Figster Posted July 21, 2019 Posted July 21, 2019 7 minutes ago, Gugny said: Bottom line (to me) is that they are both the GOATs in their respective fields. There's a reason that none of the other elite QBs during Brady's tenure has more than 2 Super Bowl wins. I think that reason is that none of the other QBs have had a coach/GM like Brady had. Alas, we get stuck playing them twice a year and in all likeihood a 3rd time to advance in the playoffs. Yippee! Then along came Josh/McD...
mannc Posted July 21, 2019 Posted July 21, 2019 (edited) 25 minutes ago, Happy Gilmore said: Seems to be the most likely explanation. The Pats have the right combination of coach, GM, QB, and an owner who did not get in the way. Assuming Belichick sticks around after Brady retires, we may finally get an answer to this question. Me, I’m expecting the Pats to continue to dominate in the post-Brady era. With their new emphasis on the ground game, Belichick is already setting the stage. And every year, the Pats seem to have more draft picks than anyone else. It’s very frustrating because there never seems to be any light at the end of this particular tunnel. Edited July 21, 2019 by mannc
Patrick Duffy Posted July 21, 2019 Posted July 21, 2019 (edited) Everybody knows the refs are the most responsible giving them all the calls, not calling the obvious holding calls, and continuous second chances!!!! ? ? Edited July 21, 2019 by Patrick_Duffy
Chris66 Posted July 21, 2019 Posted July 21, 2019 1 hour ago, Boatdrinks said: But are they as good ? Even removing the divisional advantage that Brady has enjoyed throughout the run ( no other good QBs in the East) , stats and talent alone don’t = winning football. I can’t stand Brady, but I know what I see. The guy just rarely has a bad day, makes very few mistakes and almost never makes more mistakes than the QB across from him. He does this more consistently than any QB I’ve seen. So, I’m not sure your theory holds water. Who says those QBs are as good as Brady, game in and game out ? Certainly the New England offensive staff/ system deserves some credit. Their system has arguably been the best and most consistent in the last dozen years or so. That’s not Belichick’s side of the ball ( let me guess , you’ll give him credit for the offense as well). The greater point though, is stats and media accolades don’t mean those QBs are interchangeable with Brady. If thats not Belichicks side of the ball, then who is it? If you say McDaniels. Who made him the coach that he is today. That entire organization is BB.
Boatdrinks Posted July 21, 2019 Posted July 21, 2019 10 minutes ago, mannc said: Assuming Belichick sticks around after Brady retires, we may finally get an answer to this question. Me, I’m expecting the Pats to continue to dominate in the post-Brady era. With their new emphasis on the ground game, Belichick is already setting the stage. And every year, the Pats seem to have more draft picks than anyone else. It’s very frustrating because there never seems to be any light at the end of this particular tunnel. So they will continue to dominate by running the ball ? Why would they try to do this? Oh , because : no Brady. There’s your answer right there. You appear to be shell shocked by the Pats beyond all logic. This isn’t 1975, no team is going to dominate with a ground game in this era. Anyway, I think B.B. doesn’t risk tarnishing his legacy and exits around the same time as Brady.
Happy Posted July 21, 2019 Posted July 21, 2019 11 minutes ago, mannc said: Assuming Belichick sticks around after Brady retires, we may finally get an answer to this question. Me, I’m expecting the Pats to continue to dominate in the post-Brady era. With their new emphasis on the ground game, Belichick is already setting the stage. And every year, the Pats seem to have more draft picks than anyone else. It’s very frustrating because there never seems to be any light at the end of this particular tunnel. Once Brady retires, I would suspect they will still be competitive but not dominant like they have been; assuming BB sticks around. Brady is a smart QB who has seen every defense thrown at him, executes their version of the E-P system to perfection, will be near impossible to replace. 1
mannc Posted July 21, 2019 Posted July 21, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, Boatdrinks said: So they will continue to dominate by running the ball ? Why would they try to do this? Oh , because : no Brady. There’s your answer right there. You appear to be shell shocked by the Pats beyond all logic. This isn’t 1975, no team is going to dominate with a ground game in this era. Anyway, I think B.B. doesn’t risk tarnishing his legacy and exits around the same time as Brady. Modern defenses are designed to stop the pass. Belichick is creating an offense that will exploit that tendency, while at the same time relying less on QB brilliance, as Brady’s limitations become more apparent and the team transitions to a new QB. That may change if and when they find a new franchise QB. The run-first post-Brady Pats might not be dominant, but they certainly won’t be the pushover many Bills fans seem to expect. Edited July 21, 2019 by mannc
Talley56 Posted July 21, 2019 Posted July 21, 2019 I don’t understand how Belichick is ahead here. Prior to Brady he had done nothing as a head coach. Aside from one playoff season his record with the Browns was lousy. 5-10 in his first season with NE. 0-2 to begin his 2nd season. Then Brady takes over and suddenly he finally starts winning. Yes they have been great ever since but that has been with Brady. What am I missing here? 1
Boatdrinks Posted July 21, 2019 Posted July 21, 2019 39 minutes ago, Talley56 said: I don’t understand how Belichick is ahead here. Prior to Brady he had done nothing as a head coach. Aside from one playoff season his record with the Browns was lousy. 5-10 in his first season with NE. 0-2 to begin his 2nd season. Then Brady takes over and suddenly he finally starts winning. Yes they have been great ever since but that has been with Brady. What am I missing here? Years of media driven conditioning to believe in the mystical powers of Belichick, rather than just believing what your eyes see. It’s overridden common sense at this point. The closest parallel in the modern passing era is the 49ers. Their success continued under a lesser HC due to the QB and an incredibly good immediate replacement. That Brady has done it without anything close to a Jerry Rice at WR is even more astounding. He’s the most consistent performer I’ve ever seen at QB. His few bad outings are the only time they lose. Other than that it takes a truly superior performance by the opposing QB , such as Foles in the SB vs Eagles. . 2
stuvian Posted July 22, 2019 Posted July 22, 2019 I've never thought Brady was special. Any QB who has half an hour to throw the ball can make the completion
Hapless Bills Fan Posted July 22, 2019 Posted July 22, 2019 8 minutes ago, stuvian said: I've never thought Brady was special. Any QB who has half an hour to throw the ball can make the completion Brady doesn't have half an hour to throw the ball. Though it does seem like it some times. 2
mannc Posted July 22, 2019 Posted July 22, 2019 5 hours ago, stuvian said: I've never thought Brady was special. Any QB who has half an hour to throw the ball can make the completion Agreed. Brady is obviously JAG. Great take.
Nihilarian Posted July 22, 2019 Posted July 22, 2019 18 hours ago, C.Biscuit97 said: There’s zero evidence of this and Belichick was a losing head coach before Brady. Those are proven facts. The 1994 11-5 Cleveland Browns beg to differ... and that was with Vinnie Testaverde at QB! 11-5 with that roster of bums... The 1995 Browns went into the tank the next season for very specific reasons. They started the 95 season 3-1. Although, there were significant rumors about the team needing to be sold because the owner was in deep financial trouble. The Browns started to falter and by the time week 9 arrived they were 4-4. After the next game the Browns owner, Art Modell suddenly announced the team was moving from Cleveland to Baltimore after the season. Needless to say, the team stunned by that news, the floor fell out and the team collapsed. After that the Browns only won one game and Belichick was fired. Had Modell kept Belichick as HC with the Baltimore Ravens and with Ozzie Newsome as director of pro personnel who move to director of football operations, later to GM. I think the history/story of both the Patriots/Ravens would be very, very different today. 1
Kemp Posted July 22, 2019 Posted July 22, 2019 On 7/20/2019 at 1:21 PM, Boatdrinks said: The Bills defense lost the game by allowing 40 minutes of possession time to a plodding, dinosaur offense. Many tackles were missed and execution was sloppy. The Bills offense scored 17 points in 19 minutes of possession. I’ve always thought the legend of Belichicks role in Supe XXV was vastly exaggerated. Seriously, a kick drifts two feet to the left and B.B. is a footnote in that game. Fans in all sports usually look at results as a credit or indictment of their team, disregarding the other team.
Boatdrinks Posted July 22, 2019 Posted July 22, 2019 2 minutes ago, Kemp said: Fans in all sports usually look at results as a credit or indictment of their team, disregarding the other team. That would include NYG and Belichick fans.
Kemp Posted July 22, 2019 Posted July 22, 2019 1 minute ago, Boatdrinks said: That would include NYG and Belichick fans. Of course, but as a Bills fan, I can still appreciate the greats on other teams. A lot of fans can't or won't do this. Not directed at you. I don't know you. People who constantly rip Brady and Belichick would be their biggest boosters if they were Bills, so I don't take them seriously. 1
Boatdrinks Posted July 22, 2019 Posted July 22, 2019 1 minute ago, Kemp said: Of course, but as a Bills fan, I can still appreciate the greats on other teams. A lot of fans can't or won't do this. Not directed at you. I don't know you. People who constantly rip Brady and Belichick would be their biggest boosters if they were Bills, so I don't take them seriously. Likewise. The greater point of my analysis was not to discredit, but rather to state that the matchup between the NYG offense and the Bills defense had a much greater impact on the outcome of the game. Far more than the much ballyhooed B.B. led defense vs the Bills offense. In fact, the Bills offense produced exactly the same amount of points that it did in their victory over the Giants in NY several weeks prior. The defense, however was a different story. It was telling that Parcells stated “ power football wins” and cited the soft middle of the Bills D line when exalting in the win immediately after the game.
Green Lightning Posted July 25, 2019 Posted July 25, 2019 On 7/21/2019 at 12:26 PM, C.Biscuit97 said: There’s zero evidence of this and Belichick was a losing head coach before Brady. Those are proven facts. He won 10 games with a washout quarterback. He put Brady in the perfect system with the perfect tools and the perfect scheme. Brady would still not have anywhere near the same success with multiple coaches like most quarterbacks have in their careers.
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