Pro football talk hates Buffalo - CBA and stadium funding

[Augie]

23 minutes ago, Joe in Winslow said:

 

Moving teams is rare? Really?

Yeah, seems odd to call it “rare” given the short term rash, but over time? And after the shuffling, where are you going to go? LA was a threat forever, now they have two. Vegas seemed a long shot, until it didn’t.

 

Regardless, I love what appears to be our current stability concerning location. How many years has it been since you felt this comfortable? 

[Mr. WEO]

23 minutes ago, Joe in Winslow said:

 

Moving teams is rare? Really?

 

Very rare.  Really.

 

Since the merger (that was 53 years ago, for reference) there have been only 9 team moves.  5 of those 9 involved the Rams and Raiders.  That leaves 4 moves for the other 30 teams currently in the league.

 

Also, Oakland and St. Louis LOST teams that won SBs in their cities.  They will never have teams again. 

[Mat68]

Hate?  That is strong.  Mike Folio is always for the players carving out larger stances and portions in terms of contracts and CBA issues.  He has a point that at some point that could become a CBA issues.  An equal party, the NFLPA stands to benefit from the league entering new and possible more emerging markets. 

 

Imo this is a more abstract argument.  Buffalo name is brought 1, they currently are in the middle of a new stadium negotiating.  2.  Buffalo is a small market.  

 

The whole new stadium is tied to Buffalo's success on the feild.  If they become contenders and sell out and have home playoff games they get public money to get a new stadium.  They dont?  Buffalo probably moves if NY wont give them any assistance.

[BullBuchanan]

On 7/2/2019 at 12:14 PM, The 9 Isles said:

 

 

 

 

https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2019/07/02/issue-of-stadium-credits-hovers-over-cba-talks/

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

“Spinning it forward to cities that currently have stadium issues, the NFLPA would/should/could have influence over the stadium solution in Buffalo. What if, collectively, the NFL’s workforce deems it prudent to have its own money spent in a different market? A market where the return on the investment could be greater? A market where more NFL players would prefer to live and to work?”

Why would NFL players care about the stadium? They're onsite for 8 days a year and not as fans. The playing surface is good (if not better) than any in the league.

[Saxum]

3 minutes ago, BullBuchanan said:

Why would NFL players care about the stadium? They're onsite for 8 days a year and not as fans. The playing surface is good (if not better) than any in the league.

 

From player comments I do not think the Bills' playing surface is as good as any in the league.  It is probably better than surfaces like the Packers whose field becomes permafrost mud in winter but there are a lot of stadiums with better fields and Bills get criticism, some justified and some not, on purchasing from a local supplier.  The one good thing it is not a shared field like some of the converted baseball fields.  Using a baseball field for football is definitely a foul ball.

[The Senator]

On 7/2/2019 at 5:50 PM, RiotAct said:

IANASTH, but if I was... $150/seat, tops.

 

IYWASTH, WYWTS in Orchard Park or downtown?  AWYWADS or open air?

.

[K-9]

3 hours ago, The Senator said:

 

IYWASTH, WYWTS in Orchard Park or downtown?  AWYWADS or open air?

.

English? Please?

[4merper4mer]

On July 7, 2019 at 5:56 PM, Mr. WEO said:

 

Very rare.  Really.

 

Since the merger (that was 53 years ago, for reference) there have been only 9 team moves.  5 of those 9 involved the Rams and Raiders.  That leaves 4 moves for the other 30 teams currently in the league.

 

Also, Oakland and St. Louis LOST teams that won SBs in their cities.  They will never have teams again. 

I'll make this into a quiz for myself and swear off Google.  The other 4:

 

Browns to Balt

Colts to Indy

Cards to zona

Not counting Jets/Giants to Jersey but that was a big deal

Your Pats almost moved to Hartford

Got it.  Oilers.

[The Senator]

5 minutes ago, K-9 said:

English? Please?

 

 

YCDMA?

 

 

 

(You cannot decipher my acronyms?)

.

[BigDingus]

On 7/2/2019 at 1:00 PM, wagon127 said:

I miss the good old days, where the big news every July, was whether Brett Favre would come out of retirement.

 

Why can't it be like that for Brady? 

At least each year I'd have some hope, even if he did return each time. As of the past few years, he has been firm on his position that he's not retiring until 45 or some dumb s***.

Can't he just be happy with I dunno.... SIX FRIGGIN SUPER BOWLS?! You already surpassed everyone with 5, the hell did you need a 6th one for? And why are you still going for more?! Just to make other people miserable? Eat a bag of...well you know.

[wagon127]

8 minutes ago, BigDingus said:

 

Why can't it be like that for Brady? 

At least each year I'd have some hope, even if he did return each time. As of the past few years, he has been firm on his position that he's not retiring until 45 or some dumb s***.

Can't he just be happy with I dunno.... SIX FRIGGIN SUPER BOWLS?! You already surpassed everyone with 5, the hell did you need a 6th one for? And why are you still going for more?! Just to make other people miserable? Eat a bag of...well you know.

That's not Hope! That's like spending the home opener tailgate, realizing I forgot beer for myself. And then my friends ask if I want one of theirs, but then take it away at the last minute.

 

Everything after your 2nd sentence however I completely agree with. Does anybody know what its like to sit right behind the patriots bench at New Era Field? I have a few words that I plan on screaming, and I hope Brady and Belichik can hear me!

Edited July 9, 2019 by wagon127

[Delete This Account]

On 7/3/2019 at 12:32 PM, dave mcbride said:

I honestly don't know, but it being Buffalo, I have a hunch that fans will figure something out.

It's not really fear-mongering though, and in any event do you REALLY think that's the purpose of this particular piece? I certainly don't think so, and I've read it a couple of times. As I've said above, it's the first I've read about the stadium money carve-out, and I think it's an interesting issue. He explained it clearly and well, at least in my opinion.

 

Wait, Dave, I missed this a while back and just catching up.

I've re-read the piece and florio is once again beating a dead horse of a drum, by making sure to spur unsubstantiated fear in Buffalo, because much like cowherd, he gets his kicks out of doing it.

It's a simple and lazy trope. Find the smallest  market team that was supposed to be moving after Ralph Wilson died, realize you were wrong in predicting they would move, and carry the narrative forward by finding yet another reason to punt the ball forward.

 

Let me get this straight, florio is actually suggesting that should the Players Association have a say in where teams should be located by having the right to fund new stadium construction, then the Bills future in western New York is in jeopardy.

I'm not sure I know of any business model in which a union can dictate these terms.

Heck, I'll fund building an AP bureau in Fiji just so I can work there.

 

What florio conveniently continues to ignore and overlook are numerous things:

The Pegulas aren't going to move the team.

Lease agreement non-relocation clauses. They can't be rendered moot simply because players prefer playing in Hawaii.

Relocation is also a matter for the NFL's board of governors. I don't see this conservative group of business people suddenly carving out room at the table in providing players a voice on where they should play. Amusing as it would be, I don't foresee Antonio Brown using an air balloon to arrive at the next owner's meeting, proposing the Raiders avoid moving to Vegas and instead relocate to oh, I don't know, Paris.

 

That Buffalo was used as the example moving forward is florio's MO, in which he conveniently overlooks the case that the Jacksonville Jaguars are considered to be a larger favorite to move than the Bills ever are. And yet, to bring up the Jaguars, it would ruin his point, because the players like Florida.

 

jw

 

 

 

 

 

 

[GG]

22 minutes ago, john wawrow said:

 

Heck, I'll fund building an AP bureau in Fiji just so I can work there.

 

 

 

I'll put in a good word

[dave mcbride]

14 hours ago, john wawrow said:

 

Wait, Dave, I missed this a while back and just catching up.

I've re-read the piece and florio is once again beating a dead horse of a drum, by making sure to spur unsubstantiated fear in Buffalo, because much like cowherd, he gets his kicks out of doing it.

It's a simple and lazy trope. Find the smallest  market team that was supposed to be moving after Ralph Wilson died, realize you were wrong in predicting they would move, and carry the narrative forward by finding yet another reason to punt the ball forward.

 

Let me get this straight, florio is actually suggesting that should the Players Association have a say in where teams should be located by having the right to fund new stadium construction, then the Bills future in western New York is in jeopardy.

I'm not sure I know of any business model in which a union can dictate these terms.

Heck, I'll fund building an AP bureau in Fiji just so I can work there.

 

What florio conveniently continues to ignore and overlook are numerous things:

The Pegulas aren't going to move the team.

Lease agreement non-relocation clauses. They can't be rendered moot simply because players prefer playing in Hawaii.

Relocation is also a matter for the NFL's board of governors. I don't see this conservative group of business people suddenly carving out room at the table in providing players a voice on where they should play. Amusing as it would be, I don't foresee Antonio Brown using an air balloon to arrive at the next owner's meeting, proposing the Raiders avoid moving to Vegas and instead relocate to oh, I don't know, Paris.

 

That Buffalo was used as the example moving forward is florio's MO, in which he conveniently overlooks the case that the Jacksonville Jaguars are considered to be a larger favorite to move than the Bills ever are. And yet, to bring up the Jaguars, it would ruin his point, because the players like Florida.

 

jw

 

 

 

 

 

 

John: thanks for responding. In my experience reading Florio over the years, he has spent far more space discussing a move by Jax than Buffalo (which makes sense because a Jax move to London is actually quite plausible, if not necessarily probable). I just don’t think he has it in for Buffalo. As for whether the union can dictate terms, I’ve never viewed big-time pro sports players associations as unions; they operate far more like guilds. That’s neither good nor bad, but they do certainly have more power relative to management than than the intrinsically replaceable workers who work in most fields. The NFL players have less than NBA and MLB players, I know, but that’s because they’re more replaceable. 

[Saxum]

22 hours ago, GG said:

I'll put in a good word

Me too.