Da webster guy Posted May 7, 2019 Posted May 7, 2019 To me he looks like the same size as he's always been. Have always liked him since he ripped up the senior bowl, and glad to see him coming on strong last year. Sad to see people still slamming Zay for his drops as a rookie. He overcame that nicely last year and I can't remember a single drop all season (maybe one). Stood out in the Miami game, knows how to keep moving and playing through the whistle, a good trait to have when you have a QB like Josh who can extend a drop back to five or six seconds. 1
Thurman#1 Posted May 7, 2019 Posted May 7, 2019 1 hour ago, White Linen said: Josh Allen made him look a little more competent last year. I'm not saying it's time to move on from Zay but it's time to move on from believing he's going to turn into anything special. He's a complimentary guy and he'll play a few more seasons in the NFL then be an afterthought. Nah. You simply don't know, no matter how much you think you do. That's certainly a legitimate guess you have there. But it is indeed a guess. Some WRs take huge steps at this time in their careers. Eric Moulds is a good example, though there are many more. Zay had more TDs and more yards last year alone than Moulds had in his first two years combined. Then the light came on for Moulds. Will it come on for Zay? Dunno. Nobody does, really.
BullBuchanan Posted May 7, 2019 Posted May 7, 2019 3 hours ago, ShadyBillsFan said: But but he sucks Fixed it.
LSHMEAB Posted May 7, 2019 Posted May 7, 2019 48 minutes ago, vincec said: Wait, so were Zay's numbers bad because Allen was poor or did Allen have poor numbers because the WRs dropped lots of balls? Or should we just blame the OL for both and say they both got screwed? Let's not pretend like Allen was terrific at getting the ball out on time and ball placement. There was a serious lack of receiver separation, but this is not an either or proposition. The receiving core and OL are improved. Josh has a year of experience under his belt. There is reason for optimism that both the QB and the surrounding cast will perform at a higher level.
Codyny13 Posted May 7, 2019 Posted May 7, 2019 I thought he was much better w the hands last year than his rookie year. I don’t get why nobody sees his progression. I can see 700-800 yards out of this kid depending on how much we throw.
Thurman#1 Posted May 7, 2019 Posted May 7, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, Alphadawg7 said: Agreed, it is debatable and the answer would not be unanimous no matter who someone picked out of Zay or Foster as best WR last year. But I would bet that the over whelming majority would say Foster was the better WR down the stretch than Zay. And IMO, that is the correct answer. We have very different definitions of "good player" the 2nd Half the season...especially since he was terrible in weeks 14, 15 and 16. He played 6 games with Allen to end the season. He was terrible in 4 of them. Had 2 "good" games against a bad Miami team, yet he also dropped a critical catch that was a perfect throw by Allen that was one of the main reasons we lost the first Miami game. So even in one of his "good" games, he came up short when the team needed him to make the play...again. All water under the bridge now though...its all on him to make the most of his chances and prove he is better than what he's been for 2 years. And yet again, he in no way was terrible those last three weeks. Had an unproductive 14th week, but he was very solid week 15 and downright excellent week 16, and I say that as a person who went back and watched much of those two games - with All-22 - over the last three days or so. He was open a lot, even when he wasn't getting thrown to, and he was making catches when he was thrown to. He had a very good last two weeks and improved a lot over the last seven games as compared to the first nine, which is what should be expected of a second-year guy who misses most of training camp and the off-season. We certainly agree, though, that he still has a lot of improvement necessary if he's going to be a successful pick. 58 minutes ago, vincec said: Wait, so were Zay's numbers bad because Allen was poor or did Allen have poor numbers because the WRs dropped lots of balls? Or should we just blame the OL for both and say they both got screwed? It's very true that the whole system had major problems and didn't work as well as it should have. Everyone on offense was less productive than they might have been when surrounded by better players. How much so - especially for each individual person - is a question, but it's clear the offense wasn't working well. That hurt everyone. Edited May 7, 2019 by Thurman#1
Mat68 Posted May 7, 2019 Posted May 7, 2019 Allen having all the meaningful reps over the spring and summer should result in better timing for the passing offense. Having better Wrs in the offense Jones should see more opportunities. What he does with them are on him. I expect Jones to be the most productive Wr next season. I think he will end up leading the team in catches and Tds.
Teddy KGB Posted May 7, 2019 Posted May 7, 2019 He can use those muscles to hold Brown, Beasley, Foster, and Sills bags 1
Lurker Posted May 7, 2019 Posted May 7, 2019 2 minutes ago, Thurman#1 said: Eric Moulds is a good example, though there are many more. Zay had more TDs and more yards last year alone than Moulds had in his first two years combined. Then the light came on for Moulds. Apples and pears. Jones had more targets in his second year alone (102) than Moulds had in his first two years combined (89). It's much more of a passing league today and Jones' production needs to be adjusted to what his contemporaries are putting up, not guys from twenty years ago. Eric Moulds Games Receiving Rushing Total Yds Year Age Tm Pos No. G GS Tgt Rec Yds Y/R TD Lng R/G Y/G Ctch% Y/Tgt Rush Yds TD Lng Y/A Y/G A/G Touch Y/Tch YScm RRTD Fmb AV 1996 23 BUF KR/wr 80 16 5 37 20 279 14.0 2 47 1.3 17.4 54.1% 7.5 12 44 0 11 3.7 2.8 0.8 32 10.1 323 2 1 3 1997 24 BUF KR/WR 80 16 8 52 29 294 10.1 0 32 1.8 18.4 55.8% 5.7 4 59 0 29 14.8 3.7 0.3 33 10.7 353 0 3 2 Zay Jones Games Receiving Rushing Total Yds Year Age Tm Pos No. G GS Tgt Rec Yds Y/R TD Lng R/G Y/G Ctch% Y/Tgt Rush Yds TD Lng Y/A Y/G A/G Touch Y/Tch YScm RRTD Fmb AV 2017 22 BUF WR 11 15 10 74 27 316 11.7 2 33 1.8 21.1 36.5% 4.3 27 11.7 316 2 0 3 2018 23 BUF WR 11 16 15 102 56 652 11.6 7 57 3.5 40.8 54.9% 6.4 1 0 0 0 0.0 0.0 0.1 57 11.4 652 7 1 5 1
NewEra Posted May 7, 2019 Posted May 7, 2019 With the OL of last year, it’s nearly impossible for any playmaker to look good and Zay looked alright to me. Not great, but alright. I expect more now that JA will have more time and we’re more comfortable with the Dabolls offense. He’s going to be a very noce conplimentary piece with Foster and Brown working the sidelines and Beasley over the middle along with the thought of JA running 5 minutes ago, Lurker said: Apples and pears. Jones had more targets in his second year alone (102) than Moulds had in his first two years combined (89). It's much more of a passing league today and Jones' production needs to be adjusted to what his contemporaries are putting up, not guys from twenty years ago. Eric Moulds Games Receiving Rushing Total Yds Year Age Tm Pos No. G GS Tgt Rec Yds Y/R TD Lng R/G Y/G Ctch% Y/Tgt Rush Yds TD Lng Y/A Y/G A/G Touch Y/Tch YScm RRTD Fmb AV 1996 23 BUF KR/wr 80 16 5 37 20 279 14.0 2 47 1.3 17.4 54.1% 7.5 12 44 0 11 3.7 2.8 0.8 32 10.1 323 2 1 3 1997 24 BUF KR/WR 80 16 8 52 29 294 10.1 0 32 1.8 18.4 55.8% 5.7 4 59 0 29 14.8 3.7 0.3 33 10.7 353 0 3 2 Zay Jones Games Receiving Rushing Total Yds Year Age Tm Pos No. G GS Tgt Rec Yds Y/R TD Lng R/G Y/G Ctch% Y/Tgt Rush Yds TD Lng Y/A Y/G A/G Touch Y/Tch YScm RRTD Fmb AV 2017 22 BUF WR 11 15 10 74 27 316 11.7 2 33 1.8 21.1 36.5% 4.3 27 11.7 316 2 0 3 2018 23 BUF WR 11 16 15 102 56 652 11.6 7 57 3.5 40.8 54.9% 6.4 1 0 0 0 0.0 0.0 0.1 57 11.4 652 7 1 5 Are there people that take the time to read that chart? Maybe it looks different on desktop, but on mobile, it’s a waste of time
Mrbojanglezs Posted May 7, 2019 Posted May 7, 2019 He looks like he has been training hard, good he should be. What he really should be doing is standing in front of a juggs machine set to max and catching balls all day.
formerlyofCtown Posted May 7, 2019 Posted May 7, 2019 3 hours ago, YoloinOhio said: He's only half naked this offseason. More improvement? 1
White Linen Posted May 7, 2019 Posted May 7, 2019 (edited) 28 minutes ago, Thurman#1 said: Nah. You simply don't know, no matter how much you think you do. That's certainly a legitimate guess you have there. But it is indeed a guess. Some WRs take huge steps at this time in their careers. Eric Moulds is a good example, though there are many more. Zay had more TDs and more yards last year alone than Moulds had in his first two years combined. Then the light came on for Moulds. Will it come on for Zay? Dunno. Nobody does, really. Of course it's my projection. You didn't really think I believe I can see the future, did you? I mean I could try to be more clear for you but I kind of thought that part was implied because, you know, no one can tell the future. Some WR's take huge steps at this time, yes - most don't. Eric Moulds is your only Bills example not just a good one. Edited May 7, 2019 by White Linen 1
formerlyofCtown Posted May 7, 2019 Posted May 7, 2019 1 hour ago, offyourocker said: I really hate that so many fans are negative about him. He really improved last season especially in the second half when he had more time time playing/practicing with Josh. I think he will break a 1000 this year. And for those who say he can’t create separation, I am not sure what Bills games you have been watching -399 receptions in 4 yearsFBS record -18 of the 50 games he played he put up at least 100yds -22 receptions in a single game against South Carolina Dont you understand these stats prove he cant catch and cant get seperation.?
Alphadawg7 Posted May 7, 2019 Posted May 7, 2019 53 minutes ago, Thurman#1 said: And yet again, he in no way was terrible those last three weeks. Had an unproductive 14th week, but he was very solid week 15 and downright excellent week 16, and I say that as a person who went back and watched much of those two games - with All-22 - over the last three days or so. He was open a lot, even when he wasn't getting thrown to, and he was making catches when he was thrown to. He had a very good last two weeks and improved a lot over the last seven games as compared to the first nine, which is what should be expected of a second-year guy who misses most of training camp and the off-season. We certainly agree, though, that he still has a lot of improvement necessary if he's going to be a successful pick. It's very true that the whole system had major problems and didn't work as well as it should have. Everyone on offense was less productive than they might have been when surrounded by better players. How much so - especially for each individual person - is a question, but it's clear the offense wasn't working well. That hurt everyone. He sucked in New England. No amount of spin can change that. A meaningless garbage touchdown on final play of a 3 score blow out does not equate to a good game. 1
Saxum Posted May 7, 2019 Posted May 7, 2019 3 hours ago, Hapless Bills Fan said: Is this intentional "salt shaking"? One of the primary beefs around here is that Smith-Schuster hit >70% of his catches for 917 yds during his rookie season, while Zay was struggling to catch just over 1/3 of his targets for 316 yds, after we traded up to take him ahead of Smith-Schuster. He was drafted due to heavy recommendation of WR Coach Phil McGeoghan. McGeoghan did not have much experience coaching in NFL being an assistant coach for Miami for 2 seasons before being promoted to WR coach for a year there. There was quite a bit of criticism from players in Miami of his coaching ability. He lost that job and went back to college at East Carolina where Zay Jones played. He was signed early as WR coach and recommended Jones (Coach McD mentioned he had lot of experience with him and recommended him) but McGeoghan did not have a lot of experience developing WRs. Coach McD met him when working for Panthers. Zay had trouble adjusting to NFL and McGeoghan did not seem to be able to help him. McGeoghan was allowed to look for another position with a number of coaches first year and I was surprised he was picked up by Anthony Lynn. While I am glad that Coach McD terminated coaches who were not performing well this year and previous year if he had taken more time and not made hasty signings of new coaches to build his staff in first place there would not be so much turnover. There were a number of good coaches on Rex's staff (no not his brother) he could have kept and would have cut down on the development time of some of the players. As coach: Maine (2007) Wide receivers coach & tight ends coach Navy Prep (2008) Offensive coordinator South Florida (2009–2011) Wide receivers coach Miami Dolphins (2012–2014) Assistant wide receivers coach Miami Dolphins (2015) Wide receivers coach East Carolina (2016) Wide receivers coach Buffalo Bills (2017) Wide receivers coach Los Angeles Chargers (2018–present) Wide receivers coach
Warcodered Posted May 7, 2019 Posted May 7, 2019 19 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said: He sucked in New England. No amount of spin can change that. A meaningless garbage touchdown on final play of a 3 score blow out does not equate to a good game. ? he was the leading WR in both games and scored the only TD against them last year. I mean he might not of been good I guess but who the hell was in those games?
Alphadawg7 Posted May 7, 2019 Posted May 7, 2019 7 minutes ago, Warcodered said: ? he was the leading WR in both games and scored the only TD against them last year. I mean he might not of been good I guess but who the hell was in those games? Thats a fair statement, plenty of people stunk for sure, not just Zay. But the difference is, no one is trying to spin everyone else’s bad performances into a “good” one because of some meaningless final play of the game.
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