not always fair. And Serena can be a very nasty person when the camera isn’t on her, and occasionally when it is. She’s the reason I even mentioned it.
JohnC Posted August 5, 2019 Posted August 5, 2019 27 minutes ago, Augie said: That’s fine. I admit I am largely swayed by my dislike of Serena after some up close experience in Key Biscayne. But I still feel the disparity in match play is a real factor. I fully understand it’s more complicated than that. All you have to do is look at US soccer, men vs women, and realize that analyzing the actual revenue generated has to be considered in compensation. But I do think there is some reality to equal work for equal pay. Life is complicated, and it’s not always fair. And Serena can be a very nasty person when the camera isn’t on her, and occasionally when it is. She’s the reason I even mentioned it. It's not surprising that a public figure's persona doesn't always reflect the reality of who that person is. Bill Cosby was an iconic figure who represented a reassuring paternal figure. In private he was a monster who drugged and raped women at a frightening level. With respect to Serena being likable or not doesn't mean that the cause she is promoting is wrong. The issue is the issue. Your wife is a successful banker in a profession dominated by men. I'm sure that she will tell you that the salary scale in her challenging profession isn't always fairly applied between men and women. It's indisputable that the pay gap is closing between men and women but that gap is getting closer not because women were passive about the issue but because they fought for equity on that issue. A very long time ago I was in the vicinity of Barbara Streisand and a situation she was in. OMG! Compared to her Serena is a lovable charmer.
Augie Posted August 5, 2019 Posted August 5, 2019 1 hour ago, JohnC said: It's not surprising that a public figure's persona doesn't always reflect the reality of who that person is. Bill Cosby was an iconic figure who represented a reassuring paternal figure. In private he was a monster who drugged and raped women at a frightening level. With respect to Serena being likable or not doesn't mean that the cause she is promoting is wrong. The issue is the issue. Your wife is a successful banker in a profession dominated by men. I'm sure that she will tell you that the salary scale in her challenging profession isn't always fairly applied between men and women. It's indisputable that the pay gap is closing between men and women but that gap is getting closer not because women were passive about the issue but because they fought for equity on that issue. A very long time ago I was in the vicinity of Barbara Streisand and a situation she was in. OMG! Compared to her Serena is a lovable charmer. No one is more for equality than me, for reasons you cited. And the women put in just as many hours as the men, often more. Not a fraction of what the men do, as in tennis. Serena was having her fit in front of dozens of little kids, and you could tell it was SOP. That’s part of why it struck me so hard. I used to like her, but that turned on a dime! On a related note, Federer walked by with dozens of kids following him, and he’s the real deal. My all-time favorite player and that’s part of why. In a perfect world you compensate based upon revenue generated, but I realize that’s not as easy as it sounds. In my wife’s world, salaries are in a pretty tight range, and the biggest money comes in bonuses which are currently determined by a formula in a grid. The math does recognize gender, but of course you are correct. The top of the pyramid is mostly male. Her immediate group is unusually female controlled. Anyway, as you can tell I’m not a Serena fan....that’s how/why this started. ? Have a great night!
Lenigmusx Posted August 5, 2019 Posted August 5, 2019 (edited) 2 hours ago, Irv said: The mens champion at the same tournament got $384K. That's a pretty wide gap. The men’s tournament is a ATP 500 level which is a larger scale tournament. The women’s tournament is a WTA 280 level. This doesn’t not mean it is anything to scoff at. If you play and or follow professional tennis at all you know the level of athleticism and dedication to win any tournament on the WTA or ATP is extraordinary. This is a big deal and the people who are down playing the accomplishment on here just don’t understand how competitive and demanding the sport is. They only have a month long off season? that’s it it’s almost year round. Edited August 5, 2019 by Lenigmusx 1
Cripple Creek Posted August 5, 2019 Posted August 5, 2019 29 minutes ago, Augie said: Have a great night! So, you hate all women or just some of them?
Augie Posted August 5, 2019 Posted August 5, 2019 4 minutes ago, Cripple Creek said: So, you hate all women or just some of them? I have four on my approved list. The rest should be barefoot and pregnant in the kitchen. Duh! ? 2
Augie Posted August 5, 2019 Posted August 5, 2019 23 minutes ago, Lenigmusx said: The men’s tournament is a ATP 500 level which is a larger scale tournament. The women’s tournament is a WTA 280 level. This doesn’t not mean it is anything to scoff at. If you play and or follow professional tennis at all you know the level of athleticism and dedication to win any tournament on the WTA or ATP is extraordinary. This is a big deal and the people who are down playing the accomplishment on here just don’t understand how competitive and demanding the sport is. They only have a month long off season? that’s it it’s almost year round. No doubt about it, it’s grueling! My old club in Florida had guys who played satellite tournaments after college and would tell stories of how hard it was. The teaching pro where we lived was AMAZING! Played then coached at FSU. Jimmy Arias and Dave McPherson (then the Bryan Bros coach) said Ty definitely had the stuff to give it a very good run on the tour. He had a wife and kids, and he just hated the idea of the lifestyle. He chose family. So he made a good steady living running the club and teaching. Last time I was there his son was #3 in the 14 and unders...in Florida. That’s pretty darn impressive. They come from all over the world to train and compete in Florida. 1
Dr. Who Posted August 5, 2019 Posted August 5, 2019 4 hours ago, JohnC said: It's not surprising that a public figure's persona doesn't always reflect the reality of who that person is. Bill Cosby was an iconic figure who represented a reassuring paternal figure. In private he was a monster who drugged and raped women at a frightening level. With respect to Serena being likable or not doesn't mean that the cause she is promoting is wrong. The issue is the issue. Your wife is a successful banker in a profession dominated by men. I'm sure that she will tell you that the salary scale in her challenging profession isn't always fairly applied between men and women. It's indisputable that the pay gap is closing between men and women but that gap is getting closer not because women were passive about the issue but because they fought for equity on that issue. A very long time ago I was in the vicinity of Barbara Streisand and a situation she was in. OMG! Compared to her Serena is a lovable charmer. Babs even more annoying than Serena. I'm shocked.
ChevyVanMiller Posted August 6, 2019 Posted August 6, 2019 19 hours ago, Lenigmusx said: The men’s tournament is a ATP 500 level which is a larger scale tournament. The women’s tournament is a WTA 280 level. This doesn’t not mean it is anything to scoff at. If you play and or follow professional tennis at all you know the level of athleticism and dedication to win any tournament on the WTA or ATP is extraordinary. This is a big deal and the people who are down playing the accomplishment on here just don’t understand how competitive and demanding the sport is. They only have a month long off season? that’s it it’s almost year round. The guys downplaying it are probably still basking off of the glow of the one time they touched the ball in Pop Warner football. 1
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