John from Riverside Posted July 10, 2019 Posted July 10, 2019 Which one of these unsigned guys the most likely to bust you think?
plenzmd1 Posted July 10, 2019 Posted July 10, 2019 (edited) 6 hours ago, Kirby Jackson said: This x 1,0000!!! If I were an owner I’d immediately concede on it. It feels cheap and threatening. If I were a GM and couldn’t concede on this I’d be watching out because CLEARLY ownership doesn’t trust me. Offset is not the only negotiating point..timing of the bonus matters a ton too. Older Bosa argued over offset true, but Chargers wanted to pay signing bonus over installments..i think 3 payments over the course of the year but i could be wrong there. May not seem like a big deal...but think of $18 M or whatever and what that earns in a year..it matters quick search yielded this https://ftw.usatoday.com/2016/08/the-joey-bosa-chargers-contract-dispute-explained Edited July 10, 2019 by plenzmd1 1
Orlando Buffalo Posted July 10, 2019 Posted July 10, 2019 Just now, plenzmd1 said: Offset is not the only negotiating point..timing of the bonus matters a ton too. Older Bosa argued over offset true, but Chargers wanted to pay signing bonus over installments..i think 3 payments over the course of the year but i could be wrong there. May not seem like a big deal...but think of $18 M or whatever and what that earns in a year..it matters if you have big plans for investment the timing of bonus is big to the player- but not the owner- that kind of haggling is odd to me since it will be paid. the offsets i get since it can effect salary cap.
plenzmd1 Posted July 10, 2019 Posted July 10, 2019 1 minute ago, Buffalo Timmy said: if you have big plans for investment the timing of bonus is big to the player- but not the owner- that kind of haggling is odd to me since it will be paid. the offsets i get since it can effect salary cap. TPegs has the money flow..no issue. Spanos not so much. I am actually surprised do not hear this more with Bengal draft picks
BubbaT Posted July 10, 2019 Posted July 10, 2019 (edited) I don't miss the holdouts. Hoping Q Williams holds out till game 2 of the regular season Edited July 10, 2019 by BubbaT 2
Saxum Posted July 10, 2019 Posted July 10, 2019 32 minutes ago, plenzmd1 said: Offset is not the only negotiating point..timing of the bonus matters a ton too. Older Bosa argued over offset true, but Chargers wanted to pay signing bonus over installments..i think 3 payments over the course of the year but i could be wrong there. May not seem like a big deal...but think of $18 M or whatever and what that earns in a year..it matters quick search yielded this https://ftw.usatoday.com/2016/08/the-joey-bosa-chargers-contract-dispute-explained I think some players / agents just want to bust balls so that in future negotiations you concede faster.
The Wiz Posted July 10, 2019 Posted July 10, 2019 8 hours ago, Johnny Hammersticks said: Daniel Jones is soooooo doomed. I think he's holding out so he doesn't have to play. Not because of the contract language. 1
Saxum Posted July 11, 2019 Posted July 11, 2019 52 minutes ago, The Wiz said: I think he's holding out so he doesn't have to play. Not because of the contract language. It is possible he does not want to play during first year of NFL and this is his way to get his way. Then Giants QB will be injured and he will be forced to play with less training.
Albany,n.y. Posted July 11, 2019 Posted July 11, 2019 9 hours ago, Buffalo716 said: Those are 2 instances like 35 years ago TONS of players signed with the USFL and the AFL etc over the NFL back in the day. It didn't mean those teams were inept It means the USFL teams offered more money or Playing time or both If we lost a player to the CFL in 01 you'd have a more valid point but cousineau is soooo long ago There hasn't been a league that considered itself major league since the USFL. Ralph was cheap, scrimping on coaches, GMs, players and scouts. I wouldn't be surprised if he underpaid the waterboy. I don't know how old you are, but we old timers saw Ralph being cheap time after time driving away good coaches (best example Chuck Knox) and hiring inept coaches on the cheap like Kay Stephenson & Hank Bullough, and who among us old timers can forget him forcing Harvey Johnson to coach twice, the 2nd time after the John Rauch debacle in 1971 where he quit after disparaging former players on WBEN 4 days before camp opened and after Ralph said he was going public to defend the 2 former Bills (McDole & Maguire) Rauch quit 5 days after camp opened. There were many seasons where Ralph's Bills were the laughingstock of the NFL mainly due to Ralph's antics. I have no animosity towards Ralph, but he was cheap and at times a control freak whose bad decisions led to many a losing season. I remember the days when the Bills went like this. The team would be good, attendance would be good. Ralph would do something to screw it up, attendance would drop to an embarrassing level. Ralph would then spend money to get people back in the stadium. Ralph would get complacent, again do something to screw it up, and attendance would drop. Rinse & Repeat. I lived a mile & a half from the stadium in 1977. I walked to the 1st 2 games. I didn't go to another one the rest of the season. I was not alone, I would drive past the stadium on Gameday Sundays to go to a laundromat in Hamburg & there were a ton of empty seats I could see from the road as I drove by. After that year he hired Chuck Knox to get people to come back & build a winner. After he alienated Knox & he left the same nonsense happened again in the early-mid 1980s. Finally he lucked out & got a young Bill Polian who brought his mentor Marv Levy to coach & they finally had a powerful team. Eventually he fired Polian, mainly because Polian didn't want advice from Ralph's Daughter & said nasty things about her. You can't lose players to another league if there's no competition, so you have to go back 35-40 years. The CFL gave up on signing top USA college players long ago, gone are the days when they competed. Before Cousineau there was Johnny Rodgers in the early 70s, but only Cousineau was the #1 overall pick to sign with the CFL. One of the few players to jump to the CFL as a veteran was Vince Ferragamo. The CFL competing ended in the 90s with the last major signee from an American college being Rocket Ismail. By 2001 the CFL had stopped competing, so your last sentence wasn't possible anymore. A more recent example of the Bills lowballing a player and him wanting out was Jason Peters. In a league where franchise LTs are like gold, the Bills wouldn't pay him his worth and he forced a trade right when he was entering his prime. 1
Thurman#1 Posted July 11, 2019 Posted July 11, 2019 3 hours ago, Limeaid said: It is possible he does not want to play during first year of NFL and this is his way to get his way. Then Giants QB will be injured and he will be forced to play with less training. If he doesn't want to play yet, a one-minute conversation with coaches would accomplish that. A holdout would not be needed.
YoloinOhio Posted July 11, 2019 Posted July 11, 2019 12 hours ago, plenzmd1 said: Offset is not the only negotiating point..timing of the bonus matters a ton too. Older Bosa argued over offset true, but Chargers wanted to pay signing bonus over installments..i think 3 payments over the course of the year but i could be wrong there. May not seem like a big deal...but think of $18 M or whatever and what that earns in a year..it matters quick search yielded this https://ftw.usatoday.com/2016/08/the-joey-bosa-chargers-contract-dispute-explained And it had something to do with the California tax rates. 12 hours ago, Buffalo Timmy said: if you have big plans for investment the timing of bonus is big to the player- but not the owner- that kind of haggling is odd to me since it will be paid. the offsets i get since it can effect salary cap. Chargers didn’t want to concede the bonus timing because it was a long-standing precedent. They had never done it before. As I recall, (didn’t look it up) they didn’t do it for him either. The offset was the issue they gave in to.
White Linen Posted July 11, 2019 Posted July 11, 2019 This is why your Mom should be your agent/manager. 1
Captain Hindsight Posted July 11, 2019 Posted July 11, 2019 7 minutes ago, Doc said: These 5 guys...and Dawson Knox. Amirite? you are not, he is signed
YoloinOhio Posted July 11, 2019 Posted July 11, 2019 7 minutes ago, Doc said: These 5 guys...and Dawson Knox. Amirite? Not sure if tongue in cheek but Knox is signed
BarleyNY Posted July 11, 2019 Posted July 11, 2019 2 hours ago, YoloinOhio said: And it had something to do with the California tax rates. Chargers didn’t want to concede the bonus timing because it was a long-standing precedent. They had never done it before. As I recall, (didn’t look it up) they didn’t do it for him either. The offset was the issue they gave in to. The Chargers have traditionally taken some very hard lines on contracts. IIRC the Bosa contract was held up by the Chargers not giving into offsets that players taken with his pick (and picks after his) had been getting. Bosa was literally just asking for what was standard practice and the hold up was due to the Chargers were trying to walk that back.
YoloinOhio Posted July 11, 2019 Posted July 11, 2019 26 minutes ago, BarleyNY said: The Chargers have traditionally taken some very hard lines on contracts. IIRC the Bosa contract was held up by the Chargers not giving into offsets that players taken with his pick (and picks after his) had been getting. Bosa was literally just asking for what was standard practice and the hold up was due to the Chargers were trying to walk that back. It was offsets and SB payout timing. They always pay it out in increments into the next year, he wanted it all up front so he could start earning interest on it. They gave in on the offsets I think.
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