What would a Shaq Lawson contract extension look like for the Buffalo Bills?

[formerlyofCtown]

It depends on what his season looks like and what else is on the market.  Personally I think this is going to be a breakout season for him and several other players.

2 hours ago, SoCal Deek said:

I’m not sure what the fixation is with Lawson. He’s been pretty much invisible his entire career. Yes, he was a first round pick but if he hadn’t been he’d be just another guy on the team. I hear almost nothing about him taking a leadership role, or his mentoring younger players. He’s just sort of...there.

You cant have 11 leaders on a starting D.  He has the job of listening to and supporting those leaders that we already have.

Edited June 22, 2019 by formerlyofCtown

[Virgil]

Whatever it ends up being, I'm sure Rob Ryan will pay him 20% more to play for him

[SoCal Deek]

26 minutes ago, formerlyofCtown said:

 

You cant have 11 leaders on a starting D.  He has the job of listening to and supporting those leaders that we already have.

Will you be OK saying the same thing about Oliver in three years? 

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

6 minutes ago, Virgil said:

Whatever it ends up being, I'm sure Rob Ryan will pay him 20% more to play for him

 

 

...whatever Ryan, be it Wrecks, Rob the Slob, or (deceased) Blowhard Buddy, I'd rather be homeless in LA versus any type of association with these frauds.....

[formerlyofCtown]

3 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said:

Will you be OK saying the same thing about Oliver in three years? 

If someone else is the leader then yes.  The only two players we have that must be leaders in their positions are Allen and Edmonds the signal callers.  The other position groups just need a leader in their groups.

[SoCal Deek]

1 minute ago, formerlyofCtown said:

If someone else is the leader then yes.  The only two players we have that must be leaders in their positions are Allen and Edmonds the signal callers.  The other position groups just need a leader in their groups.

OK let’s leave leadership aside for a second. Will you be OK if Oliver is that invisible in three years? The point is if you’re not going to be a stand out on the field, then one would think you’d be a stand out in the locker room,  training room, or somewhere. I’ve never read anything of the sort about Shaq. With that said I’m certainly rooting for this to be his year.

[formerlyofCtown]

4 minutes ago, SoCal Deek said:

OK let’s leave leadership aside for a second. Will you be OK if Oliver is that invisible in three years? The point is if you’re not going to be a stand out on the field, then one would think you’d be a stand out in the locker room,  training room, or somewhere. I’ve never read anything of the sort about Shaq. With that said I’m certainly rooting for this to be his year.

Hes got one more year to show he can contribute at a higher level as a pass rusher if he wants to get paid.  Otherwise its 7-8 mil per year max.

[Doc Brown]

5 hours ago, BarleyNY said:

 

Yep. You’re right.  I can’t believe I missed that many, but I did. Rare, yes. But not as rare as I thought. 

One option the Bills have IF he does have a great 5th year is place the transitional tag on him if they can't agree on a contract.  That will allow them to pay not quite as much as a franchise tag salary.  You then get to see his value on the open market and have the ability to match that offer.  That's what the Bears did with Fuller when they decided to match the Packers offer.  

 

A lot of time it's the relationship between the organization and the player.  If they took Lawson into a room and said this is what we expect this year for you to sign a premier long term deal here.  If not, we'd love to have you back at a smaller salary as a rotational DE.  There's too many variables to just assume the guy's done here because we didn't pick up his 5th year option.

 

 

[OldTimeAFLGuy]

2 hours ago, formerlyofCtown said:

Hes got one more year to show he can contribute at a higher level as a pass rusher if he wants to get paid.  Otherwise its 7-8 mil per year max.

...so the next question is IF he did that, would you pull the trigger for your forecasted numbers?...probably a depth or rotational role...

[ColoradoBills]

8 hours ago, Ronin said:

Lawson, another in a fairly lengthy string of 1st-round draft busts for us.  

 

He's a backup caliber player whose snap-count % has been around 40% over the past two seasons, an unreliable starter, and who's averaged 3 sacks and 4 TFL per season, and a player with no particular strength.  

I don't think that such production is difficult to get in rounds 3-5 of the draft.  9 players from last year's draft did it, one even being a 6th-rounder.  

To be fair his last 8 games he has averaged 57.4% snaps per game.

That would coincide with McDermott's comments on his improvement as the season went on.

IMO he will be evaluated on his 2019 season and the decisions will be made then.

[Ronin]

46 minutes ago, ColoradoBills said:

To be fair his last 8 games he has averaged 57.4% snaps per game.

That would coincide with McDermott's comments on his improvement as the season went on.

IMO he will be evaluated on his 2019 season and the decisions will be made then.

 

Well, OK, but 57.4% still isn't something  that matches up with being drafted 19th overall, eh.  

 

Also, given those increased reps, one would then also expect increased results.  I those last 8 games he posted three sacks, 1 against McCown halfway thru the 3rd Q in that rout of the Jets.  The other two were on Tannehill in that last game vs. Miami.  

 

Still not seeing any kind of commensurate production much less anything impressive.  

 

I'd guess that McD was sizing him up in case he needed to make a "tough decision" this year as well as how to proceed in the Draft.  

 

Murphy was the one taking the rest of his reps.  He was another of McD & Beane's blase signings that didn't work out as they'd hoped.  Again, I'm guessing that McD was saying to himself "I can't go into next season with both of these guys again" and was trying to figure out which one to keep.  

 

Also, wasn't Lawson only starting, and only getting more reps, because Murphy was banged up again?   Either way, Murphy also wasn't impressive when he played.  They're both very average players at best.  

 

Either way, as I pointed out, you can draft guys in rounds 3-5 that'll give you that kind of production.  No need to pay a player like Lawson more than a low-end contract, if in fact you even want him back.  

 

As to McD's comments on players improving, I wouldn't put a whole lot of credence into that.  Improvement breeds results.  Look at what McD said, for months while pissing into the wind, about Peterman.  That shot quite a bit of McD's credibility.  

 

Murphy's was a whole lot more expensive, so in that way he was the bigger financial bust, but at least the team didn't waste a 1st-round draft pick on him.  I dont' know what we save in cap space if we cut Murphy, but between the two I'd probably keep Lawson.  I don't think that the Murphy signing was a good one at all, one of the most expenive of Beane's along with Lotulolei.  

 

Their team-building strategy is showcased this season.  I'm not particularly optimistic, especially on the offensive side of the ball.  

[LSHMEAB]

1 hour ago, Ronin said:

 

 

Murphy's was a whole lot more expensive, so in that way he was the bigger financial bust, but at least the team didn't waste a 1st-round draft pick on him.  I dont' know what we save in cap space if we cut Murphy, but between the two I'd probably keep Lawson.  I don't think that the Murphy signing was a good one at all, one of the most expenive of Beane's along with Lotulolei.  

They can get out of Murphy's contract quite easily after 2019. If I had to choose, I'd rather pay Lawson if we're talking equal money.

 

In a perfect world, they find a true stud DE in the 2020 offseason and Lawson AND Murphy are very low priority guys.

[Rocky Landing]

3 hours ago, Ronin said:

 

Well, OK, but 57.4% still isn't something  that matches up with being drafted 19th overall, eh.  

 

Also, given those increased reps, one would then also expect increased results.  I those last 8 games he posted three sacks, 1 against McCown halfway thru the 3rd Q in that rout of the Jets.  The other two were on Tannehill in that last game vs. Miami.  

 

Still not seeing any kind of commensurate production much less anything impressive.  

 

I'd guess that McD was sizing him up in case he needed to make a "tough decision" this year as well as how to proceed in the Draft.  

 

Murphy was the one taking the rest of his reps.  He was another of McD & Beane's blase signings that didn't work out as they'd hoped.  Again, I'm guessing that McD was saying to himself "I can't go into next season with both of these guys again" and was trying to figure out which one to keep.  

 

Also, wasn't Lawson only starting, and only getting more reps, because Murphy was banged up again?   Either way, Murphy also wasn't impressive when he played.  They're both very average players at best.  

 

Either way, as I pointed out, you can draft guys in rounds 3-5 that'll give you that kind of production.  No need to pay a player like Lawson more than a low-end contract, if in fact you even want him back.  

 

As to McD's comments on players improving, I wouldn't put a whole lot of credence into that.  Improvement breeds results.  Look at what McD said, for months while pissing into the wind, about Peterman.  That shot quite a bit of McD's credibility.  

 

Murphy's was a whole lot more expensive, so in that way he was the bigger financial bust, but at least the team didn't waste a 1st-round draft pick on him.  I dont' know what we save in cap space if we cut Murphy, but between the two I'd probably keep Lawson.  I don't think that the Murphy signing was a good one at all, one of the most expenive of Beane's along with Lotulolei.  

 

Their team-building strategy is showcased this season.  I'm not particularly optimistic, especially on the offensive side of the ball.  

Lawson was primarily used on likely running downs. Not really fair to fault him for too few sacks. And, to call Murphy "average at best" is to ignore the entire rest of his career.

[ColoradoBills]

15 hours ago, Ronin said:

 

Well, OK, but 57.4% still isn't something  that matches up with being drafted 19th overall, eh.  

 

Also, given those increased reps, one would then also expect increased results.  I those last 8 games he posted three sacks, 1 against McCown halfway thru the 3rd Q in that rout of the Jets.  The other two were on Tannehill in that last game vs. Miami.   

 

Also, wasn't Lawson only starting, and only getting more reps, because Murphy was banged up again?   Either way, Murphy also wasn't impressive when he played.  They're both very average players at best.  

 

Either way, as I pointed out, you can draft guys in rounds 3-5 that'll give you that kind of production.  No need to pay a player like Lawson more than a low-end contract, if in fact you even want him back.  

 

 

Lawson's contract will be determined on his play from last year and this year.  I don't think the 1st round draft position will matter much.

The Murphy/Lawson combo is not a very good situation and something will change about that next year (I'm almost sure).

But, if you combine their cap hits and look at the results from last year it's not as bad as some make out.

 

Next years draft they will probably look at LDE very hard so I don't think they want to use a 3-5 to replace Lawson but a 1-3 to replace both.

That is of course with neither Murphy or Lawson having a great season.

 

LDE will be interesting to watch this season.

[Bangarang]

11 hours ago, Rocky Landing said:

Lawson was primarily used on likely running downs. Not really fair to fault him for too few sacks. And, to call Murphy "average at best" is to ignore the entire rest of his career.

 

It absolutely is fair since he's not good at rushing the passer. 

 

Are you saying Murphy has been better than an average player before coming here?

[BarleyNY]

21 hours ago, Doc Brown said:

One option the Bills have IF he does have a great 5th year is place the transitional tag on him if they can't agree on a contract.  That will allow them to pay not quite as much as a franchise tag salary.  You then get to see his value on the open market and have the ability to match that offer.  That's what the Bears did with Fuller when they decided to match the Packers offer.  

 

A lot of time it's the relationship between the organization and the player.  If they took Lawson into a room and said this is what we expect this year for you to sign a premier long term deal here.  If not, we'd love to have you back at a smaller salary as a rotational DE.  There's too many variables to just assume the guy's done here because we didn't pick up his 5th year option.

 

 

 

While we shouldn’t write off Shaq 100%, I expect the Bills to proceed as if he won’t be.  That said, none of us know the most important piece of information regarding this - the relationship between the Bills and Shaq.  It’s also possible that his play will take a big leap forward, but that’s unlikely.  It it happens, we’ve got a different situation and tagging him would make sense.  Another unlikely situation is that his play falls off significantly. Easy decision there too.

 

Most likely he’ll play at about the same level as last season.  If that happens I’d expect that he’d want to go elsewhere to try to prove himself in a system that fits him better.  He’d probably get a better initial contract and that would be preferable to signing a backup level contract here.  Plus he’d have a chance at a better deal down the road too.  It’d likely net us a comp pick too.

 

We will have to let the season play out before anything happens, obviously.

[Doc Brown]

On 6/22/2019 at 9:23 AM, SoCal Deek said:

I’m not sure what the fixation is with Lawson. He’s been pretty much invisible his entire career. Yes, he was a first round pick but if he hadn’t been he’d be just another guy on the team. I hear almost nothing about him taking a leadership role, or his mentoring younger players. He’s just sort of...there.

You answered your own question which means he was given a 1st round grade and may still have some untapped potential.  The good thing about this regime is they won't accept a Chris Kelsay level starter at the DE position so if he doesn't improve he's probably gone.

Edited June 23, 2019 by Doc Brown

[SoCal Deek]

2 minutes ago, Doc Brown said:

You answered your own question which means he was given a 1st round grade and may still have some untapped potential.  The good thing about this regime is they won't except a Chris Kelsay level starter at the DE position so if he doesn't improve he's probably gone.

My comment was somewhat rhetorical. I’m expecting big things from Lawson this year. If not, time to move on.

[Rocket94]

3 hours ago, ColoradoBills said:

 

Lawson's contract will be determined on his play from last year and this year.  I don't think the 1st round draft position will matter much.

The Murphy/Lawson combo is not a very good situation and something will change about that next year (I'm almost sure).

But, if you combine their cap hits and look at the results from last year it's not as bad as some make out.

 

Next years draft they will probably look at LDE very hard so I don't think they want to use a 3-5 to replace Lawson but a 1-3 to replace both.

That is of course with neither Murphy or Lawson having a great season.

 

LDE will be interesting to watch this season.

You can be sure the DE position will change. Lawson of course is a carryover from the Ryan experiment and Murphy was signed as a band aid based on his potential if he could get healthy. If we were not searching for our QB, we could have devoted more resources   to finding a DE. Now we hopefully can.

Edited June 23, 2019 by Rocket94

[ColoradoBills]

19 minutes ago, Rocket94 said:

You can be sure the DE position will change. Lawson of course is a carryover from the Ryan experiment and Murphy was signed as a band aid based on his potential if he could get healthy. If we were not searching for our QB, we could have devoted more energy in to finding a DE. Now we hopefully can.

 

Odds are LDE is in play but April of 2020 is a long way away.  Definitely know more after this season.