Pit Bull Terriers: Should we require background checks and licensing?

[Johnny Hammersticks]

2 hours ago, Gugny said:

 

I'm sorry, but I still say BS.

 

Agreed.  “Risk of aggression” is much different than “risk of being horribly disfigured or dead.”

 

A chihuahua might be 50x more aggressive than a pit bull, but I’d take a chihuahua attack 100 times out of 100 over a pit bull attack.

[Needle]

On 6/7/2019 at 9:00 PM, GoBills808 said:

 

I hate to keep repeating myself but it really sounds like the majority of people’s issues lie with the owners rather than the dog.

This is true but we can't eradicate morons from society unfortunately. Go to any shelter, in any city, and spend a couple hours watching the people drooling over this breed. I have very little faith in the average dog owner. 

 

They get a bad rap because of the long well documented history of violence. There are far too many outlets that hand these dogs out to anyone.

[GoBills808]

34 minutes ago, Johnny Hammersticks said:

 

Agreed.  “Risk of aggression” is much different than “risk of being horribly disfigured or dead.”

 

A chihuahua might be 50x more aggressive than a pit bull, but I’d take a chihuahua attack 100 times out of 100 over a pit bull attack.

 

3 hours ago, Gugny said:

 

I'm sorry, but I still say BS.

 

I put the study in the thread to make my point about the fallacy of certain breeds being more likely to attack humans, which was my point throughout. People can make their own choices about acceptable levels of risk or danger, obviously.

 

Cars, for example, are easily 50x more dangerous to humans than airplanes. But when you crash in an airplane, the chance of death is almost 100% whereas it's significantly lower in a car. 

[Royale with Cheese]

https://www.forbes.com/sites/niallmccarthy/2018/09/13/americas-most-dangerous-dog-breeds-infographic/#55db1bf362f8

 

https://www.msn.com/en-us/lifestyle/pets/21-dogs-that-have-attacked-the-most-people/ss-BBIJw3H#image=22

 

#1. Pit bull

Attacks doing bodily harm: 3,397
Deaths: 295

Pit bulls are a dog type that encompasses several breeds such as the American Staffordshire Terrier and Bull Terrier. These dominant and powerful dogs, made headlines a staggering 3,397 times with harmful attacks resulting in 295 deaths over the 32 year period of the study.

[GoBills808]

4 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

https://www.forbes.com/sites/niallmccarthy/2018/09/13/americas-most-dangerous-dog-breeds-infographic/#55db1bf362f8

 

https://www.msn.com/en-us/lifestyle/pets/21-dogs-that-have-attacked-the-most-people/ss-BBIJw3H#image=22

 

#1. Pit bull

Attacks doing bodily harm: 3,397
Deaths: 295

Pit bulls are a dog type that encompasses several breeds such as the American Staffordshire Terrier and Bull Terrier. These dominant and powerful dogs, made headlines a staggering 3,397 times with harmful attacks resulting in 295 deaths over the 32 year period of the study.

 

That chart is pretty useless in determining ‘most dangerous dog breeds’ without accompanying statistics on the specific amount of dogs per breed listed in the US.

[teef]

i think i'd be more comfortable putting my face near a wood chipper than a pit bull.  

[Royale with Cheese]

5 minutes ago, GoBills808 said:

 

That chart is pretty useless in determining ‘most dangerous dog breeds’ without accompanying statistics on the specific amount of dogs per breed listed in the US.

 

Not it's not useless.

 

This chart tells you specifically which dogs have caused the most injuries and fatalities.  It is without question, the Pit Bull and there's not a close second.

2 minutes ago, teef said:

i think i'd be more comfortable putting my face near a wood chipper than a pit bull.  

 

I am a firm believer it's the owner more than the dog. That's the problem.  The pit bull seems to be the dog that gets aggressive when mistreated more than any other breed.

[teef]

4 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

Not it's not useless.

 

This chart tells you specifically which dogs have caused the most injuries and fatalities.  It is without question, the Pit Bull and there's not a close second.

i'm actually blown away that labs are on the list.  if i raise my voice, my dog gets nervous and runs for my office.

[GoBills808]

1 minute ago, Royale with Cheese said:

 

Not it's not useless.

 

This chart tells you specifically which dogs have caused the most injuries and fatalities.  It is without question, the Pit Bull and there's not a close second.

 

Could that possibly be because there are so many dogs in the US that would fall under the 'pit bull' category? It's like saying Toyotas are more dangerous than Ferraris because they're involved in so many more crashes.

[teef]

5 minutes ago, Royale with Cheese said:

.

 

I am a firm believer it's the owner more than the dog. That's the problem.  The pit bull seems to be the dog that gets aggressive when mistreated more than any other breed.

i think that's a massive part of it too.  i'd be willing to be 75% (if not more) of the people who own pits are not fit to do so.  mix that in with a dog that has the ability to do damage, and there ya go.  mostly owner, still part breed.

[Royale with Cheese]

15 minutes ago, teef said:

i think that's a massive part of it too.  i'd be willing to be 75% (if not more) of the people who own pits are not fit to do so.  mix that in with a dog that has the ability to do damage, and there ya go.  mostly owner, still part breed.

 

That's why 75% of the shelters are filled with pit bulls.

[Gugny]

25 minutes ago, teef said:

i'm actually blown away that labs are on the list.  if i raise my voice, my dog gets nervous and runs for my office.

 

My neighbor's black lab has some sort of very real anxiety problem.  If my neighbor is walking him, once he sees or hears people, he turns around and wants to go right home.  He won't even let me pet him.

 

[Royale with Cheese]

1 hour ago, GoBills808 said:

 

Could that possibly be because there are so many dogs in the US that would fall under the 'pit bull' category? It's like saying Toyotas are more dangerous than Ferraris because they're involved in so many more crashes.

 

Possibly but doubt it.  

 

As you can see, the total sum of the other 9 in the top 10 aren't even at the number of the Pit bull for fatalities. It's that combination of these types terriers that seems to have the aggressiveness come out. 

 

I've seen some pretty aggressive pit bulls in my time.  They were fenced in but man would have ripped my flesh open if they got out.

 

An old neighbor's pit bull used to get out of my old neighborhood a lot.  It's the reason why my son is afraid of bigger dogs.  The dog roamed into my yard, my son was inside the fence.  My son walked towards him when he was little over 2.  When he got within about 10 feet from him, the dog started snarling at him, teeth came out and the hair on his back went up...he was getting in attack mode.  I had a can of oil that I was putting on the chain that I threw at the dog....hit him and dog ran away.  Didn't see him come back ever after that.

 

My mom was bitten by one in our neighborhood.  She was walking, the dog got out of the fence and went after my mom.  It took a chunk out of her hip and she now has nerve damage.  This was 3 years ago and she has scars now from the teeth....circular/round scars. 

My parent's got $50,000 from the family after a settlement.  The thing is, that was a friendly dog that I've pet before and a house my mom has walked by daily.  The dog was fine but then for whatever reason, went after my mom that afternoon.  Dog was put to sleep after.

 

When I lived in LA, my neighbor had 5 pit bulls in his back yard.  One night, I hear the loudest dog scream I've ever heard.  I look out my window as I'm on the second floor....one pit ripped apart another pit.  Blood everywhere.....crushed the neck.  Neighbor comes out, he drags the body of the dead dog to the other end of the yard and bury it....then walks inside after....like it was no big deal.

 

I love all dogs and not afraid of pit bulls...but I am when my 4 year old son is around. They've never attacked me personally but seen them being aggressive and read too many stories of them mauling.

Edited June 10, 2019 by Royale with Cheese

[stony]

28 minutes ago, Gugny said:

 

My neighbor's black lab has some sort of very real anxiety problem.  If my neighbor is walking him, once he sees or hears people, he turns around and wants to go right home.  He won't even let me pet him.

 

I'm curious if labs and golden retrievers have a higher COI than most other breeds.  

[GoBills808]

I have owned these types of dogs (pit bull mixes, usually w/ some sort of hound like Catahoula thrown in) for the last 10-odd years off and on. No issues whatsoever. So our personal experiences notwithstanding, my point about the graphic was that there are probably in the range of 6-1 pitt bull-rottweiler in the US population...which would account for the percentage of fatal attacks. 

 

If we're talking overall...you're about 200x more likely to be killed by over the counter aspirin than a pit bull.

[teef]

34 minutes ago, Gugny said:

 

My neighbor's black lab has some sort of very real anxiety problem.  If my neighbor is walking him, once he sees or hears people, he turns around and wants to go right home.  He won't even let me pet him.

 

they can get a bit strange.  i assume it's from all of the inbreeding.  our dog went the other route.  he was always great on walks, and once we started having kids, he gets aggressive acting.  he never bites or nips, but he will bark at people coming towards us, almost in a menacing way.  once you are up to him, he wags his tail and wants to be pet.

[Gugny]

1 minute ago, teef said:

they can get a bit strange.  i assume it's from all of the inbreeding.  our dog went the other route.  he was always great on walks, and once we started having kids, he gets aggressive acting.  he never bites or nips, but he will bark at people coming towards us, almost in a menacing way.  once you are up to him, he wags his tail and wants to be pet.

 

My dog (2nd generation Puggle) loves interacting with any human, cat or dog she sees.  She's very submissive to bigger dogs, but not necessarily fearful.  She walks by cats laying in their driveways/lawns, squirrels, rabbits, even deer ... just looks at them and keeps on walking.  People (especially kids), she will pull me toward.

 

She was attacked by a golden retriever years ago.  Totally unprovoked.  We were walking.  The good (I say that tongue in cheek) doctor left his gate open and this Golden came flying on a b-line, directly for my dog.  Chloe (my dog) immediately went down to the ground and this dog bit her and was going for more.  Growling, teeth showing.  Instinctively, I reached down and picked Chloe up.  Good ol' Chip came and retrieved his dog.  Not even the slightest attempt at an apology.  No dialogue whatsoever.  Just grabbed his dog and went home.  Effin' prick.

[teef]

3 minutes ago, Gugny said:

 

My dog (2nd generation Puggle) loves interacting with any human, cat or dog she sees.  She's very submissive to bigger dogs, but not necessarily fearful.  She walks by cats laying in their driveways/lawns, squirrels, rabbits, even deer ... just looks at them and keeps on walking.  People (especially kids), she will pull me toward.

 

She was attacked by a golden retriever years ago.  Totally unprovoked.  We were walking.  The good (I say that tongue in cheek) doctor left his gate open and this Golden came flying on a b-line, directly for my dog.  Chloe (my dog) immediately went down to the ground and this dog bit her and was going for more.  Growling, teeth showing.  Instinctively, I reached down and picked Chloe up.  Good ol' Chip came and retrieved his dog.  Not even the slightest attempt at an apology.  No dialogue whatsoever.  Just grabbed his dog and went home.  Effin' prick.

i'd be mortified if my dog when after another dog or person.  our dog is all show.  talks a big game and does nothing.  he's at the age where we can let him out into our yard, and he just hangs out.  that being said, if he ever does go crazy, leaves the yard and hurts another dog/person...i'm going to be the one to blame, and should be.  our dog does love other dogs and cats, but if there's deer, rabbit or fox around, he's gone.

[Gugny]

2 minutes ago, teef said:

i'd be mortified if my dog when after another dog or person.  our dog is all show.  talks a big game and does nothing.  he's at the age where we can let him out into our yard, and he just hangs out.  that being said, if he ever does go crazy, leaves the yard and hurts another dog/person...i'm going to be the one to blame, and should be.  our dog does love other dogs and cats, but if there's deer, rabbit or fox around, he's gone.

 

There is a family in our development that has lost track of their dog on at least 5 occasions.  It's a pit-mix of some sort.  Someone came knocking on my door one night (actually, it was New Year's Eve) and asked, "is this your dog?"  I said, "my dog's inside barking her ass off at this dog."

 

I'd recognized the dog as the one who'd been "lost," many times; but could not remember who the owners were.  The guy took off, with the dog, going door to door.  I looked at our neighborhood facebook group to see if I could find out where this dog was returned to one of the other times it was "lost."  Found it, ran and caught the guy (grabbed a couple IPAs first); gave him a beer and walked with him to the house.  They had no idea the dog was even missing.  This is the dead of ***** winter.

 

It wasn't even a month later, the same dog was in my garage when I stepped outside.  So I go grab Chloe's leash and hook the dog up to bring it to its owner.  She drove by my house, looking for the dog, so I got her attention.  Got the dog into the car and I told the girl that she really needs to do a better job watching her dog. 

 

Turns out the dude from New Year's Eve owns two pit bulls (yayyyy).  He "walks" them by riding his bike and they basically pull him.  Super nice guy, though.  Not thrilled about pit bulls in the neighborhood.  I feel like it should be in the Bylaws that there are none allowed.

[Augie]

1 hour ago, teef said:

i think i'd be more comfortable putting my face near a wood chipper than a pit bull.  

Even if the wood chipper isn’t on a leash?